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Messages - Freak

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4891
The laws you state are someone's morality.

The Bible pretty clearly indicates how he made man...

4892
Yes I know it is the most widely read book ever (should I say "of all time" to clarify that I mean by people both living and dead?), you said it it's the most published and it's hundreds of years older than the Koran (some parts thousands).  You don't continue to publish a book for hundreds of years if there is no demand for more copies. Reading this a year later, I can hardly fathom that people argue against this point.

As far as Shakespeare’s plays I was simply comparing the percentage of differences in the translations.  The differences in Biblical translations are rarely more than punctuation errors.  The Bible is like the periodic table; everything seems to fall into place the more you study it.  The first time I read it I found dozens of seemingly glaring contradictions and there are still a few I don't understand, but most have been explained, enough in fact, that I have faith the others will fall into place when I need to understand them.

I believe the Bible to be the truth, as a whole.  Does that mean that every word is literaly and exactly true?  No.  When Jesus told his parables, they were stories to illustrate a point.  The point or moral of his story is true, but it is still a story.

The Bible is widely read and the most widely published book in the history of printing in the western world.

Is it the most read book?  I dunno.  I might be.  The Koran might be.  I dunno.

That does not diminish its message.  If it were the most widely read book, that would not enhance its message.  If I were the only person to ever read it, its truth would be just as strong as if everyone on the planet read it.

I agree with your take on truth.  If you'll notice I put out my arguments in support of my beliefs, not as proof.  Certainly I never meant to argue against your take on parables.

As far as the self-fulfilling prophecy...do I need to point out that if the holocaust had never happened there would never be an Israel today?  I hardly think they planned the holocaust.  Events moved beyond any one nation's control, let alone an individual's.  Most often prophecy is fulfilled in a way that men would not go about fulfilling it.

I have to admit you gents are sharp, you attack the basis for all my arguments rather than addressing them piece meal.  So I'll do the same. 

What it the basis for your moral objections to the prisoner abuse?  That It's illegal simply, doesn't cut it, laws are morality enforced.  If you don't believe in the Bible, do you believe in a supreme being at all?  If not, where did we come from?  If so, then the Bible is a very good explanation; the more you study it the more you realize that a supreme being must have had something to do with its writing.

If you support the theory of evolution and the big bang, then we are here by chance alone, something came from nothing is taken on faith (same faith that says God always existed).  Our thoughts, and emotions are electronic impulses that evolved over millions of years, and they have no meaning, they are there by chance.  We can't really know anything for certain because we have no way of measuring anything except through our senses and we cannot test them except by someone else's senses which also evolved over millions of years.  Why do you think so many of those great philosophers committed suicide?  The end is nihilism (life is meaningless) and it is the only possible conclusion apart from God. In fact, life apart from God is meaningless regardless if you believe in him.

4893
You don't have to believe the Bible, but it's the most reliable, fascinating book ever. 

Though it proves nothing I'll throw the following in support: No other book has been read by more people, no other book has caused as much controversy, no other ancient book is as accurate (word for word even more accurate than Shakespeare’s plays which are much more recent); they have found the city of Jericho and many other sites mentioned in the Bible and I already told you it predicted Israel becoming a nation again.  So I guess you could say I assume since it’s been right in the past that it will hold true in the future.  My belief is stronger than that, but even if that were all I had it’d be no different than driving down the road and assuming that the motorist will yield the right of way, even though they have been known to fail even in that.  http://faculty.goucher.edu/writingprogram/which_shakespeare_would_you_trust.htm

It's a well-established fact that many of the disciples were martyred when denouncing Christ would've prevented that.  If they knew he did not rise from the dead, then they died for what they knew to be a lie.  But they did not denounce Christ to save their necks; they died, for what they knew to be true.

4894
I don't live in Iraq so you'd have to translate that $ into what it would equal to live like a king here ~ 10 million or so, but hey you get that together and give me a call. 

As for the other posts, sarcasm?  Don’t waste my time.

4895
I seem to recall the Arabs getting stopped in France a while back and "white people" have basically been at war with them since.

As for Israel (yes thanks for the spell checker, but you missed another typo) you are right to an extent.  Yes Israel again became a nation in 1947 after over a thousand years of not being one. However, there have been Jews in that area for almost as long as there has been Jews.  In addition, they have fought Arabs most of that time (and almost everyone else for that matter).  The point is not that a nation is a warring nation or not (usually you don't become a nation without going to war or stay one for long without fighting again).

