Law School Discussion

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Messages - stateofbeasley

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31
Wow!  I can't believe how knowledgable you guys all are; ...How can I become so smart and wordly?  It's amazing.

I've been admitted to practice in PA and NJ for about 18 months. 

Ignore the warnings at your peril.  I graduated from Temple, which is a respected school, and there are plenty of people from my class who are still reviewing documents. 

The plain truth of the matter is that decent entry level jobs are hard to come by.  Wages that allow you to pay your bills and more importantly, good mentoring, are in short supply.

32
I got a kick out of this one...

http://www.jdunderground.com/thread.php?threadId=14985

what a bunch of miserable people. but seriously,

Ignore JD Underground at your own peril.  While much of what is written there is exageration, there's a grain of truth -- the job market is horrible in some areas of the country.  And many of the jobs that are available are horrible themselves.  Several of my friends who were very passionate about having the opportunity to practice have encountered only verbal abuse, sweatshop-like hours, and even sexual harassment from partners at firms they worked for. 

In a small firm, there's no human resources to turn to when things go bad.  You might not have Title VII protection because the firm has too few employees.  The absolute power the partners have over you in your capacity as employee pretty much ensures that you either take the abuse, or resign.

33
Some Tier 3 and 4 schools are bad.  Some are good.

A good Tier 3 or 4 school will have a strong alumni network in its local area, affordable tuition, and decent faculty. 

A BAD Tier 3 or 4 school is an overpriced (generally private school charging 40k/yr in tuition alone) diploma mill that has only a small alumni base and lousy faculty. 

In short: Don't evaluate a school based on its USNews ranking.  Take into account job opportunities, TOTAL cost of attendence, and teaching quality.  Crunch the numbers.  Make sure the price you pay makes financial sense.

After a decade, you have successful...

That's a big assumption to make, and I wouldn't count on it.  Law is a business, and most lawyers I know can't even handle their own money well, let alone run a business.  The ABA had a report last year on the state of the profession that seemed to show that many people left law after a few years. 

34
I don't know. Like everyone else I harbor the "nose to the grindstone" / "can do" mentality so that really depends on my class rank.

You don't know if you'll be able to pay the bills?

Look ahead to the future.  Calculate your monthly payments after law school: http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml.  Based on the salaries that you know law firms pay, will you be able to pay these loans?  Will Sallie Mae be sending debt collectors after you?

Many of my coworkers did not think about this when they made the decision to attend law school.  The result?  Some are living paycheck to paycheck.  Some are on the verge of bankruptcy due to credit card debt and student loans.  They work hard and are just barely staying on the treadmill.

The "spend now & worry about it later/never" mentality inevitably leads to lots of stress and disaster. 

My advice still stands.  Put off law school for awhile.  Find a job.  Get your LSAT score up.  Get into Georgetown because that's where you really want to go.

Edit:  Your GPA is very good... def study up on the LSAT.  Even a boost of a few points will mean a lot more scholarship $.

35
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I plan on practicing in either Pittsburgh or Philadelphia.

Choose your location and then choose your school.  Both schools will have some degree of brand name recognition, but don't count on it giving you much of a boost outside of their respective regions.

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Which school would give me a better shot at a transfer to Georgetown?

My hunch is about equal chance.  Similarly ranked institutions. 

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I know what you all are thinking... I have a poor family situation and am practically homeless ...

You aren't going to like this, but I think you should find a job instead of taking on more debt to live.  If you planned on moving for law school, is it possible to move to a location with better job prospects?

It seems to me that you want to go to GULC.  Why settle for another school?

The way I see it, you are going to law school to put off paying your debt.  If you go to law school this fall, and graduate in 3 years with another $100,000 in debt, will you be able to pay the bills? 

36
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The business is yours... BUY AND SELL ...

My experience is that most law students are very risk averse -- exactly the kind of people who will not want to take the entreprenuerial path.  Lets face it, half of them are English/Liberal Arts majors who went to school because they didn't know what to do with their degree.

The fact remains that law school is a serious financial mistake for most people. 

37
Reviews, Visits, and Rankings / Re: Pepperdine Dorm Policy?
« on: April 29, 2008, 10:02:01 PM »
I intend on drinking quite heavily throughout law school.  All I've heard from my friends currently in law school is that EVERYONE turns into an alcoholic.

Just another reason to stay the f*(k away from law school.  You waste $ on a TTT degree, and waste more $ on booze. 

38
http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/newyork/ny-bc-ny--budget-lawschools0422apr22,0,4222067.story

You've got to be f#!@*(ing kidding me... the last thing NY needs is more TTT law schools flodding the market with graduates.

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"There's no question that we simply have a glut of law schools," said Makau Mutua, interim dean of the University at Buffalo Law School. "There's no shortage of access to legal education for New Yorkers who want to go to law school."

The state budget passed by the Legislature earlier this month includes more than $50 million for developing law schools in the Rochester and Binghamton areas and on Long Island. The Rochester school would be affiliated with St. John Fisher College, a private school in suburban Pittsford, while the SUNY system's Binghamton and Stony Brook universities would get their own law schools.

More than $2 million would help pay for Fisher to study creation of a law school. The rest of the funding is for the two SUNY schools, with the lion's share going to Stony Brook, including $250,000 for a feasibility study and $45 million for building the law school.




And the politicians ADMIT that this is to make MONEY!

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A state lawmaker who pushed for the St. John Fisher funding in the state budget says a law school, if located in downtown Rochester, would give the city a much-needed economic boost.

"This is really about improving regionalism and improving Rochester's academic landscape and career opportunities," said state Senator Joseph Robach, a Republican from suburban Greece.


The law school scam is reaching new lows.  Private schools getting more taxpayer dollars is a disgrace!  This is nothing but corporate welfare. 

39
I just read the article, and from what I am seeing out in the workforce it is true.  Those at the top of my graduating class are making six figures, and the rest are struggling to get by.

Those who cannot pay their bills on 43k/year at gov't offices or small firms go into document review.  Reviewers who can find good long term projects can make 70-80k/year working 50 hrs/week or so, but the work is mind-numbingly boring.  There's also little room for advancement and sometimes very little job security.  Some reviewers become staff attorneys and help manage projects, but its more of the same type of work.  The upside is less stress than an associate's job.

I think most people on this board want to be lawyers, but there are also a lot of people out there who go to law school because they feel like they have nothing better to do or because their parents want them to go.  This article should discourage at least a few of those people from applying to law school.

40
Another vote for Rutgers.

Cardozo and American are extremely overpriced.

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