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Messages - Comm-Law
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« on: October 16, 2005, 03:22:46 PM »
AFAIK, Toledo does use a curve to determine grades. I don't know if they go with a straight bell curve based on a C average or not; but they have mentioned a curve. Another interesting thing about Toledo is that we have no defined class-sections. Apparently, our class ranks are based on everyone in the class (including the part-timers).
« on: September 11, 2005, 01:25:45 AM »
Assuming that all that has been said here is true, I think you have two courses of action:
1) ignor the advances and do your best to prepare for the class. The prof will probably back off since he is already treading on thin-ice.
2) Bring the situation up to the dean of the law school. They may choose to move you to a different professor's class rather than risk the possibility of ugly alegations of impropriety
« on: September 07, 2005, 11:06:04 PM »
So far we have just one "gunner" in our 1L section, but the following quote hit it right on the head on Tuesday. Our property prof just wailed on the gunner because he caught-him-unprepared or just-plain-wrong
If the prof makes a point to mock you in class .... then you're probably a gunner.
« on: August 30, 2005, 11:21:53 PM »
In particular, Legal Writing is the most harsh with TWO allowed abscenses this semester and only ONE allowed abscense next semester (and no... your sick/skip days don't carry). Seems that I'll be attending class with some very sick people at some point this year because it doesn't seem to be an option to stay home with the flu, pnemonia or strep-throat!
I think that the attendence policy for our class was written by the head of the LRW program and that it is the same for all of the classes. I may be wrong though. Anyways, our teacher in particular seems like if you really have to miss, she will excuse it. I scheduled an interview for a summer job for this coming Tuesday when I was under the assumption that there was no class. Today after she changed that, I spoke with her and she was totally cool about it and told me not to worry about it at all. I still may be able to get to class though. It will be a close call.
Im starting to think that the administration is breathing down their necks to enfore strict attendence. Then like you said, the teachers don't want to come off like that so they just blame it on the ABA.
I'm glad to hear that the LRW prof was reasonable with you regarding that "unscheduled" class for next week. I'm also glad to hear that you are going to use Tues for an interview instead of shooting out to Vegas again
« on: August 30, 2005, 11:14:30 PM »
I think the ABA mandates that students attend at least 15% of the scheduled class sessions.
Do you mean the ABA mandates that students attend at least 85% of the schedule. 15% of the schedule would seem pretty lax... that's only about 4 or 5 classes out of 30.
« on: August 28, 2005, 04:31:36 PM »
No one here has suggested that grades are based on attendance. Rather attendance is just a requirement. If you miss more than X number of classes in a semester you may not sit for the final.
« on: August 28, 2005, 12:06:29 PM »
How are various schools approaching attendance?
I was somewhat shocked to find that every course at UToledo passes an attendance sheet around every day. The school rants about the honor system and how we need to act like responsible adults and we have an obligation to attend and do our best and not cheat and report cheating, etc. etc. Yet they institute a grammer-school-like attendance policy that results in automatic failure of a class if you miss a certain number of classes. In particular, Legal Writing is the most harsh with TWO allowed abscenses this semester and only ONE allowed abscense next semester (and no... your sick/skip days don't carry). Seems that I'll be attending class with some very sick people at some point this year because it doesn't seem to be an option to stay home with the flu, pnemonia or strep-throat!
So... how are the other schools handling this subject? Are most as hard-nosed regarding attendance? UToledo appears to attribute (blame) the entire policy on that of the ABA. Noting that regular attendance is prescribed by ABA rules. However, there does seem to be an inconsistant application of that policy. One of my courses allows 5 days missed and another 4, and another only 2. Seems to me that the rule is arbitrary.
Don't get me wrong... I intend to attend the vast majority of my classes. If I'm investing 100K-200K into this venture, I WANT to get something out of it. But, what I anticipate would be a system that doesn't set artificial lines as to the number of days that can be missed. Do we really want to encourage extremely sick people to attend class (and thus spread it to the health ones)? Do we want to discourage students from taking advantage of opportunities to attend "law-related" conferences, interviews, or other out-of-school events? It somehow seems wrong to put such emphasis on attendance as to threaten failure upon a relatively small number of abscenses.
« on: August 28, 2005, 11:46:34 AM »
It all varies by the professor. Some are very laid-back and don't care if you have to leave during class; others want to show how much "control" they have. One prof went through a 10 minute diatribe about a certain student that left class to retrieve a book (for HER class). He had neglected to bring to that book to the FIRST CLASS and went out of the room for 10 minutes to get it. I think that the most effective professors are those that are careful with their class rules and don't make blanket rules that make the students uncomfortable (i.e. no bathroom breaks ever) I think a more effective rule would be: Try to limit those times that you have to leave the room during class and if you believe that you will need to leave often, sit in the back or sides of the room so as not to disturb others.
« on: August 28, 2005, 09:23:29 AM »
I think your observation rings somewhat true. Civ Pro in particular is very rule oriented. Unlike property or torts, Civ Pro doesn't usually concern itself with a lot of policy reasoning. In my view, all of the 1L law school courses involve a high degree of memorization of rules... the so called "black-letter-law". In addition, to varying degrees, each course also involves application and interpretation of those rules. Our task as 1L's is to retain the rules and come exam-time, apply the rules in a way that best emulates our professor's attitude and style.
For instance, in my case, my property professor seems to emphasize policy. He went so far as to specifically inform us on day one that he didn't want to turn out a bunch of automotons that revelled in "black-letter-law". His reasoning is that, it is better to work to apply the rules with flexibility and get the "right answer" to a case than to apply a strict interpretation of the rules and accept an unjust result. (Thus he is, in my opinion, an advocate of judicial activism). In contrast, my contracts' professor has no such misgivings of application of the law. She has, thus far, laid-out a roadmap of the rules of contract. She has pointed-out inconsistancies, but at no time has she indicated a desire for loose interpretation or modification of the rules.
So, bottom line.... read your professors. Some will want policy and rationale above all else, some will cut-to-the-chase and get down to the common approach to the current set of rules. Civ Pro, fortunately in my opinion, doesn't lend itself to as much loose interpretation as the other classes; it's more of a road map rather than a treasure map.
« on: August 27, 2005, 09:56:08 AM »
Our K prof just told us that if we are caught playing games on our computer once, we are kicked out for that class. If we are caught twice, we fail the course. Yikes!! I am glad I leave my laptop at home!
That's ironic... my K prof is so hilarious, we don't need to surf the net or play games to be entertained. She finished off the last class doing her impression of Yoda (from Star Wars) and making analogies with DragonbalZ (I think that's what its called?)
If there is one thing I took away from this first week, it's that getting the right professor definately does make a difference. I hear from students in other sections saying how hard/boring their K class is, while we look forward to each class wondering what crazy song-and-dance show our K prof will put on next! On the other hand, I got the short straw in certain other subjects and only wish I were in the other section(s).
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