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Messages - avvocato

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Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Pitt Visit
« on: December 16, 2005, 08:37:55 AM »
Such a helpful thread!  Thanks esp. avvocato!

You're welcome!

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Pitt Visit
« on: November 07, 2005, 07:53:14 AM »
Temple GPA and LSAT averages are higher too.  I think its harder to get in.

Anyone have any idea about my chances of getting into PITT.  156 Lsat and 3.16 GPA. As for the intangibles - I went to a pretty good undergraduate school and have 4 years of work experience. 

I think the four years of work experience definitely moves you much closer towards the 'non-traditional' category, and that kind of experience will work in your favor. I wouldn't worry too much about your numbers... you should have a good shot at Pitt.

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Pitt Visit
« on: November 02, 2005, 07:51:40 AM »
I was wondering if any one would be able to compare Pitt and Temple?  How does Pitt place in Philly compared to Temple?

I wondered the same thing last year when I was working on apps, and I actually applied to both schools. I'm at Pitt now (so this might be favorably biased, but Temple still rocks!), so I have shed some light on what I know about the each. The obvious info is that Pitt is ranked higher than Temple...but rankings aren't everything so you have evaluate the schools beyond the numbers. Some other info:

Tuition - Both have resident/ non-resident rates, but it will cost you more in tuition to go to Pitt than @ Temple. However...

Living expenses - It is cheaper to live in Pittsburgh than Philly, so in the end, you almost end up paying the same total for housing + tuition at either school. I don't know what the average rental rates are in Philly, but in Pittsburgh law students can easily get GREAT 1BDs for $550-$750 range. Transportation is also included in your tuition, so all you have to do is flash your student ID to ride any bus in the county.

Diversity- Temple has a higher % of minorities than Pitt, but I don't believe the difference spans beyond 10%. The difference in gender is also minimal, but I believe Temple's female % is also higher.

Study abroad - from what I understand Pitt Law is not participating anymore in the semester at sea (I head some story about a large wave hitting the boat last year and causing probs, so I guess the school doesn't want to take on the liability...?). But they still have excellent services to get students set up with summer/semester abroad progs. Temple has a strong int'l studies program as well. Some of the locations offered by the school include Tokyo, Beijing, and Ireland.

Special programs - Temple offers programs for areas of specialization in: Trial Advocacy, Business and Tax Law, International Law, Intellectual Property & Technology, and Public Interest Law. They also offer a variety of clinical edu. progs. Pitt has a variety of certificate programs, including: Civil Lit,, Enviro Law Science and Policy, Intellectual Property and Tech Law, Int'l and Comparative Law, and Health Law (ranked #11 on USN). They also offer 7-unit clinical progs. with the Enviro Law Clinic, Civil Practice Clinic, Health Law Clinic, and Elder law clinic (the Elder Law clinic is one of only a few in the country).

Bar passage - Both schools exceed the state's passage rate for first time bar takers.

Jobs/ Show me the money - Grads from either school will obviously place well in their respective cities. Pitt grads also place very well in Philly (among other Mid-Atlantic cities), so in my opinion being at Pitt gives you the best of both worlds because Pitt grads have a lot of advantages in the Pittsburgh legal market, but can also move east and still find many opportunities.

Upside/Downside of locations -
Upside Pittsburgh - Has a small town feel, but you're still in a city. Grads only have to compete with Duquesne students, so finding a job locally isn't a tough gig.
Downside Pittsburgh - Not as exciting as some of the other large cities throughout the country (in terms of things to do, etc). But I suppose this isn't a bad thing when you want as few distractions as possible.

Upside Temple - Lots to do in the city, and you're in a larger job market. You're also closer to nearby cities like Baltimore and DC so if you find opportunities in the summer or school year, it's not too hard to get over to other cities. And in general there's a lot more going on in the city when compared with Pittsburgh.
Downside Temple - Things are a little more costly and there are more fun distractions of a big city. Grads also have Penn students to compete with in the local market.

So hope this info helps a little bit. Oh and how did I choose between the two, you wonder? Well fate made the decision for me - Temple was one of the schools I was rejected from, while Pitt admitted me w/ $$. go figure. But I think I would have been ultimately happy even if the situation had been reversed. Anyways, take a look at both and see which school meets your own needs... but you might end up like me, with fate making the final decision.

Good luck!!

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Pitt Visit
« on: October 30, 2005, 12:30:49 PM »
This summer I attended CLEO and it was hosted and run by Pitt Law.  I lived on Pitt's campus for six weeks.  We had Pitt professors who taught our classes, and used the Pitt facilities.  I was incredibly impressed.  I learned A LOT from my Professors at Pitt (more so than some of my Professors at Duke).  I had Dean Deasy and Professor Wasserman for Civ Pro, and Dean Jones for Crim Law.  My Legal Writing Professor was Brostoff.  I don't know if they teach the same for CLEO as they do for their regular law classes, but they made everything understandable and the academic success of the students was a huge priority to them.  They were all approachable (not the least bit intimidating), and I never worried about the Socratic Method in their classes, because they treat the students like humans.  I really liked the library and the student area in the basement.  From what I could tell of the Pitt Law students, they were a really diverse group (which I think improves a law school's environment immensely) and were very accomplished.  I loved the atmosphere of the law school.  About Pitt (the city), I wasn't entirely too impressed.  The law school is located in Oakland, which is not the nicest area of the city.  However, if you choose to live on the other side of Carnegie Mellon, the area is much nicer.  I really enjoyed Shadyside, a lot, too.  The bus system wasn't that bad from those areas to the law school.  If you want something within walking distance, you will either live in a not nice area, or walk far.  I would suggest walking far.  We were housed in the Towers, and it was incredibly suffocating to live in an area where there was not a lot to do within walking distance.  Living that close to the hospitals was noisy and took some getting used to.  And again, it was not the best of areas.  The nightlife in Pittsburgh kinda sucked.  Everyone says not to worry about a town's nightlife because you will do nothing but study when you are in law school.  I'm sorry, but everyone needs a break every once in will go insane if you do nothing but study.  I really prefered the small bars to the clubs, and Pittsburgh has a lot of good small bars.  I think that's about it.  If anyone has any questions, let me know.

