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Messages - OnTheRoad

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Choosing the Right Law School / Re: JAG OPPORTUNITIES
« on: August 25, 2007, 10:25:38 AM »
When I was applying for USMC OCC, my understanding was that Law candidates didn't get school paid for, but they could be accepted as candidates at the beginning of school and receive some pay while in school (I'm sure not much.) Can anyone confirm or deny this?

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Vandy vs. USC
« on: August 25, 2007, 09:50:26 AM »
Is it fair to say that both have really strong alumni bases, and neither is truly national?

ak, the rumor is it only matters at HY.

Don't think about this stuff as a UG or HSer. The transfer is definitely not going to hurt you with a high gpa.

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: UNC v Wake Forest?
« on: August 24, 2007, 12:42:48 PM »
Yeah I think I was doing exactly what I was complaining about people doing and confusing general rep with law school rep, lol. How do you like Emory? I'm thinking of applying but a bit scared of Atlanta in general. Where are most of the people that go there looking to practice?

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: UNC v Wake Forest?
« on: August 24, 2007, 11:56:29 AM »
pwned, sorry.  :-\

Mae8, are you Emory UG or Law?

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: Just Visited Vandy
« on: August 24, 2007, 04:30:30 AM »
Any thoughts on student body? Collegiality?

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: 2009 Rankings (a preview?)
« on: August 24, 2007, 04:28:17 AM »
Great post. Couple thoughts:

First, you guys are looking at the wrong end of the sheet. The top schools are all still top schools, don't worry. Being 15 instead of 17 isn't a big deal. What's really extraordinary about this is the "Pepperdine Issue," (trying to start a trend by calling it that.) Judging by the fact that most schools changed by a point or so, it's clear that most schools were 'juicing' their ratings a bit. However, Pepperdine's enormous drop makes it look like it was doing more than 'juicing;' it was hiding a real problem. With a cost of $56,130 per year ( = $168,390 for a JD) this (and other schools) seem to be letting in students that they cannot assure jobs, at a cost that is hard to defend.

We all like to play the T14 game and watch them move up or down a spot and try to gauge what it means (see: Nothing.) Fact is, T14 schools, T20, are probably still a deal at twice the price. But the fact that lots of schools in the T2, T3, T4 range are charging the same for a year of school as HYS is crazy. If the average graduate is going into private practice (50K a year,) how can these schools charge the same as the schools that put people into BigLaw jobs (160k a year)?

Glad to see that the new rankings are going to make schools a little more accountable to their students. It would be nice to have USN or someone put together a "Hall of Shame" for schools that are saddling their students with debt and not helping them find jobs afterwards.

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / UNC fact and fiction
« on: August 24, 2007, 03:53:29 AM »
Couple of thoughts on the Wake/UNC fight. I'm in the middle of picking schools and dating a girl from NC, so I hear a lot about this argument. First, I think it's important to understand that for in-state people, that is NC residents, UNC has a HUGE halo effect, mostly emanating from their undergrad reputation. To in-state kids, UNC is mecca, and this bright shining star in the academic world. As someone that grew up in Maryland (though born and with family in NC,) UNC always seemed to me what it was: a good state universiy, up there with the best, Wisconsin, Texas, maybe even Virginia. However, that appreciation of it doesn't come close to the way that the NC kids I've met think of it. They will regale you with tales of students that chose UNC over Harvard, Yale, Princeton. It's not to say that I'm wrong and they're right or the other way around, it's just important to realize that there is a difference in reputation in-state versus out. This definitely carries over to the Law School. Out of state reputation is held hands down by Duke. You need to have some idea about where you want to practice after school. If it's NC, SC, GA, etc, then UNC is a good choice, though I don't think you're taking much of a risk by choosing Wake instead. If you haven't thought about it yet, do so now. If you want to move further up the coast, think about taking five minutes to call recruiters at a couple DC or  PA firms, and ask them their impressions of the schools. Remember to take NC opinions about the schools with a grain of salt, as these opinions are largely influenced by the reputation of undergrad schools.

If you're looking for a booming cosmopolitan lifestyle, you shouldn't be looking in NC. You probably shouldn't be looking at law school either. But if you want action and nightlife, you should be looking at schools in DC, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Atlanta. You can find comparable schools to UNC/Wake in any of those cities.

And finally, I want to address the regular posts about UNC moving up the boards that you see all over here and TLS. UNC has an in-state quota of 75%!!!!!!! There is no way that the school will move more than a couple slots wile this is in place. Be realistic about what the rankings actually mean when you look at them, and consider them by 'grouping' not by number. That is, position 32 is not better than position 36. When you look at the actual data, it's not that different, and won't change much. However, 22 is better than 35. Consider the schools three or four spots above and below a school as Peer institutions.

Having said that, take another look at the boards and see where UNC actually is. It stands with other (very good) state universities such as Maryland, Alabama, and Ohio. It does not stand in the first tier of state universities with Texas, Virginia, and Michigan. Which brings us back to the incredible 75% in-state quota. To give some scale to that, UVA takes 40% in-state. If I was an out of state student looking at public schools, that number would stop me in my tracks. It is indeed the case as a previous poster noted that UNC is as hard to get into as Boalt for out of state students. But what about in-state. Well, it's obviously a lot easier. So as impressive as it may be that you got an out-of-state slot at UNC, your UNC acceptance is not going to look like a Boalt acceptance.

A previous poster pointed out that Texas did not climb in the rankings when it lowered it's in-state quota. However, students coming to Texas for school from out-of-state do not qualify as texas residents in time to benefit from in-state tuition. At UNC it is much easier to qualify. So, if (and only if,) UNC opens up its admissions pool to out-of-state kids, it could see a large ratings bump, as it would become a great deal. If UNC moved from 25% to 50% out-of-state, I think that within a few years, its numbers would put it on par with Texas, UCLA, etc. However, my impression is that those decisions are not up to the admissions committee, but to the state government.

In summary, UNC and Wake are both great schools. They both enjoy very solid regional reputations. I think it's a mistake to think that UNC is a first-tier ('first tier' not = 'T1') public law school. If you're planning to practice in that region, let the money and visits guide your decision.

I'm sorry to unload all this on you all, but I'm constantly getting a barrage of UNC hype from my girlfriend, and if I put it down to you guys, I don't have to sleep on the couch.

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