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Messages - afer1500

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Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 04:42:54 PM »
insulting the people who can't find jobs as having no personality or interview skills is not a wise idea. I know a LOT of these people, and I can say that for many of them, this is just untrue. It's a tight market right now, and while I don't think that's an excuse to sit on your butt, it does mean that a lot of desirable people can't find a paying job. Karma is a bitchh on this kind of stuff, so I suggest you stay humble at this early stage in your legal career and be grateful for someone giving you a break.
And no, I'm not bitter--I have a job, I just feel very badly for my friends who (through no fault of their own) don't.

Sorry if it came across that way not my intent at all. My point is that the market is not as tight as some make it out to be and there are mamy people in law school who really don't present themselves as personable or motivated to find work. Also the lack of interview experience hurts people as well. Thats just my 2 cents. Not a shot at people who have not found work.

Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 04:02:35 PM »
I would like to make two points on different subjects:

#1 Take the job at $10.00 most 1L's are doing unpaid internships this summer.  Getting paid anything rocks, plus taking over for a paralegal instead of just doing legal research will teach you how to actually DO stuff, which is invaluable if you want to practice in the field.

#2 I don't understand why the people who can't find jobs can't find jobs.  I'm at a T4, and have a paying job lined up.  My school is well respected locally, but pretty much unheard of on the wider market.  So, I'm staying in town.  I wonder if the jobless posters' interviewing abilities aren't up to par, and that includes cover letter writing, and resume writing.  Having great numbers won't always overcome horrible presentation. 
I also wonder what markets and types of jobs they are looking at.  There are plenty of jobs out there, just not plenty of BIGLAW jobs.

I think #2 is right on par. There are so many law students out there w/ great numbers who have the personality of a house plant or who have never been on an interview. This makes a difference. I've always found work throughout my life and the law field will be no exception...

#1 the more I think about the more I think you are right. I still want to make a counter just because I know that a few of the positions I have lined up pay atleast 12-15 per hour and I think one of those will pan out.

Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 02:31:26 PM »
I'm in the top half of my law school at a T1 (30-40 range) and made 10/hr last year, during my 2L summer.  I worked for a solo back in my hometown and it was the only offer I had to do any legal work.  If I were you, I'd take the job and not even ask for more money.  You don't want to sound like you have a sense of entitlement. 

I might still take the position but I don't really think a counter makes you come across as being entitled. But you make a good point. I'm going to ask some people I know who own firms in Miami and see how the feel about a 1L making a counter offer.

Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 02:28:31 PM »
I don't doubt you that's why I asked I'm interested in your perspective. But truthfully I just don't get it, I've been on 10 interviews and have sent out 50-60 applications. All the larger firms have been rejections w/out even a request for an interview which I expected. But I have not had trouble getting interviews with middle of the pack firms, true I have not had an offer prior to this one, but I have not received a rejection letters from any of the firms I've interviewed w/. So those may still pan out. I think the market is slow but there is work out there, it goes beyond even networking. My group of friends has roughly 6 ppl in it. One person has work w/ a small firm similar to my situation and a backup plan to clerk for a judge if she decides last minute to 86 the firm idea. I have another friend who got a position in Columbus w/ Tucker, Ellis, & West.(this was all through prior connections) My other friends are working on finding work but they have not had trouble getting interviews. I think the market you are in matters and it seems like some places have more work.

As for the threads on this site...
LSD is a small % of ppl in law school. I really take the posts about work trouble w/ a grain of salt b/c many people in law school are straight out of undergrad and I hate to say it but they have terrible personalities. IMO the biggest thing is getting an interview. Once you've got the interview the person w/ the lowest rank can get the position because a huge part of it is personality.

LSD is a small % of ppl in law school...

Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 02:08:48 PM »
I deleted the post because its not getting across my point. Not sure how the study was done but I don't have any reason to doubt the numbers. 63k per year after graduation. I agree maybe it was only the student with well paying jobs. What is your experience(s) w/ the system? Are you a recent graduate? Do you go to law school? grad school?

I'm willing to listen to you but tell my why I should? What is you expertise in this field? How do you know a person in my situation is lucky to have been offered a position?

I'll hang up and listen, Mclovin.

Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 01:58:49 PM »
I appreciate the advice. I'm going to ask for more. I'll probably pass on the position unless they accept 15 P/H. I'd rather not work this summer and just take classes if it means I will only be banking 10 per hour. I don't subscribe the school of thought that t4 = poverty. Recent study came out that had the T4 I attend in the top half of earnings 9 months after graduation. Take that for what its worth. We'll see what happens tomorrow I'll email the gentleman tonight.

Job Search / Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 01:04:57 PM »
I was offered a job in a city about 35-45 minutes away. Small firm, salary is 10 per hour. I'll be taking over for the paralegal (and his duties) all summer long (leaving to take the bar)he does all the paperwork for immigration, juvenile court, etc. I'll also be translating at court on certain days, and some other clerk work. They've offered 10 dollars per hour w/ a review at 90 days for a possible raise. The owner guaranteed position when I graduate and pass the bar (salary unknown). I'll also have work on a p/t basis during the fall of next year and whenever I'm free. I'm top 25% at T4. The salary is imo insanely low and I'm wondering if I should counter, further is it appropriate to make a counter offer at this stage in the game. I think I'm probably the top candidate from either of the two schools near the firm because I can speak and write in Spanish which is the firms main clientèle and really no one in these area seems to speak or write spanish. Advice appreciated.

Job Search / Job offer hypo
« on: January 30, 2008, 05:09:34 PM »
If you are going in for interviews right now, possibly for PI work or internships w/ Prosecutors office and an offer is made...What is the appropriate way to say "I like this offer but I want to see if something better/different/paying may come along"

Job Search / Re: Include class rank and % in resume?
« on: January 26, 2008, 01:11:52 PM »
As an initial matter, the others are right and you should check before you include something that the school didnt give to you.  At most schools at least a couple students will drop out in disgust or leave for other reasons after 1st semester.  If and when that happens, you'll be 34 in a class of 132 or 133 and 26% wont be accurate anymore. 

That being said, I'd put a percentage in if I could, and only for the stupidest reason - somehow I think 1/3 instictively comes to mind you look at 34/133 quickly and dont take a second to do the math in your head. 

Regardless, "Top 26%" screams retarded.  I think "26th Percentile" is maybe a better way of expressing it.

I pretty much took this advice. The 34/133 takes into account the students who dropped out after 1st semester. I decided to just put top 30% and my class rank. In doing this I don't scream tool to such a huge degree than if I had put top 26%. I appreciate all the advice ppl...

Job Search / Re: Include class rank and % in resume?
« on: January 26, 2008, 08:08:17 AM »
I don't intend to lie I just wanted to confirm what I should put in my resume

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