Law School Discussion

Nine Years of Discussion
;

Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Messages - blocke123

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 8 9 10 ... 25
41
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: My trip to Iowa
« on: May 02, 2006, 03:19:17 PM »
Iowa city is really cute; Kent has me deferred?? Seriously people, it's may, make up your mind. I can think of ten million more things I would rather do this summer than wait for waitlists and deferrals :)
[/quote]

Would you go to Kent if they took you off their Deferral list? If so, why?

42
Yeah... I used to play the game where I'd talk to others who had graduated from lower ranked schools for their UG and make fun of them.  I honestly thought that I had gotten a great deal better education just because of US News&WR.  I've worked with a T3 who is one of the smartest people I know, and I've worked with 2 T1's who are complete morons. 


Besides that, a lot of people I know think that lower ranked schools like TCU or SMU are better just because they're private.  UG's are UG's.  Ivy gets you a little more clout.  However, law school and graduate schools are horses of a different color as far as education and as far as potential careers.

People say that it won't matter in 20 years, and that it'll all depend on your career history.  The problem with that is your career history (i.e. your first couple of jobs) is determined by the school you went to.  Does this not strike anyone as not making any sense?

Not sure if this was directed at me... however, I don't think anyone is making fun of someone's undergrad.  The rest of this is confusing... can you elaborate?

43
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: My trip to Iowa
« on: May 02, 2006, 01:50:42 PM »
If public transportion is running, schools stay open is the general rule of thumb.

True, I'm just stating what I've seen.  NC cancels school (and so does CT to a lesser extent) when it snows while in all the years of schooling in Chicago it closed once.

44
Quote
U of I

another reason it seems like you're straight out of undergrad.  No one outside of your state realizes if you're talking about Idaho, Indiana, Iowa, or Illionis.

See above when I reference UIUC which most people in this board refer to as University of Illinois UC... I will take care to repeat specify. 

UIUC is regarded as a great public school not simply because i have stated so but by reputation and rankings.  Whatever your view of USNews rankings UIUC is considered a good school.

I restate my position that it does matter where you graduate undergrad and several corporations have only limited ability to recruit and so would not waste their time at schools without some reputation.  While I admit those reputations may not follow USNews rankings, there definitely is a difference between various schools.

45
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: My trip to Iowa
« on: May 02, 2006, 01:38:24 PM »
The biggest obstacle for my southern friends moving to the north is that stores, offices, schools do not close during snowfall.

Office and schools do close during snowfall.

Not in Chicago.  Not usually in the other states (I've lived for short periods of time in Michigan and CT)..  CT residents seem to freak out a bit when it snows but most if not all work.  In NC everything shuts down.

46
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: My trip to Iowa
« on: May 02, 2006, 01:33:09 PM »
Blocke123,

I thought you'd decided on Kent? As I recall, your major issue is whether or not Iowa places in Chicago, is that correct?

greengrl,

You just mentioned driving in snow. I hope its not too hard, I've never done it before. I suppose I can worry about that later after I've found a place to live and started going to class, haha.





I haven't decided on either quite yet (see earlier comments).  However, Iowa and Kent are the contender.  I still haven't decided which one will place better in Chicago.  I'm inclined to attend Iowa because of their ranking vs. Kent Law.  Kent would be easier and my wife really wants to live in Chicago.  One thing we are going to check is salary for my wife... if she can get 20k better in Chicago its worth going to a lower ranked school and making myself get into the top 10% rather than going to Iowa and trying to get into the top 30%.  

Also, driving in snow is difficult.  When I grew up in Chicago so driving in snow for everyone I knew was second nature.  In fact I LEARNED how to drive in snow.  When I lived in NC I realized that most people can not drive in snow (even in CT it seems they have never learned).  The biggest obstacle for my southern friends moving to the north is that stores, offices, schools do not close during snowfall.

47
Fair enough trog.  Point taken.

However, I do think it is extremely hyped up as to the importance of going to a good UG.  Especially in terms of the cost. It simply isn't worth $100K to end up with a job paying $40-50K to start (and that is on the higher end than many entry-level positions).

I understand, and I was lucky to have such a good public school in my state to attend for undergrad.  I think differences in school quality are overhyped, and often blindly accepted as "conventional wisdom," but that does not, to me, make all UG educations equal.

While its not a sole contributing factor the UG you go to is a factor for the FIRST JOB out of college.  In fact it is a huge factor, this is from someone who has been out in the field for four years.  The year I graduated the UG I went to made a difference (UIUC) but after two years of glowing reviews at a major corporation known for its reputation, no one even asks where I went to.

That's all I'm saying.  All the lawyers I ask say it does matter where you go if you want to go into private law, with diminishing returns after a few years in the profession.

This is outright wrong.  I have been out for three years as well and you are sitting here telling me where you go to UG matters for your first job while I sit behind my cushy desk in the job I received after graduation.  I went to a state school and did alright, nothing amazing.  Don't make broad generalizations when you can't back them up.

Law school is a different story.  It will always matter to some extent.  Just more so earlier than later after graduation.

Trog. are you from DC?  You realize you could have gotten in-state tuition in any state, right?  Its one of the benefits of taxation without representation.

