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Messages - Janna116

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General Board / Re: Just federal financial aid??
« on: July 29, 2005, 11:56:04 AM »
Most schools frown on working at all during your 1L year unless you are part time or have extenuating circumstances.  Can you get by on federal loans? Sure, if your total school tuition and living expenses falls around 18,500.  You may be surprised about whether or not you qualify for private loans.  You should really talk to Northstar or Access Group (two large private student loan lenders and see what their opinion is.) These private lenders give you money based on your expected future income.  I just got more than 40 grand for this coming 2L year and I don't have any income.  No way would a normal person qualify for 40 grand with no job.  Also, talk to the financial aid office or admissions office at the school where you were accepted.  They may be able to offer some advice or point you in the right direction.  You can't be the only person who wanted to go to law school and who had bad credit.  The admissions and financial aid offices are often overlooked but they are rich resources of information.  After all, the school can't operate unless it gets your money, lol.


Pointless Arguments / Re: Who here actually likes the law?
« on: July 29, 2005, 01:03:34 AM »
Hilarious, if you don't think this is funny, save this post, go to law school, finish one semester and then read this'll be laughing you a$$ off.... and I have a dog and during exams I found myself saying things to her like, "you'll love me even if I only barely pass this class," or reading Federal Rules of Civil Procedure to her.  Her little furry head would look at me and cock to one side and I would say, "Yeah me either Penny, me either."  You don't have to need therapy to lose your mind in law just happens....

General Board / Re: Ladies- where are you suit shopping?
« on: July 29, 2005, 12:44:54 AM »
I have suits from Sears, Hechts, Ann Taylor Loft and Petite Sophisticate(which is the petite part of Casual Corner.)  Now I am trying to remember.  The cheapest suit I bought was a seperates skirt suit from Hechts, around 50 dollars.  The suits from Sears were around 80 and the Petite Sophisticate were around 150.  Ann Taylor was most expensive but in my opinion, nicest at around 240. 

All the suits are petite, I am only 5'2" and all are seperates because I am a different sized top from bottom.  Petite Sophisticate/ Casual Corner has gold/silver collections in which you can mix and match pants, skirts and jackets and Ann Taylor carries their dyelot over each year, which you can check on the tag and this allows you to mix peices as styles change without having to keep rebuying a whole new wardrobe. 

As far as colors, I would definitely have a navy or black suit for interviews, also I was told that you should wear a skirt to interviews and even court as that is considered formal and a pantsuit on women is more casual.  I know, how archaic, but you don't want to make a bad impression because the interviewer didn't think you were serious because his firm considers pansuits on women casual and he took your pantsuit to mean you thought the interview was casual.  Thinking about things like this are enough to drive you crazy.  Also, depending on the market you want to work in, you may have to say goodbye to color and by color I mean anything not black, navy or gray, including colored stripes.  Bottom line, the law is a conservative profession (for the most part) and if you are only going to buy one suit buy a dark suit rather than the tan one with the blue stripes on sale.  Sounds awful but Ann Taylor had a really pretty, fit like a glove tan suit with white and blue stripes on sale last summer and I almost bought it, but at that time I was thinking that I was only going to buy one suit.  It was pretty but I was warned by a woman, who happended to be in the dressing room, whose daughter was a lawyer that that suit was for casual Friday only.


General Board / Re: President of my Law School student senate?
« on: July 29, 2005, 12:27:59 AM »
Mary, it would help if we knew which school you were admitted to as it is probably different at each school.  Since we don't know, I'll answer you like you're going to my school,

At Wake we don't have a "Senate", the student government is called the Student Bar Association.  1Ls are elected to the SBA in the fall but only as class reps, (now I'm thinking and I think there are two per class year, can't remember for sure though.) Anyway, the rest of the positions are elected in the spring, so 1Ls run twice in the same school year.  Only 2Ls and 3Ls can hold officer positions, which a 1L can run for in the spring to hold office the following fall.  I don't know anything about the personal background of our officers.  I'm sure some of them held offices in undergrad or HS but then again, maybe some of them didn't.  In my opinion, running for any kind of class office is pretty much a popularity contest, but that isn't much different than State and Federal offices. (No I didn't run and lose, I am just stating my opinion.)  Good or bad, make enough friends and you'll probably get the votes.

