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Messages - Jeffort

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101
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Studying for the LSAT....need tips
« on: April 28, 2010, 02:18:35 PM »
Hey all,

Wondering if people have any good advice about how to go about effectively self-studying for the LSAT.  I am studying for the October LSAT, and am taking a full length Powerscore in July.  Until them I have the 3 Powerscore bibles, and am setting apart 3-4 hours per day as I am taking summer classes, and them starting a 40 hr. per week job in June.

Any tips on how I should work through the bibles/take practice tests? Curious on what worked for people...

Thanks

Seatown42

You are certainly trying to cover all the bases, which is a good thing.  

I typically prefer students in classes I've taught to not have done much pre-class self study except for familiarization of the basics of the exam and the process, stuff like section types, time restraints, deadlines, etc.  Tabula Rosa - starting with a clean slate, otherwise students come in with faulty conceptions of the concepts and effective approaches that are a pain to undo once formed.

However, given the circumstances you described you are going to be very busy during the time you are taking the class leading up to test day.  I'm not sure how you are going to be able to fit in the necessary time for LSAT homework/study/practice while working full time and taking summer classes.  

With your set of circumstances RE: time demands I don't see a problem with you starting to review/peruse the bibles now as time permits.  Since your class is from the same company as the books there is consistency with the methodology and techniques, that is a good thing.  

A very bad thing many people do is buy every prep book out there and then they get lost and confused by all the various different approaches/descriptions/techniques/etc.  It's important to stick with one method from one quality source.  The LSAT is complicated and confusing enough as it is, why add another layer of confusion...

At this point in time you should toss out the idea of starting to take timed practice tests.  Basically, learn to walk before you try to run.  Plus, you don't want to burn through all the available questions before receiving proper instruction and being able to ask questions and get feedback from a good instructor.  

For your described circumstances I say go ahead and leisurely read through the bibles and work through the drills and supplied questions in slow motion leading up till your class starts.  As you do that keep a running list of errors, things you are confused about, things that messed you up, etc. so that you have a sheet of your issues to ask the instructor directly about once class starts.  Take advantage of your instructor.  The better and more precise your questions, the better answers and advice you will get.

And to reiterate, DO NOT START TAKING A BUNCH OF TIMED PRACTICE TESTS NOW!!!  Please don't do the 'churn and burn'.

102
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Can anyone explain this flaw question?
« on: February 03, 2010, 01:18:10 PM »
no insult to "changed name" but the discussion of probability in the way he described it is completely irrelevant.  Since about half are approved there is a dependency between the denied and approved sets.

You don't know this.  If the approval or denial was based on a coin flip (meaning about half get approved), there would be no dependency.

Quote
Earlcat's explanation is out of scope.  There is no reason to believe we need more information about the procedures of budget approval.  Either it is approved or it isn't.  Assuming there is more information to budget approval is the type of out of scope thinking LSAC does not want you to do.

Fail.  Try actually reading my post.  I never said we NEED more information.  I said we don't have enough information--that is, enough information to conclude the trivial nonsense you're rattling on about.  If you read further you'll find that, "the only important thing" is the assumption between the  premise and the conclusion.  Discussing the necessary assumption in a necessary assumption question is hardly outside the scope.  (But nice try on the Kaplan buzzword.)

You're getting into the weeds with your (completely inaccurate) analysis of the veracity of the argument.  If you're ever going to conquer this test, you need to realize that the subject matter is completely irrelevant to solving the problem.  The thinking has to take place at a more abstract level where you can apply similar reasoning to every problem.  Your treatise on the budget approval process, even if it was helpful for this problem (which it's not), is of absolutely no use on any other problem.  

If the question had read, "Our next budget proposal will probably be approved, because normally about half of all budget proposals that the vice president considers are approved, and last night was a full moon," the same type of assumption is present ("the stage of the moon affects the likelihood that the next budget proposal will be turned down"), but your analysis goes out the window.  Do you see how the number of budget proposals is now completely irrelevant?  Do you see how the fact that half of the proposals are approved is completely irrelevant?  Well, all of that was completely irrelevant in the first place.

Let's say there are 10 requests and the last 5 are denied then the next one will likely be approved.

Good grief, now you're making the same stupid assumption the author did!



lol at the Kaplan reference.  I was thinking the same thing and almost posted the question 'llsatt1, have you been drinking the Kaplan cool-aide?'

llsatt1, you are all over the place and have even contradicted yourself a few times with your analysis.  