You are completely right about your classroom experience at Pitt. The professors are approachable and I feel like I've learned so much in only a few months. The school also has a good amount of certificate programs, so I'm definitely going to incorporate that into my studies at the law school. The library is GREAT, with there are lots of places to study, and the professor's offices are in the library which makes it covenient to drop in a see anyone if you have questions. The library also has a Stabucks lounge, so it's nice to be able to pop in for some coffee/snacks without having to pack up all your stuff to go out of the building.

As for the living situation... most of the undergrads live in Oakland, while the graduate students and young professionals live farther away from campus in Shadyside and Squirrel Hill (near Carnegie Mellon). Those neighborhoods are much nicer and very quiet, and only about a 15 minute bus ride to campus. Oakland is lower in cost, but the area isn't as nice and kind of has an animal house/ undergrad feel to it. (Not that this is bad, but adequate sleep in a precious commodity in law school!!) And yes, Oakland is closer to the hospitals so I wouldn't recommend living over there because you'll hear all the ambulances and helicopters moving about all the time. The towers where you stayed in the summer only house undergrads, so law students have to arrange for their own housing.

The nightlife in Pittsburgh isn't as posh as what you would find in other cities like L.A. or NY, but considering that I've spend a majority of my time with my nose in all my casebooks, I'm not really conerned about that. And, most law students don't have the extra cash to blow in upscale clubs with $20 covers and $15 drinks, know what I mean? Sure the clubs in Pittsburgh could be better, but we don't go to law school to go clubbing, right? But the law students still find time to take breaks and go out, whether someone is having a party or if they are heading out away from the campus. There are a variety of clubs down in "The Strip District" and also on the South Side (a lot of clubs don't have covers, or if they do, it's often less than $10 to get in). There are also lots of local bars in the Shadyside/ Squirrel Hill area where young folks hang out. The students also go out for "Bar Review" once a week on Thursdays, and just kinda chill out before the weekend starts. Yes, the bars are not ultra glam or anything, but not all of them are dive bars either... I have to admit, it's a nice change to go out and get $1-2 dollar beers, and it's rare to find mixed drinks running beyond $4 bucks.

Good luck with your apps, and feel free to continue to post questions if anyone has any.....

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Pitt Visit
« on: October 30, 2005, 09:24:52 AM »

How well does Pitt place outside of Pittsburgh? I'm considering the school, but I don't know if I want to stay in Pittsburgh. Would it be difficult to find work in NYC, Philly, Boston, or Chicago?

Pitt places great in Pittsburgh, well in Philly and DC, and okay in NY. I doubt it has much impact in Boston or Chicago unless one is top 10%. To be frank, top jobs in Boston, NY, and Chicago will probly be fought over by the better local schools in each respective market (Northeastern's, Brooklyn's, and Loyola's) and t14 grads. Unless you can get into a top 14-20 (or higher), I would recommend attending a school in the city you want to be in. Best of luck!

The other thing to keep in mind is that many Pitt grads start out working in Pittsburgh for a few years and then move on to other cities. This is a great option and wise move, considering that it is pretty easy for Pitt grads to line up great positions with firms, where they can get solid work experience before moving on to other cities and regions. Additionally, the cost of living in Pittsburgh is lower than other major cities, so this also gives recent grads a chance to eliminate student debt while remaining in Pittsburgh. If you can get in with a good firm and get some solid work experience during your first few years out of law school, you should be able to move around with ease later on, since employers are going to be looking more at your work experience by that point.

Law School Admissions / Re: U of Pitt Complete Notices
« on: October 30, 2005, 08:37:53 AM »
Well its been about a month and I have heard nothing regarding going complete. I checked LSN and people that submitted after me have already gone complete. Does anyone know if U of Pitt gives complete notices through the mail or through email? Is it time to email the school?

Hi I'm  a 1L @ Pitt... when I applied, they contacted me via email. But you can always give them a call just to follow up. The admissions staff is awesome and very friendly. (That may not seem like a big deal, but I remember being shocked in seeing the difference between schools when I would contact various admissions offices. Some acted like I was bothering them when I'd inquire about my app, while others were ready and willing to make sure all my questions were answered....)

Hmmm, not sure how that smiley face got next to U Pitt. Maybe it's a sign.

.... it could very well be a sign. ;D Good luck with your apps! Let us know how things work out!

Hi all,
  My schools are :



Considering that you're a non-trad w/ a great LSAT score, I'd still take a stab at Cal (and Columbia). It would seem wiser to submit your app @Cal and let them tell you no, then to save $70-some bucks and never know if you had a chance.

You sound like you have a good shot at your "goal" schools. As for your safties, I'd still apply to American and Pitt, since they are in areas where you'd perhpas like to live AND you'll prob get a decent $$$ offer from both schools, considering your background.

Good luck!!

Any ladies picked up this bag:

I'm thinking of getting the one in black...

Any likes, dislikes? Is it padded enough?

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