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Messages - yykm

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41
Transferring / Re: IU to Notre Dame = Worth it?
« on: August 27, 2007, 03:00:02 PM »
Just call the CSOs of the schools youre interested.  At ND, the median required/preferred gpa was ~3.33.  However, plenty of firms did not state a required/preferred gpa.  My best guess is that the 3.33 equates to roughly 1/3.  I checked the reqts/preferences at my old school (a lower t1) for a few of the same firms, and the firms usu wanted 15%.  With that said, the firms may in fact be more lenient.

42
Transferring / Re: IU to Notre Dame = Worth it?
« on: August 26, 2007, 10:01:45 AM »
I left my slightly lower ranking school for ND.  I have no regrets at all after seeing the stats that firms required/preferred at my old school's OCI.  While ND doesnt exactly rank its students, the same firms recruit 10-20% deeper at ND.  Additionally, more firms from various locations recruit at ND than at my former school, where ~95% came from the same state and a neighboring state. You may not care as much since youre looking at Detroit and IU may have plenty of Detroit firms recruiting there.  Just for one eg I looked for the reqts that a Detroit firm has at ND.  Foley & Lardner - 33%/3.4/3.33.  If you can, compare that to IU and consider whether the increased % (if there is one) is worth the money.
any way I can get my hands on general cutoff info for the large firms as a 1L? (e.g. is it released publically, or should I talk to an upper-classman or career services?)
I dont know the 1L stuff, but I suggest contacting career services.  They provide honest answers and do not try to exaggerate your actual chances of securing a job.  (My old school's CSO was terrible, so it's refreshing to get real answers with useful information.)

43
2L job search / Re: Hovering around the median. Is it really that bad?
« on: August 02, 2007, 05:55:43 PM »
Ok. Perhaps my terminology is off.  I'm looking for 125K and it seems like a lot of the mid-law firms I have targeted do in fact pay that. 

Wow, show me these mid-size firms.  They may pay 125K, but I am willing to bet they pay this to real hot shots from the tops of classes.  In Philly and DC, I have heard of mid-size firms (around 25 to 100 attorneys) paying between 70 and 100K depending on experience, grades and standing etc...The average attorney in the US, based upon department of labor statistics, make 110K.  I have only heard of BIGLAW firms paying 125K for new associates. 

LA, OC, San Diego, B-more  all have mid firms that pay over 125K.   
I figured nyc too.  Anyway, I think biglaw is more commonly known as V100.

44
Transferring / Re: $250 Registration Cancellation Fee
« on: July 31, 2007, 07:07:48 PM »
I never heard of a school charging for students to withdaw before this. People withdrwa all the time at larger public schools.  Some withdraw b/c they cant afford that semester.  You can also call your local ethics hotline about the matter as well.  They may be able to provide insight into whether the school can hold this against you when you apply for the bar.

45
Transferring / Re: IU to Notre Dame = Worth it?
« on: July 27, 2007, 10:08:01 PM »
I left my slightly lower ranking school for ND.  I have no regrets at all after seeing the stats that firms required/preferred at my old school's OCI.  While ND doesnt exactly rank its students, the same firms recruit 10-20% deeper at ND.  Additionally, more firms from various locations recruit at ND than at my former school, where ~95% came from the same state and a neighboring state. You may not care as much since youre looking at Detroit and IU may have plenty of Detroit firms recruiting there.  Just for one eg I looked for the reqts that a Detroit firm has at ND.  Foley & Lardner - 33%/3.4/3.33.  If you can, compare that to IU and consider whether the increased % (if there is one) is worth the money.

46
Transferring / Re: Virginia?
« on: July 18, 2007, 08:01:06 PM »
UVA has a strong preference for residents, so if youre a VA resident it may not be all that difficult. 

Future FYI: the # of enrolling transfers doesnt necessarily mean a school is transfer un/friendly.  If fewer prospective transfers apply, 10 transfer enrollees could mean the school friendly.

47
2L job search / Re: Gambling with OCI
« on: July 15, 2007, 12:15:13 AM »
Wait, are my to understand that you think you have more job options at a low Tier 1 school than does someone at a top 25 school?

That is just flat out ridiculous.

Hate to burst your bubble, but at a 48 ranked school, with a median gpa, you won't be scoring a bigfirm job.  That's reality.
I think you have it in reverse.  Top 25 school with top 1/3 = good prospects at OCI.  #48 school with top 1/3 iffy prospects at OCI.  Im not sure where you thought I meant otherwise.  Perhaps I miswrote earlier...

48
2L job search / Re: Gambling with OCI
« on: July 14, 2007, 04:37:25 PM »
If you aren't at a top school (i.e. 1-10) or don't have top 1/3 grades or so, you are going to struggle in OCI.  The ratio means nothing.  We have over 400 employers up for OCI, however, when you are in a competitive legal market, that doesn't mean the job offers are just going to pop out.

OCI employers aren't required to take any students from a particular school if they don't choose to.  They simply agree to participate in OCI.
That makes some sense, but your response somewhat distorts your point.  The number of OCI firms means very little depending on the class size.  I think the ratio indicates a lot more.  400 firms for a class of 400 is worse than 400 firms for 200 students.  Being top 1/3 at the former probably wont yield anything, while top 1/3 at the latter would.  From the firms standpoint, it doesnt make much sense ot go out of its way to participate in OCI and not want to firm 1 hire.  Even at my old school,  I had interviews with 2 of 6 spring recruiters as a 1L.  Nothing came of that, but I would think my chances are better at a better school, more firms, and more firms looking to hire my class type (ie, more want to take on 2Ls rather than 1Ls).  Way too many spout off how difficult it is, but just the other day, I read a post from a 3L at BC who was wasnt even top 1/3that found solid work through OCI.

Nonetheless, I do agree that at schools 30 (perhaps 35) and lower have difficulty finding success at OCI.  I checked my old school's (a low t1) OCI and the least stringent reqt was 1/2, while the majority were 1/4 and up.  So I agree that what you say is true for the majority of schools, but good options exist at OCI for students at outside the top 1/4 at non-T14 schools as well.

49
Transferring / Re: How long do transfer decisions usually take????
« on: July 13, 2007, 05:22:12 PM »
I heard from all schools both acceptances and rejections between July 10-20 last year.
What were the decisions that occurred closer to July 20?  From what I've seen, a lot of schools send out their decisions right around July 14/15 and that anything much later than that (2+ days) is a rejection.

50
2L job search / Re: Gambling with OCI
« on: July 12, 2007, 08:46:39 PM »
The reality is that for OCI, if you look at your school's bid page where you pick the particular firm, you will see a hiring contact.  That is almost always a woman, and it is her job to do initial screenings.  Flat out, the hiring attorney will tell her "ok, take students from this rank set of law schools with GPA's in this range."  If your gpa is nowhere near what they ask for, then they aren't going to give you an interview.

Additionally, outside of the top law schools, OCI definitely isn't the way that most students land fruitful employment.  Be ready to mail merge and send out masses of resumes via direct mail.
So this applies same reasoning applies at schools with OCI where the employers cant pre-screen the bids?  Last time I checked, my new school has roughly 2 OCI firms per student.  I would hope that this would equate to decent job prospects through OCI.  I plan on mailing out some applications to firms too, but still thought I could find work with the 2:1 odds even as a transfer student.

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