Let's start from scratch and make sure you understand the question stem because I think that might be where your misunderstanding is partially coming from.  The reasoning is FLAWED because it 'presumes, without giving warrant, that'.  The presumes without warrant part is equivalent to saying assumes or assumption, meaning that you are supposed to be selecting the answer choice that states a faulty assumption the conclusion of the argument is relying on.  Since it tells you that the reasoning is flawed BECAUSE of the assumption, it is asking you to identify an assumption that is not reasonable or logical to make.  

It boils down in part to the difference between warranted and unwarranted assumptions.  

To illustrate this in general terms about warranted vs. unwarranted/flawed assumptions:

Is it safe to assume that when it rains that the streets get wet?  ABSOLUTELY!  That is a warranted assumption.  
Is it safe to assume that when somebody is talking about an alligator or a snake that they are talking about a reptile even if they don't specifically say they are reptiles?  Yes, that is common sense.  

As it applies to this LR question, is it safe to assume that past events and the statistics about them (remember, statistics are compilations of data about many past events over time calculated into averages and other statistical measures) will determine or likely determine what is going to happen with the next event regarding the subject matter in question?  NO!  That is a logically flawed unwarranted assumption.

I'd bet that if you went to Vegas or a casino somewhere and played roulette that your reasoning and betting strategy would be something like 'the last 5 spins came up black so red is due and going to hit next' and bet red.  

llsatt1, you need to learn the common flawed methods of reasoning much better as well as learn logically valid methods of reasoning and be able to tell the difference between the two sets.  If you're getting your LSAT prep from a Kaplan book or something related or like that, put it down and get some prep from a quality source with quality materials.  

Earlcat knows his $hit about all this and so do I.  

If you want to get good advice and improve your score, instead of being combative/argumentative/recalcitrant or whatever, I suggest you listen to advice from people that know this stuff by asking questions for clarification or whatever in a friendly way instead of vigorously trying to defend flawed and incorrect reasoning.  

One common type of counter productive attitude people prepping for the test get and let guide themselves (which leads them to not doing as well as possible) is trying to argue with the test and fighting and arguing that the credited answer choice is not or should not be correct.  

The test is very well constructed and put together with tons of extensive quality control and review procedures before a question appears on an administered exam in a scored section in order to make sure the logic and everything is sound.  There have been very few of the 5000+ administered questions that were later removed from scoring due to flaws.  I can count them all on two hands, barely needing the fingers of my second hand.

You are preparing for the LSAT.  Earlcat, myself, and many other people on this and other related boards have achieved 99% scores (high 170 range) and have been teaching and tutoring people for the LSAT for many years.  Instead of fighting with us, just ask questions and we'll be glad to help.  

103
Who's Jeffort?

That's like asking Who is Elvis!  :D

New PSA:  www.lsatdiscussion.com is back up and I Jeffort am back at your service for LSAT prep advice and also for some online fun. 

104
Studying for the LSAT / Re: How much time did you spend studying?
« on: January 05, 2010, 11:55:37 PM »
I've heard something about "peaking" too early with LSAT study; would studying now lead to that early "peaking" before the June test?

This "peaking" stuff is a bunch of nonsense.  This would be like worrying about starting to practice too early before a violin recital.  The LSAT is a skill test.  While you might get rusty if you stop practicing for a good length of time, you shouldn't expect to lose skill by practicing for too many months.



105
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Thanks Guys! My LSAT Experience
« on: January 05, 2010, 08:08:54 PM »

Wow!  Great posts/thread you made.  

Very cool of you to take the time to do that and give back to others.  The world needs more people like you with your attitude, perspective and generosity.  You have my respect.  

I hope when scores come out you receive good news that will make you happy and be a good payoff to you for your efforts.  

As for why they prohibited using mechanical pencils to take the LSAT, I've been confused about the philosophy behind that policy change since it went into effect and have various competing theories.  Perhaps we should speculate about that and maybe even make a thread for the topic!

Some of my random theories:

-  So that angry frustrated test takers don't have possession of a super sharp pointed cylindrical object made out of metal or strong synthetic material that can be used to shank a proctor or fellow testee with in a fit of rage.