Where should I go next fall? / Re: Competitiveness?
« on: July 29, 2005, 12:07:04 AM »

is known to be the most uncompetitive LS. The students all help eachother and the profs dont try the bait and switch as they do at most other schools. The students are much more willing to help out and to hang out on weekends. It is the only LS that I have heard Alums call fun.

Which school are you talking about? Just curious.

Book sales, auctions, trades, etc. / Re: are all case books the same?
« on: July 28, 2005, 12:18:17 AM »
I'm not sure I understand the question, if you mean "are the textbooks in the store the same as the (same title, same editors) textbook on, then I would assume so, except for some highlighting or underlining.  If you are asking whether Criminal Law by Phillips, Johnson and Cloud is different than Criminal law by Kaplan, Weisberg and Binder, the answer would be yes.  Sure, in every subject there are cases that would be in every textbook (nearly every law student is going to read Palsgraf in Torts), but like bulletproof said, the cases could be edited differently, that is the same 45 page case could have been edited down to 12 pages in one book but only 10 pages in another.  The case would generally be the same but most importantly (and this might go for different editions of the same book as well) a certain line, or list of facts or the holding, etc will most certainly be on a different page or a different part of the page.  I can't count the number of times, and certain profs liked to ask this more than others, but, I can't count the number of times that a prof would ask, "where did you find that, or can you tell us what page that is on?  If you have a different book or if you are reading Lexis or Westlaw to read the case directly, you won't be able to answer that type of question.  I know it sounds silly but the prof wants an answer to his questions, especially something as easy as, "what page is that on."  If you are trying to save money, you will probably be able to find most of your books used on Amazon or the like, and I'm sure your 2L and 3L classmates would be more than happy to sell you their books, my school has a used book sale at the beginning of the semester.  Just keep in mind two things when buying used law textbooks: 1. Make sure you get the same edition.  Some new editions aren't just a matter of adding a case or an essay.  My Crim textbook was a new edition that, the teacher explained, was so different that we couldn't possibly use the last edition. and 2. Some people brief cases by what is called book briefing, that is highlighting and underlining the pertinent parts of the cases.  Some people took this to the extreme and used about six different color highlighters and underlinging schemes throughout the whole book, Green for case name, yellow for holding, pink for facts, underlining for the most important get the idea, their book looked like a crayola crayon box exploded inside of it.  If you buy a used book that you can't see, such as online, you may not know what you're getting and you could end up getting a heavily highlighted, and distracting book.  Even if you can figure out their scheme, it may not be the best idea to rely on another student's notion of what is the holding, they could have been wrong.  Anyway, hope that answered you question.  Good luck.


If your lawschool is going to give you a Westlaw ID, Westlaw has Black's latest edition on their website.  I used it all the time and found it very easy to use as you can find words instantly.  The only problem I found it is that I didn't have a dictionary this summer because you lose your access to Westlaw during the summer unless you have a specific reason to keep it.  I decided recently to buy a dictionary but I will probably still just use Westlaw once school starts again.  If you'd like to carry something around, buy a pocket dictionary rather than the unabridged.  There is also which is free all the time.  Good luck with school.


Where should I go next fall? / Re: Competitiveness?
« on: July 27, 2005, 11:28:50 PM »
I can't offer you advice about any of the other schools but I go to Wake and I find that everyone is very friendly and helpful.  The first week of class, 2nd year students, who noticed we were in a line of first years offered advice for the best study guides for classes.  Yeah, I know, they aren't in my class but still, they had no reason to want to help us.  I've heard that at other schools people don't even stop and say hi to people in the halls; they're just too busy and absorbed in their own world.  Within the class everyone seems to be willing to give notes and advice and talk about study tips.  Wake is so small, only 40 people a section, we really are all family.  The only time it got really tense was the morning of exams, and I'm talking less than half an hour away. People tend to get snippy and may answer questions in a way that makes them feel better for knowing more than you.  You can't fault people for that though, at that point we may have been up for 48 hours, on our 14th cup of coffee, and happy that someone asked a question we could answer.  Trust me, no matter how nice you are you'll probably be a little snippy too during exams.