Specifically speaking of Israel and the Arabs they simply will never be at peace.  They never have been for very long (except of when Israel ceased to exist as a nation).  Some of both parties may want peace, but heck the PLO charter still calls for the destruction of Israel.  In addition, the Old Testament (basically the Jewish charter though some will only consider the first 5 books) pretty much sets the Jews up against everybody else.  If we stay allies with Israel then we'll also be at war with the Arabs.  Oh since you'll mention it, I do think we should stay allies with them.  Why?  Well if you read the Book they win and everyone else gets wasted.  The Bible predicted they would become a nation again and they did and that's not the only thing it has predicted.  Besides it just plain makes sense.

But getting back to the original topic.  I wish to refine my initial post.  The point of an interrogation is to scare someone into telling you the information you need.  In the US police take a suspect into a room and 3 of them will scream all sorts of stuff at them and threaten all kinds of terrible consequences if they don't confess (yes they can lie).  Personally I think this is wrong except in a life or death situation.  But with these combatants it is a life or death situation.  In addition, it is a whole lot harder to scare one of them than a US citizen.  So yes you do more.  Now if they turn out to be "not guilty" then you give them a $100,000 and turn them loose.  Yes I stated it give them money (over there you can live like a king with $100k US).  That would be at least a small compensation for going through psychological hell.

4896
Personally I think we should treat these non-uniformed combatants like spies.  Give them a military tribunal for trial, if found guilty (i.e. they were fighting or otherwise opposing uniformed troops without wearing uniforms themselves), then take them out and shoot them.  As far as torture, we simply must not permanently leave a mark on them (hit them, but don't bruise them) except to execute them.  As far a counsel and all that jazz, give them a JAG officer, that's it.

As far as spending money on education and all that, forget it.  The Arabs have been at war with everyone since Biblical times, we will never change that.  They will be at war with everyone even if the U.S. cease to exist.  Isreal has also fought them for 1000's of years, giving up land for peace is stupid - they will never be at peace.

4897
General Off-Topic Board / Re: are you voting this year?
« on: June 29, 2004, 06:05:51 PM »
I always vote, if you don't what right have you to complain?

Freak is the best, Freak is the best!  Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!
I don't like calling you Freak, I'd rather call you  Normal Nice Guy.

4898
I am in the same situation as jfbruin, in addition, I might ride my bike for 10 blocks or so.  I would like a pack capable of handling all this.  But $165 for a backpack?  Maybe I'll check ebay.

4899
I told my boss almost a year ago and he's been cool, he even promoted me, but now that it's getting closer to August I am beginning to get poor shifts and I've already trained my replacement.  I finally said something to the scheduling manager and this next schedule I have better shifts so we'll see.  In general I think I did the right thing, but maybe not the most financially astute.

4900
Ok I suppose a Christian ought to weigh in on this topic even though I'd rather not.

Issue: Are all lawyers going to hell?
Holding: no, all lawyers are not going to hell.

Analysis:  To a Christian the Bible is like the casebook, statutes and executive commands all in one (i.e. the law).  Why do people go to hell?  Sin (Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.".  What is sin?  Well for the point of this discussion it's dicta, because of Romans 3:23 (For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God may differ slightly depending on translation)  However, to help those who don't know (Ecclesiastes 12:13) "Fear God and keep his commands for this is the whole duty of man."  If we don't Fear God and keep his commands then we sin.  So great we say, we're all going to hell because we all have sinned.  Well the answer is in Romans 10:9 "If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead then you will be saved."  Once someone has done this they are a Christian (whether or not they are a lawyer).

So why then do these "Jesus Freaks" have so much against lawyers?  Well there is a general feeling among the public that lawyers must lie to do their jobs or more specifically "bear false witness."  (See Exodus 20:15 "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor."  They simple don't understand that lawyers don't (shouldn't) bear false witness that would be against the law.  They may emphasize their clients strong points and down play their weaknesses (even do their best to keep them from being mentioned) but they dare not lie for fear of being disbarred.  In fact, Romans 13:1-2 "Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities.  For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.  Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves."  Therefore lawyers representing their clients to the best of their ability are following the law (and therefore God).  

It gets a bit sticky in this country because authority basically rests with the majority with laws made to protect minorities.  It's especially sticky because the Bible is one looooong case and finding all the black letter law will never be done.  However, a Christian should treat the Bible like a constitution, if the law of the land contradicts the Bible then you follow the Bible, if not you must follow the law of the land. (ok so this paragraph is mostly dicta).

Anyway, a lawyer can be a Christian; a Christian lawyer might represent Christians taken to court.  Perhaps they have a "calling" to represent the poor or maybe they feel called to help influence the law of the land to a more Christian bend.  Whatever the case may be there certainly are places for them to practice law as Christians.  

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