You asked that I not make broad generalizations... yet your only response has been that you have a good job.  As do I.  I graduated from the U of I a state institution, but mind you a GREAT strate institution.  Its very well regarded especially in engineering.  My school was visited by many large corporations who could only attend a few schools for business and engineering.  They picked UIUC, Georgia Tech MIT etc. 

Again, as I am said, after a few years of working hard it really doesn't make a damn bit of difference where you went to school.  However, fresh out of school, companies can only visit a limited number of schools and favor an even narrower set of schools.

48
Fair enough trog.  Point taken.

However, I do think it is extremely hyped up as to the importance of going to a good UG.  Especially in terms of the cost. It simply isn't worth $100K to end up with a job paying $40-50K to start (and that is on the higher end than many entry-level positions).

I understand, and I was lucky to have such a good public school in my state to attend for undergrad.  I think differences in school quality are overhyped, and often blindly accepted as "conventional wisdom," but that does not, to me, make all UG educations equal.

While its not a sole contributing factor the UG you go to is a factor for the FIRST JOB out of college.  In fact it is a huge factor, this is from someone who has been out in the field for four years.  The year I graduated the UG I went to made a difference (UIUC) but after two years of glowing reviews at a major corporation known for its reputation, no one even asks where I went to.

That's all I'm saying.  All the lawyers I ask say it does matter where you go if you want to go into private law, with diminishing returns after a few years in the profession.

49
How are we defining success?
If you want to be an academic then where you went to school is of overwhelming importance.

If you want a job in corporate law then where you want to school is extremely significant.

Want to do family law, criminal defense, certain areas of state/local gov't, mid-size to small firms then where you went to school is very helpful but not of overwhelming value particularly when you talk about specialized areas where it's more important that you know about X topic with Y connections than where you went to school.

If we're talking pure money terms then school is very important but I think you're most likely to find people on the extreme money end from lesser schools since the lawyers who make the most are often plaintiff attorneys but being a successful plaintiff attorney on that type of scale is essentially like being a major league baseball player, i.e. one success out of thousands of failures.

Also the comparison to undergraduate schools isn't useful since a lot of those studies showing the value of school do it from a monetary perspective. This makes sense to a degree but people don't tell teenagers that majoring in medieval literature at Princeton is vastly important for them to make money instead of getting an accounting degree at Rice or something.

What school you attend makes a huge difference when you first graduate law school.  I can't imagine a law firm thinking that they would rather hire a University of Idaho grad over Yale.  However, after your first job that "where you went to school" question gets thrown out.  Your school will put you in a position (through OCI) and prestige to get you in the door but your skills and work ethic will allow you to succeed.

FYI- for college, this applies to undergraduate as well.  Its very hard to get a job when you haven't been able to interview on campus unless you have connections or you have had a few years of experiance.  I got hired is 2002 so maybe the recession made me more cynical.

50
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: My trip to Iowa
« on: May 02, 2006, 08:48:09 AM »
great review!

having spent some time in parts of west texas (and even some parts of houston) the ruralness isn't a big deal for me. i've shared the road with a horse on a few occasions, so a tractor isn't a huge deal...

the HOUSING however is a big deal...

run-down. does that mean just old? not well-kept? dilapidated? can you elaborate?

i might need to actually go and visit first before i decide where to live. yikes, i was hoping to be able to avoid that, but oh well.

again, great review. thanks for posting it.


I was totally going to PM you but I've been working almost non stop since I got back from Iowa. Housing is going to be a definite issue I think. I'm signed up for an apartment in the University Apts but they are just SO run down; they look old and institutional and just generally not so great. I will be up in the next few weeks to find some housing; hopefully we can find something a little nicer. I really want to avoid having to drive to school, though, so in that case I might just be stuck living there. There were also a lot of kids toys and I think there are a lot of families that live there which is bad bad bad for students trying to study. I dont' like kids--sorry, I like quiet. So I gotta figure that part out

Otherwise the school seems great

Cheer up!
I came from a poor family and beleive me, I have lived in some of the worst apartments known to mankind.  And generally, I would be willing to live a shithole for three years just to save money, so I will have more freedom at choosing diff. career path down the road. 
Three years is a long time, but it will pass. 

Yiplong you are right; I didnt' mean to sound like a "princess" I was just a little less than impressed. I think I"m just overwhelmed by the process in general--too many second thoughts.

We'll for sure miss you at Iowa--you seem super cool.


Greengrl...

What kind of placement questions did you ask?  Are you planning on working in Chicago after you leave?  I know there are nice townhouses esp in cedar rapids so that is always an option by the way just an FYI...

Also, maybe I'll see you there.  I haven't decided on Kent or Iowa yet..

Woo hoo; always eager for another person to join the Iowa train. Honestly I was really impressed with the school. placement was just what I expected; you'll work almost indefinitely within a 500 mile radius of Iowa; farther is always possible (everything is possible) but the reputation of the school will dissipate the farther you go. Duh. Chicago is an option; I'm not sure that it will make sense for me to return here but yes, if you want to work in Chicago you have the opportunity.

Cedar Rapids, hu? I really don't want to put a necessary car ride between me and school; I like the idea of being on a bus line




There is a website you can access for housing in Iowa.  I think you can access it from the main webpage.  I"m a little concerned about the housing situation myself.  However, if you truly want a better option (quality) then if Iowa is anything like UIUC you want to be at least a little off campus.

Also, what other schools did you get into?

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 8 9 10 ... 25