If you want to know anything more about Wake, I'd be happy to answer.  Are you applying for the following year or making last minute decisions?  Just send me a PM, or reply to this message, I'll check back later.


Where should I go next fall? / Re: left leaning law schools?
« on: July 05, 2005, 12:08:51 AM »
If you don't want a right-leaning school (students), I'd stear clear of places like..

Wake, SMU, Baylor, Ole Miss, Vandy, Bama, UGA, UF.

As far as Wake goes, I strongly disagree.  I could see how the undergrad might be more conservative but the law school or at least the majority of the vocal people in my class are liberal, some of them are extremely liberal and I am a moderate conservative (conservative on fiscal issues - small goverment...,liberal on social issues - support gay marriage and abortion rights.)  And the faculty (for the most part) are very liberal and vocal about their opinions. But I imagine the faculty pretty much anywhere are vocally liberal.  Just my 2 cents.

Law School Applications / Re: How hard is it to get into Wake?
« on: July 04, 2005, 11:18:31 PM »
Hi all, I just finished my first year at Wake a few months ago. 

My stats were right around yours.  I had virtually no EC's.  The best thing I could add was a foreign language award from undergrad.  What I did have was work experience.  I worked between 25 and 40 hours a week throughout undergrad.  I also worked full time for three years post grad.  All of this landed me on the waitlist until July when I was accepted. 

I think your stats would land you on the waitlist, especially since the schools all tend to up their stats a wee little each year.  But your EC's and personal extras might push you over.  Growing up in Europe is not "pretty average" to me.  It's pretty neat.  Think of the admissions staff as a bunch of chefs creating a new delicious dish.  If they only put in meat and potatoes it will not win any awards.  They need to add spices.  So they find someone who's family fled Cuba when she was a baby, they add someone else who taught English in a remote party of Russia, they throw in some PhD's and a few people with Masters, they add a pinch of foreign language proficiency and a dash of volunteer work and finish it up with a handful of just graduated's and another handful of worked for a few years post grad and you have a 1L class.  I would emphasize what makes you diverse.  I know it sounds cheesy and I think it is cheesy but if you don't emphasize what is different about you, you might not be the potato they pick.  How do you stand out? Your PS.  I look back on my PS and think it was pretty dry.  Write a PS that you would want to read.  Think of it this way, the admissions staff has to read thousands of PS's.  At Wake they actually read these at home on their time off and not while in the office.  Make em laugh, make em cry, make them forget that they are spending their nights and weekends reading admissions essays.  Don't just talk about what you want to do with a law degree (save the world, make a million dollars, make orphans and widows cry) this is what they can do for you.  You can talk about why you want to go to law school or what you want to do with a law degree but throw in enough spice so they can see what you will do (think add diversity to the class) for the law school. 

As far as letting them know that Wake is your first choice.  Nothing says you respect the school like applying early. (Wake doesn't have an Early Decision or at least it didn't when I applied, so apply as soon as you can.) This means you need to have your LSAC account and all of you letters of rec ready.  Applying early shows you are eager to start law school and you are eager to start law school there.  Applying in February says, eh, law school shmaw school, I guess I'll apply or I applied to a bunch of other places first and then decided to add Wake when I didn’t like the responses I got in January.  You should call them soon after you apply to get an idea of when they think they might make decisions if that isn't listed.  (I can't remember if Wake is rolling or set date.) You should let them know by phone how eager you are and check in periodically but not every day (that makes you seem crazy).  If you are borderline, a school might be more apt to offer you a spot if they know you will take it rather than sit on it.  I know that admissions gets tapes and videos and music composed or books written by the people applying.  I don't know if they look at any of this.  Some of the Deans frown on any additions because they feel that if you can't follow the app rules then you don't belong in law school.  This is a little harsh but they do get a lot of applications and they just don't have time to read your Masters thesis or listen to your album along with 1000 others. 

As far as adding a letter of intent to make Wake your first choice or any school for that matter, I would contact the admissions office and ask what their stance would be on such a letter.  If they say they would consider it, then I would add it, if they would not or if they say they really frown on additions to the app then don't anger the admissions gods. 

Obviously this is unofficial advice so take it or leave it at your own peril. Sorry the post is so long, hope this helps.  Good luck.  Feel free to PM me if you have any specific questions about Wake life etc… - Jen

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