-  LSAC was tired of getting complaints from people about being distracted during the test by clicking noises around them. (the ADD/ADHD people tend to be of above average intelligence and make up a decent proportion of those seeking LS but are easily distracted and thrown off by little noises when trying to hyper focus!)

-  LSAC was lobbied by the lumber industry and by the companies that make old fashioned pencils but not mechanical ones to help beef up sales of wooden pencils and pencil sharpeners.  

-  The sharp point of mechanical pencil 'lead' punched holes in the bubble sheets of test takers that were angry, push down hard and use a lot of pressure bubblers causing paper jams in the scanning machines at LSAC headquarters (this relates to theory #1, but better to have holes in paper than in someones flesh!)

-  Cuz the SAT and other standardized tests banned them cuz a bunch of cheating HS kids wrote out cheat sheets and stuff on small strips of paper they rolled up and stuck inside the tube of a mechanical pencil a number of years back to get into college.

Anyone have other theories?  



LOL. The ADD/ADHD comment is great. My first diagnostic score was 152, second time it was 149 (tiny distractions). This is very frustrating. I am in the process of getting diagnosed with ADD; so this was much needed comic relief considering my lowering score.  ;)


Glad I was able to provide some comic relief and raise your spirits.  

Good luck with the ADD diagnosis thing and with the subsequent meds/treatment they Rx if it is confirmed that you have it.  I hope you are being assessed and treated by an ADD/ADHD specialist and not by a general practitioner.  It's a complex condition with variations and finding the right ADD/ADHD medication and dosage that works for you can be difficult and typically requires a time period of trial and error and adjustments to get it right. Of the main 4 commonly Rx'd meds, Adderall, Dexedrine, Desoxyn, and Ritalin, different people experience wildly different results from each.  For example, many people that have been put on Desoxyn end up going pretty nutty from it while it works well for others.  

I've got plenty of experience with and knowledge about this condition for many reasons.  

There are also dietary/nutritional things you can do that help a lot with it.

Check out http://www.addforums.com/ for a wealth of information and experiences etc. from fellow ADD/ADHDers  ;)



Thanks

Thanks for that link, it has a lot of good information. I live in KS, I haven't found a specialist yet. I was diagnosed yesterday and I have a med eval in a couple of weeks. My practitioner also believes meds will help me a lot. I look forward to the results considering that I do terrible in reading comprehension specifically due to ADD, this alone would raise my score significantly. Anyway, thank you.


Good luck with it all.  Just realize that it is a condition that can, when managed properly, be used to your advantage, especially with all the information overloads you get everywhere these days.

I don't understand how the cable news channels expect people to be able to read the running really fast ticker tape at the bottom as well as pay attention to the broadcast, especially when there are three talking heads arguing and talking over each other at the same time.  My simple request is that one person talk at a time and let the one talking finish his/her sentence.  It aggravates me a lot when people disrespectfully talk over others and don't even let the person they are having a conversation with finish a sentence.  How else are you going to have a meaningful conversation and know what you are responding to if you don't let the other person speak a full sentence that you listen to?   That type of stuff really bothers me.


106
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Ear plugs when taking the LSAT
« on: January 04, 2010, 01:25:27 PM »

I think this thread should be locked.  It is ridiculous how many replies this ridiculous post is getting, and ironically I'm adding to that number.  ???

Based on your hostile and ridiculous posts filled with anger and unreasonableness that borders on sounding like the rantings of a mental patient in a manic phase, perhaps you are the thing that deserves to be locked up and then properly medicated.  

Asking and talking about earplugs is a legitimate topic.  Some people, like ones with ADD/ADHD get easily distracted and thrown off their train of thought by stray noises.  

Plus, there have been administrations where the schools marching band was practicing right next to the building the test was being administered in.

As far as I can tell, part of the justification for the no earplugs policy (they used to allow them) is to make sure students can and do hear the instructions and the section time notifications (like 5 minutes left or section over, move ahead to the next section).  

There also may be and I suspect that other reasons for the policy change and prohibition of them is related to test security to prevent cheating due to all the new tech communication devices that have become available.  There are ones you can hide inconspicuously in your ear, communicate with, and use as a method to get assistance with the test while taking it to cheat your way into a higher score.



may I also say, that if you side with those who would not make a simple gesture as sharing an answer key, that you too are a c*nt?  

