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Messages - Citylaw

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Solid advice above from everyone and I think the last poster really nailed it. The simple fact none of it will matter if you do not do well enough on the LSAT to be admitted into a law school.

I think many 0L's make this mistake of thinking about law school, before they have finished the first two steps to even be qualified for admission, which are graduating from college and taking the LSAT. 

If you don't have an LSAT score or a Bachelor's Degree you cannot be admitted into law school. At this juncture, you should focus on getting the best possible GPA and LSAT score you can. Once that is done you can determine what schools you even have a shot at, and then these other issues can be looked into with more detail.

Loki made a great point in that you will have to explain the academic dismissal, but again if you do not graduate or take the LSAT then the academic dismissal will be the least of your worries.

In summary, you appear to be putting the cart ahead of the horse. Stay focused on graduating with the best GPA you can and then prepare for and take the LSAT.

Good luck!

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Chosing a School
« on: February 09, 2016, 10:58:41 AM »
Well first and foremost congrats on your acceptance into law school. Getting into an ABA school is an accomplishment in and of itself.

Secondly, remember that I and anyone else posting on this board or others is an anonymous internet poster that knows nothing about you, your situation, or what is best for you so take anything you read my post included with a major grain of salt. Remember all it takes to post on the internet is an internet connection and I could easily be a crackhead in a public library or the Dean of Harvard Law School you have no idea.

Third you make the common 0L mistake, which I myself made of thinking a "right" choice exists. It does not I was accepted to numerous schools across the country, but you can only choose one. Obviously my life would be drastically different if I choose a different law school and there is no "right" choice, but any ABA law school will provide you with a great education and opportunity to succeed, but there is no way to make a "right" choice.

With that intro I think any law student should consider the following five factors in this order.

(1) Location
(2) Cost
(3) Personal Feeling about the School
(4) Understanding the reality of legal education
(5) Last and Least U.S. News Rankings.

Here is a great article to explain these factors in more detail.

I have to do real work right now : ( but I will post more later. Good luck on your decision.

I will apply these factors to your situation.

Politics and Law-Related News / Re: POTUS
« on: February 03, 2016, 11:53:08 AM »
Well when the interweb drives you nuts, don't respond. Certain people just want to say absurd things to get a response, because in real life nobody listens to them, but on the interweb anyone in the world can say anything they want, and it has as much weight as anyone else.

This thread is a perfect example of that.

Job Search / Re: Testing Period
« on: February 03, 2016, 10:35:23 AM »
I am not sure if this is a 1L summer or 2L summer gig, but as everyone else said it will probably be just a way to get your feet wet. Not many summer law school gigs are that intense in all honesty and particularly if it is an unpaid internship, or for credit class, but you still learn stuff.

As a law student and even the first few years after you pass the bar, you really don't know anything and over complicate things, which I know I did and I am sure everyone else that posted will agree.

I also would not stop your search in February, it is great you have something lined up, but don't put all your eggs in one basket, and if you can get an awesome summer job elsewhere that doesn't entail a cryptic testing period go for it.

I believe you are in San Francisco and I highly recommend signing up for the Bar Association of San Francisco and using their career center. It is only $30 for law students to join for the year.

Also, I know the BYU intercollegiate job bank was awesome, when I was a law student.

Basically there are a ton of options out there and the most important thing for any lawyer, law student, etc is to just have confidence in yourself. You are smart enough to have been accepted into law school and are very capable, but if you constantly second guess yourself it will be tough to succeed.

You will do fine, if you believe in yourself, but that is easier said than done. I know when I was in school and starting out I thought I was screwing everything up, but the longer you do it you realize nobody is inflappable, I mean the U.S. Supreme Court Justices disagree with each-other about the law all the time, and as one of my professors put it law is more are than science.

Law School Admissions / Re: Considering Law School - mid 40's
« on: February 03, 2016, 10:26:42 AM »
Excellent advice above from Maintain and Loki as usual.

As for being to old for law school, the answer is nobody is ever to old, but obviously the older you are the less time you have to recoup your law school investment. As everyone has stated, starting out in the legal profession is difficult your work experience certainly will not hurt you, but it wont' be that helpful as far as being a practicing attorney either.

