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Messages - anonomous

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The reason why I would be ok with economic affirmative actions is because yes, people who have money do have better opportunity to do well on things like standardized tests.  Race, if there is equal opportunity, doesn't inhibit you from doing well on a test if races do have equal capability (which i believe we all do).  As far as character, I think that we all have character building experiences no matter what race we are.  I also came from a high school that really wasn't accepting of Christians at times.  I got picked on a lot when I was younger because I held firm to Christian ideals.  However, these types of discrimination aren't looked at.  I think that character is race neutral, either you have it or you don't.  There are social stigmas for everyone these days, just in different forms (though you probably do have a better perspective on that that I do). 

We don't agree about the girl I knew in high school.  She was very bright, as were many people from my school.  She also knew that the advantage she was getting wasn't fair, and turning that opportunity down took a TON of that character you've been talking about.  Doing the right thing isn't always the most advantagious to yourself.  Oh, and explain to me how it is telling that I can't remember specifics?  I remember her saying "i turned it down because it wasn't a fair way to get it."  That's not all that hard to remember.  It is hard to remember how many community service hours she had, or who wrote a letter of reccomendation.  It just seemed normal compared to everyone else. 

I think we should eliminate affirmative action simply because I truely believe that the problems will fix themselves if we address the other problems causing the issue.  But, at the time being, reverse discrimination isn't the answer.

As far as answering your comments on economic affirmative action, I honestly had trouble understanding what you were meaning (i don't mean that sarcastically at all).  Could you paraphrase it again? 

As far as the girl from my high school, the point was that she didn't have anything outstanding compared to anyone else in my school.  Yes, she was very smart, and yes, she had a lot going for her, but there were also white students who had just as much going for her and who were smarter than she was.  I don't remember all the specifics (this was four years ago), but I do remember her even admitting that it wasn't at all fair.  This is why she turned down the opportunity. 

Yes, I quote King.  There are plenty of whites who have just as much character as minorities.  They aren't being judged by their character, they are being judged by their race.  That is what AA is designed to do. 

I definately agree with the LSAT.  I think it's stupid that 4 hours can determine how qualified someone is.  There should be many more considerations than that.  And, I agree that things need to be done to make everyone on an equal playing field.  That being said, if this is the standard, why can't the minorities that 'James Bond' speaks of do as well?  If they have the money, they have the same opportunity.  If they don't, they don't have the same opportunity.  This is why it should be done on class, not race.  Bond also says that "failure is the individual's fault."  I can turn this around.  Minorities need to stop blaming white America and take the responsibility. 

I think that there definately should be policy implemented to fix the problems of equality.  However, I don't see the equality being a race problem as much as financial.  If your poor, your public education will be worse than if you can afford private or prep schools.  But, I think the answer to equality is to fix the educational experiences at a younger age.  I think affirmative action used to be effective, but I think it is getting more and more outdated.  I think that if you are going to have legislation, it must be fair to everyone, and have as few holes as possible.  Flawed laws don't need to be anywhere in our system. 

You can easily take race off an application.  You can also take the names off.  For admissions purposes you can assign a case number or code names, etc.  Professors do it for grading essays all the time...

First off, this is just one personal experience.  And yes, it is isolated, but I have heard of many stories like this.  But more importanly, it shows how the AA system is so very flawed.  It isn't necessarily helping the disadvantaged, it is helping the people of a certain skin color or ethnic background.  If it is the disadvantaged you are all worried about, why not do as somebody earlier stated and replace AA with a program that gives preferance to the economically poor and disadvantaged?  The way things work now, a minority that is filthy rich can get the same advantages as somebody who is in poverty.  Plus, there are plenty of white kids that are just as poor and disadvantaged as the minorities.  What do you say to them?

There is no way that this is a cure.  I'm sure you've heard these arguments, and will probably just insult them, but they are very valid. First, this won't help solve racism.  If anything it will make a lot of white people resent minorities.  No matter if that is justified or not, you are going to have people who feel like they were cheated out of a position in a school or a job.  That isn't going to make them like the person who they think didn't deserve it.

Second, it is telling the white people that they have to do twice as good to get ahead, and it is telling the minorities that they can do pretty good, and the government will get them the rest of the way.  Is that really an accomplishment?  Many successful minorities are against affirmative action because they feel they will always have it in the back of their mind that maybe their success had some sort of aid.  Jerome Holmes, recently appointed as Justice of the 10th Circuit of Appeals, is publically against it, and he is an African American man.  Dinesh D'Souza, an Indian immigrant author, is another prominant individaul with that mindset. 

Finally, what would be wrong with eliminating the race box altogether on applications?  There would be no way to give preference to anyone who is white or any other color.  Instead, be more specific about life's other circumstances.  That would be the way to have a more equal application process. 

Affirmative action on the surface seems like a good idea, but in reality it doesn't address the right things.  Consider a situation that I had back when I was in high school.  There was a girl who was half hispanic who lived in a similar neighborhood as many of the white kids, thus being from a similar financial background.  She had the same educational opportunities as the whites, and she was in the top 10% of the class.  She was offered a full-ride to an ivy-league school, and nobody else in the top 10% was even offered a full-ride to the state schools(including the valedictorian).  Admirably, this girl turned down this scholarship because she wanted to get it off merit, not because of her race.  However, to get back to the point, how is this correcting the "social injustices" that many of you are speaking of?  She had the same opportunities as the rest of us, but yet got much better rewards for similar results.  I do agree that there is a correlation with race and socio-economic standing, so address that.  But addressing the issue by race alone is downright wrong.

Martin Luther King said, "I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."  Does affirmative action do this?

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: deferal?
« on: August 03, 2006, 06:23:20 PM »
Oh ok, yes, I had seem something like what lawnecon had said, and it was Notre Dame actually who was mentioned on the old post.  The deferal thing didn't sound like something I wanted to do all that much, but if they are going to give big dollars then it would be tempting....

Choosing the Right Law School / deferal?
« on: August 03, 2006, 02:14:41 PM »
I'm new to all of this application process stuff, so don't hate me for being ignorant.  How does this defferal thing work?  I was reading and old post and they were talking about getting more money by getting a deferal?  I know this means you take the year off, but other than that what does it do for you?


Choosing the Right Law School / Re: fee waiver
« on: August 03, 2006, 01:42:36 PM »
So does this mean I won't apply for need based scholarships/grants?  My "expected" parental contribution is $0.00, but they "could" give some. 

Also, my dad is very sick and pays incredible medical bills each year, could this prove to them that my parents can't afford to pay me?

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: fee waiver
« on: August 03, 2006, 12:21:32 PM »
Is there anyone who has recieved the LSDAS fee waiver?  Or do you know anyone who has?  I tried calling them up but the guy I talked to was a jerk, and was not helpful or informative at all. 

On that note, am I the only one who thinks I'm getting ripped off?  109 dollars?!!?! >:(  I could easily do all of that work myself!  For that money, the least they could do would be to submit applications, but no, they have to charge 12 more dollars for each application.  Isn't this a monopoly? 

Ok, I'm done ranting.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: fee waiver
« on: August 03, 2006, 09:59:03 AM »
So are any of you people who are getting fee-waiver notices applying for these?  Do they just send them out for whoever?  Or do they send them to people for certain scores?  I know I've heard there are merit-based fee waivers, but how do you get these?

Studying for the LSAT / Re: # of questions wrong = what score?
« on: August 02, 2006, 01:58:21 PM »
I don't think that they release those unless you buy the practice tests....  I'm sure you do know that you can look at the old tests and see the raw score next to the actual score.  I took the test in June.  I can tell you that my raw score was 78, and I got a 161.

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