Sir, if you legitimately obtain your LSAT materials the answer keys are included.  Unless LSAC made a policy change I'm unaware of that first started being applied to the December 2009 test (they did not!), it is and has always been the case that if you take the test and cancel your score, when scores are released you have access to the full test you took AND the corresponding answer key.  You just don't get to see the answer choices you selected.  

LSAC has not changed that policy:
http://www.lsac.org/pdfs/InformationBookweb.pdf
Page #23

"If you cancel your score, you will not receive a score or copy of your answer sheet.  You will receive written notification of a score cancellation and, if you took a disclosed test,  you will receive a copy of the test questions and the credited responses for the scored sections as well."

Cussing at and referring to people with derogatory terms for refusing to break the law and the legally binding agreement they entered into with LSAC to take the test to try to get into Law School illustrates your character and lack of ethics.  

If you actually did take the December test did you look carefully at your available candidate and test disclosure information on the LSAC web page while logged in?  There are multiple files in PDF form that you have to download individually.  

If in fact you have a copy of the December test and do not have the answer key there are two main possibilities:

#1  You didn't actually take the test and are infringing copyrights by getting the test files from someone that did take it but they didn't also email you their candidate score report (the document that contains the answer key).

#2  You did take the test and simply haven't found the candidate score report pdf file in your account.

Based on your behavior/posts you seem to be a dishonest person that lacks good moral character, honesty and integrity.

Please stop being a hostile jack-arse.


#1  I am not dishonest, but no matter what I say you won't believe that because you are an angel who doesn't sin.

Edit:  I think it is worth noting that I have provided many people with useful and valid advice.  Anyone who thinks otherwise either doesn't know what they're talking about or is just hating.  I am not a dishonest person.  I'm not a saint like you and vesperholly and even Irrx, but hey, I'm human, unlike all of you. :D

#2  My calling you a c*nt isn't any worse than you scorning me.  I didn't post vesperholly's inital reaction when I asked for the answer key, but the word she used was far worse, and it started with an F.

#3  Quit it with the sanctimonious attitude.  Somebody providing me the answer key would simply be sharing.  It's not as if I would put it online to be pirated.  If that was my true intention, I could easily wait until late January to get a copy of the test.  People who think I'm so cheap as to pay the few bucks for the test are out of their minds.  I suppose it's possible if someone is dirt poor, but I am not.

#4  Is a pirated copy of the December 2009 LSAT even available online? I don't think it is.

Dude, you claimed that you took the December 2009 LSAT, have a copy of the test and asked others to give you the answer key.  

It's simple, if in fact you did take the test and have a copy of it you have access to the answer key via logging into your account at www.lsac.org whether you cancelled or not. Scores have been released, the test form disclosure including the score conversion chart and answer key is available to any person that took a disclosed version of the test (unlike international test takers or Saturday Sabbath people that took it on Monday, they don't get any test content disclosure).

http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/prelaw/index.php/topic,4022483.msg5372224.html#msg5372224

I just got this personal message from someone with the screen name llsatt1:

Would you be so kind as to send me the answer key for the December LSAT.  You should be able to just save it to your computer from LSAC and email it.  I would really appreciate it if you could!

How do you guys handle this? For the record, I think it's a jackass maneuver.

So what is the problem and why are you being very combative with everyone?


107
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Ear plugs when taking the LSAT
« on: January 03, 2010, 04:27:56 PM »

I think this thread should be locked.  It is ridiculous how many replies this ridiculous post is getting, and ironically I'm adding to that number.  ???

Based on your hostile and ridiculous posts filled with anger and unreasonableness that borders on sounding like the rantings of a mental patient in a manic phase, perhaps you are the thing that deserves to be locked up and then properly medicated. 

Asking and talking about earplugs is a legitimate topic.  Some people, like ones with ADD/ADHD get easily distracted and thrown off their train of thought by stray noises. 

Plus, there have been administrations where the schools marching band was practicing right next to the building the test was being administered in.

As far as I can tell, part of the justification for the no earplugs policy (they used to allow them) is to make sure students can and do hear the instructions and the section time notifications (like 5 minutes left or section over, move ahead to the next section). 

There also may be and I suspect that other reasons for the policy change and prohibition of them is related to test security to prevent cheating due to all the new tech communication devices that have become available.  There are ones you can hide inconspicuously in your ear, communicate with, and use as a method to get assistance with the test while taking it to cheat your way into a higher score.



may I also say, that if you side with those who would not make a simple gesture as sharing an answer key, that you too are a c*nt? 