Maintain makes a great point about LSAT scores and scholarships. You want to minimize costs as much as possible and if you have the option try to get in State-Tuition there are several schools throughout the U.S. that offer very cheap tuition for in-state residents. There are several schools in New York and Florida that offer cheap-in state rates, which are even better than scholarships. If you are not aware many scholarships at law schools are contingent upon you performing well, which usually entails maintaining a 3.0 GPA. 100% of law students are smart, motivated, hard working people that think a 3.0 easy, but law school is a whole different animal, because of the curve and at most schools only 35% of the class can get a 3.0, which means there is a 65% chance you and all your future classmates will not and if you don't maintain the 3.0 your scholarship goes away for 2L and 3L.

Then finally one thing I personally believe is that part-time law school is not a good bet, most people I know that enrolled part-time were not ready for the rigors of law school and failed out, which resutled in a big waste of time and money for them. People "can" do it as Maintain has, but it has been my experience that most part-time students don't succeed. I think if you really want to do it then jump-in fall time and focus on law school, if your not ready for that big of a commitment then law school might not be for you.

When I was in law school there were people in their late 30's 40's that went on to do well. One of my classmates was a long-time journalist for the San Francisco Chronicle, but he knew the newspaper industry was going down and he went to law school. He was 43 when he started law school, passed the bar, and is doing great, but he went full-time.

Also, this is a great article about choosing a law school.

Good luck whatever you decide!


General Off-Topic Board / Re: Who would you hire?
« on: January 28, 2016, 05:22:13 PM »
I don't think they even give grads at some of the T14 schools.

For examplate at Boalt where a lot of my friends went you just get a Pass. If you really nail a class you can get a H (Honors) or HH (High Honors). The top 40% of the class gets a H and the top 10% gets an HH. The rest get a pass, unless they really f'up, but none of my friends said they know anyone that didn't get a pass.

It is not quite the same as other schools with actual grades. I know at my school we got A's, B's and C's and even D's. My Boalt friends were surprised by this and I was surprised by their system, but it just shows how much it varies.

General Off-Topic Board / Re: Who would you hire?
« on: January 28, 2016, 04:28:27 PM »
Also, don't forget the fact that people are people and would you rather hire the T4 Grad that finished in the middle of his class, but a ton of people you know vouch for him and the kid is ready to start yesterday. Or a Harvard Grad that lives in Boston and your office is in L.A. and nobody knows anything about this guy or if he will actually get on the plan.e

The hypothetical debate is interesting, but in real life it is meaningless. There are so many factors that go into what will be a good employee-employer fit. I have recently been interviewing at firms just checking my options out and there are some places where it just clearly won't be a good fit. I went to one office where the managing partner allowed cats in the office. (I am the Bay Area so there is a lot of weird stuff) . Anyways, I am really allergic to cats so regardless of school, aptitude etc it wasn't going to work. I hate cats the managing partner loved them.

I could go on with countless analogies and circumstances and is Harvard a "great" school. Yes, but there are countless factors that have nothing whatsoever to do with what law school you attended, especially the further into your legal career you go.

Just to take it one step further, lets say you have the Harvard Grad and the Valedictorian of University of San Francisco and Severson & Werson a firm that specializes in representing Banks is choosing to hire the two. If the USF Valedictorian worked at Banks for three years before law school and the Harvard Grad worked in a Housing Rights Clinic well the USF is a better fit for Severson & Werson.

If it is a legal aid job the Housing Rights Clinic will be viewed more favorable than working at a Bank.

At the end of the day the law school bubble means very little, unless you want to work in BigLaw then the prestige matters, but there are not many of those jobs and a lot of people that get those jobs hate it, but if that is your sole goal then get into the best school you can. Otherwise, use common sense and it will take you pretty far. 

Excellent suggest MacGuffin.

It is a bummer this board is so dead, but at least when a topic comes up there is some rational response and it does fall into the mess that those sites offer.

Well your just describing work. Whether your a doctor,lawyer, salesman the government taxes you and the more you make the more your taxed. Also, the more a company pays you the more they expect from you.

Sounds like you don't like the rat race, but the same thing applies to other professions.

Unless and again I ask this repeatedly, because I seriously want to know if there is an easy to get, high paying, challenging when I want it to be, but never interferes with my personal life then please let me know.

If that exists and I have been missing out on it then your right law does suck.

Well just because it is Friday afternoon I am going to throw it out there 25 of the 43 presidents have been lawyers. Therefore, 25 of the 43 Presidents have been horrible people that attended law school.

-Just historical fact as well although Obama is listed as the 44th President he is actually only the 43rd, because Grover Cleveland also a lawyer was the 22nd and 24th President.

Therefore, there is no more likely profession to become President than a lawyer that attended law school.

Let's continue ranting frivolously on the internet with anonymous people!

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