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Messages - Bored 3L

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Current Law Students / Re: Should I drop out?
« on: January 16, 2007, 08:32:05 PM »
You're sooo right...he should just drop out. ::)

Sorry you're bitter with your experience. Not everyone else should be.

I think that perhaps he should drop out.  But really he should look at his situation, his potential earning potential, etc.

And I"m not bitter at all.  I did very well in law school, passed the bar, and now work in biglaw.  Going to law school was a good choice for me, and financially it's been great -- no other way could I be making as much money at my age (maybe a few other ways, admittedly, but not many).  I'm just trying to be realistic.  People should realize that not everyone in their class will get good jobs and their debt isn't going away.

Current Law Students / Re: Should I drop out?
« on: January 16, 2007, 07:58:31 PM »

Just because you're currently in the bottom 25% of the class doesn't mean squat. It was one semester - so what? You can still try out for moot court and mock trial. And you can still write onto journals. These things can make up for a less than stellar GPA. Further, you've got another 2 and a half years to pull up your average.

This may or may not be true.  At some schools you can't try out for journals or moot court if your gpa is below a certain point.

And he/she has another 2.5 years, but most people's final gpa is pretty similar to their first-year gpa.

Also keep in mind that you still have better opportunities ahead of you if you graduate in the bottom quater of the class than someone who doesn't graduate at all. So what if you're not making 100k a year straight out of lawschool? It'll still be better than making 35k a year or less when you drop out. You're earning potential is more than enough with a JD to pay off those student loans.

How do you know that the OP's earning potential is better w/a JD?  Contrary to popular belief, getting a JD does not always = higher salary.  Plus, OP will have 120k in debt.

That's the problem with most people on this board (and especially the kiddie board) - they think too much in the short term. You'll make a lot more money over a lifetime with a JD versus just a BA. And you don't have to tell people that you're a quiter.

Again, who knows. OP could drop out, go into business, and do something far more lucrative.  Statistically, most attorneys aren't making a killing.

5 years after lawschool no one will care about your class rank. All they will care about is what you've done as a lawyer. A class rank will only get you so far in your career.

For one, some employers will care about grades for a long time, maybe past five year, maybe not, but it's part of your record.  But really, your grades will heavily influence your first few jobs out of law school, and these jobs will, as you point out, have a longer term effect.

Finally: You know what they call the person that graduated last in his class? An Attorney.

If they pass the bar.

Current Law Students / Re: Should I drop out?
« on: January 16, 2007, 07:01:01 PM »
It depends on your goals.  Really there is no one-size-fits-all advice here.

Personally, if I were you I would drop out after this year if your grades don't improve unless you're confident you'll really enjoy the practice of law.  And by that I mean really enjoy the day-to-day mundane (to me) details that make up the practice of law, and not just the idea of practicing law. 

I think you need to find out how much the average student in the bottom of the class makes, comprate that to your anticipated debt, and think about your quality of living.  Also consider whether you'd enjoy the kinds of jobs that are open to people in the bottom of the class.  Most people who graduate in the bottom 25% of schools in that range end up doing insurance defense, document review, or other jobs they don't particularly enjoy.  Clearly most people who don't enjoy their work, don't make much money, and are heavily in debt aren't particularly happy.

Now, just b/c you're in the bottom 25% now doesn't mean you'll graduate in the bottom 25%.  But, if after the first year you're still around the bottom 25%, and you made a real effort to bring your grades up in your second semester, you'll probably graduate near the bottom of the class.  Most people tend to stay around the class rank they had at the end of their first year in my experience.

Current Law Students / Re: Summer Associate
« on: January 15, 2007, 12:40:59 PM »
Is it better to apply for summer associate jobs after 1L or 2L. I am confused about the sequence. If a student is offered a job after 1L summer, what do they do for the next summer? Do firms prefer 2Ls over 1Ls?

1Ls usually don't get permanent offers, they get offers to return as summer associates the next summer.

Firms vastly prefer 2Ls.  Unless you go to a top schoool or have something else going for you, it will be very difficult to work at a large firm as a 1L.

Current Law Students / Re: Legal Writing Grade
« on: January 14, 2007, 11:13:56 AM »
Legal writing is obviously important, but really what's the most important is your cumulative GPA.  So, base your effort in that class on how many credits its worth.

Current Law Students / Re: Barbri worth it?
« on: January 14, 2007, 11:07:39 AM »
The thing is I don't know where I will practice, I am considering NYC as well as Chicago, does it change anything for Barbri?

No, that probably doesn't change anything.  You will most likely take barbri no matter what bar you take, though there are some competing NY programs.

I took barbri and passed on my first attempt.  I would def. recommend taking the classes rather than just studying from the books, because the classes provide you with structure, graded exams, etc. 

I would probably sign up now if I were you, unless you're confident you'll get a job in biglaw (large law firms will pay for barbri).

I just received my grades. All C's 2.0 flat. I am wondering if this is all worth it. My school curve is a 2.7. I know I can do much better but I am wondering if it is worth it to continue. I was planning on withdrawing due to family issues but I thought I could handle everything. Clearly, I was wrong. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks

Depends on your goals.  If you want to work at a large firm, for example, then you should realize that that's no longer possible, and you should drop out if you couldn't be happy in a different practice setting.  More generally, you should talk to career services and discuss your realistic job options, then decide if those appeal to you.  Assuming you decide to stay in school, obviously you should take a closer look at your study habbits, speak to your professors about your exams, etc.

Well, I dont do a lot of transactional work at my firm, but several of my friends do and I considered doing corporate work as well.  For reference, I'm now an attorney at a large firm.

Due diligence is mind numbingly boring, but in my opinion not as bad as document review in litigation, and litigators often do more doc review than corporate attorneys do due diligence.

Basically, you will be drafting deal documents, and by drafting I mean finding similar documents and cutting and pasting terms from other documents, using control find to replace the proper names, etc.   You will also be tasked with mundane chores like arranging docs for settlement, etc.

Bar Exam Preparation / Re: practicing in DC
« on: October 21, 2006, 12:59:48 PM »
There are two schools of thought on this.

1. Take VA or MD, because some DC firms like to have their lawyers barred in the surrounding states, and if you decide you want to stay in the DC area but not work in DC, you have more options, especially in Northern Virginia.  This is what I did (took VA and recently learned that I passed, to my relief).

2. Take the bar in whatever state you're most likely to return to if you decide you don't like DC.  This is what I'd recommend for most people. 

Current Law Students / Re: State of the job market...
« on: October 20, 2006, 06:04:43 PM »
hahaha well

i guess that leaves me with only one conclusion...

The only set of objective data I'm aware of points to a strong market.  Take from it what you will. 

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