Sir, if you legitimately obtain your LSAT materials the answer keys are included.  Unless LSAC made a policy change I'm unaware of that first started being applied to the December 2009 test (they did not!), it is and has always been the case that if you take the test and cancel your score, when scores are released you have access to the full test you took AND the corresponding answer key.  You just don't get to see the answer choices you selected. 

LSAC has not changed that policy:
http://www.lsac.org/pdfs/InformationBookweb.pdf
Page #23

"If you cancel your score, you will not receive a score or copy of your answer sheet.  You will receive written notification of a score cancellation and, if you took a disclosed test,  you will receive a copy of the test questions and the credited responses for the scored sections as well."

Cussing at and referring to people with derogatory terms for refusing to break the law and the legally binding agreement they entered into with LSAC to take the test to try to get into Law School illustrates your character and lack of ethics. 

If you actually did take the December test did you look carefully at your available candidate and test disclosure information on the LSAC web page while logged in?  There are multiple files in PDF form that you have to download individually. 

If in fact you have a copy of the December test and do not have the answer key there are two main possibilities:

#1  You didn't actually take the test and are infringing copyrights by getting the test files from someone that did take it but they didn't also email you their candidate score report (the document that contains the answer key).

#2  You did take the test and simply haven't found the candidate score report pdf file in your account.

Based on your behavior/posts you seem to be a dishonest person that lacks good moral character, honesty and integrity.

Please stop being a hostile jack-arse.

108
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Ear plugs when taking the LSAT
« on: January 03, 2010, 01:04:01 AM »

I think this thread should be locked.  It is ridiculous how many replies this ridiculous post is getting, and ironically I'm adding to that number.  ???

Based on your hostile and ridiculous posts filled with anger and unreasonableness that borders on sounding like the rantings of a mental patient in a manic phase, perhaps you are the thing that deserves to be locked up and then properly medicated. 

Asking and talking about earplugs is a legitimate topic.  Some people, like ones with ADD/ADHD get easily distracted and thrown off their train of thought by stray noises. 

Plus, there have been administrations where the schools marching band was practicing right next to the building the test was being administered in.

As far as I can tell, part of the justification for the no earplugs policy (they used to allow them) is to make sure students can and do hear the instructions and the section time notifications (like 5 minutes left or section over, move ahead to the next section). 

There also may be and I suspect that other reasons for the policy change and prohibition of them is related to test security to prevent cheating due to all the new tech communication devices that have become available.  There are ones you can hide inconspicuously in your ear, communicate with, and use as a method to get assistance with the test while taking it to cheat your way into a higher score.


109
Studying for the LSAT / Re: LSAT score
« on: December 28, 2009, 10:53:12 PM »
It's a tough call to make and very much depends if you have decided 'have to get in this cycle'

Southwestern does accept February scores and llsatt1 is correct, their application deadline is April 1st.  But it's kinda fuzzy with the way they word it and imply that that is not an absolute deadline:


http://www.swlaw.edu/studentservices/jdadmin/applicants
Application Deadline

Applications are reviewed as they are completed. Students are therefore strongly advised to apply as early as possible and are encouraged to submit all application materials no later than April 1. Files submitted at later dates will be considered on an individual basis. Applicants should be aware, however, that waiting lists are often established as early as March, and eligibility for certain forms of financial aid most preferred by students (e.g., scholarship programs) may be reduced substantially after April 1.

However, no matter your GPA, you need a higher LSAT score to have a decent chance of admission.
See:  
http://www.swlaw.edu/studentservices/jdadmin/prospects





110
Studying for the LSAT / Re: other LSAT discussion boards
« on: December 28, 2009, 06:20:26 AM »
I know Jeffort had to delete all his old stuff from LSD and LSATdiscussion, but did he save it anywhere before deleting? It'd be great if he could repost it now.

In the process of reconstruction and rebuilding it.  It's up and running again now as the same no frills content based friendly board for students prepping for the test with experts available to provide free advice.

Unfortunately the previous server ate the content I wasn't able to archive but that doesn't prevent me from writing it again!  :)

It is and will be a troll and flame free LSAT prep zone as before, and of course fun and entertainment (like youtubes) is welcome. 

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