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Messages - Maintain FL 350

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: Non-American Law Schools
« on: June 28, 2012, 04:46:45 PM »
I'm not sure what European law school entrance exams consist of, but I'm sure it varies from country to country. Like I said before, in many EU countries a law degree is an LL.B or some other undergraduate degree. Standard university entrance exams are required for admission and resemble the SAT more than the LSAT. Math, history, biology, etc. Whether or not another law-specific test is required varies from country to country. Sometimes a separate exam might be required for law or medicine only if the major is impacted.

Here's the real issue, however: do you want to live in the U.S. after graduation? If so, there really is no point in pursuing a European law degree. Civil law degrees (most of continental Europe) are useless in the U.S. Common law degrees (U.K. and Ireland) may permit you to take some U.S. bar exams, but will not really help you at all when it comes time to get a job.   

The next issue is immigration. It is very difficult to move to Europe, they tend to be far stricter on immigration and employment than the U.S. Even if you were permitted to attend a European university, you would then have to begin the laborious task of seeking a work permit. Without joint US/European citizenship, this is very difficult. Most European countries have small economies and highly protectionist regulations. They really don't want foreign students or lawyers competing with the local talent.

General Off-Topic Board / Re: Obamacare upheld
« on: June 28, 2012, 12:20:46 PM »
I'm blown away. I figured maybe some of the bill would survive, but the individual mandate would be struck down 5-4. I thought there was a good chance the entire bill would get tossed.

It's still a far less comprehensive system than Europe, contrary to what conservatives argue. It's essentially a compromise: not socialized healthcare, but not pure free market either.

Where should I go next fall? / Re: USC vs GULC ????
« on: June 28, 2012, 12:15:05 PM »
I'm not sure I'd agree that both are "global", which I assume means that they have international reputations? Both are very good schools, but the vast, overwhelming majority of grads from either school stay in the U.S. In fact, in the case of USC, the majority of grads stay in California. Of course it's possible to score an international job from either school, but I think of "global" law schools (if they exist) as being Harvard, Yale, etc.

As far as taking the parent universities into account, I'd agree with you that Georgetown has an edge. There's always been a dichotomy with USC: some of its grad programs (law, medicine, film) are very well respected, but undergrad not so much. If you can afford the tuition, it seems that SC undergrad will accept just about anyone. Paris Hilton went there, need I say more?

L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 26, 2012, 07:43:40 PM »
However, I do think that the system is unfair, or at least clumsy, in that it does not provide a reasonable way for someone like me to prove competency, since most state's bar exams, by themselves, are apparently inadequate indicators of competency.

I would say that your ability to pass the toughest bar exam in the country is the best indication of your competency. If you can pass the CA bar exam you're doing better than the vast majority of wannabe lawyers. You'll always have to deal with some people who are clueless as to what you've accomplished, but that's life. I've always found it to be absurd that someone could pass the CA bar but be denied admission to Wyoming. Seriously?

Is it unconstitutional to prevent people from seeking a second J.D.? I dunno, but I would think not. Lots of law schools are private and can discriminate as much as they want as long as it's not based on suspect classification. As far as public schools like Berkeley, perhaps the rational basis is thatt hey don't want to create the legal version of community  colleges: institutions with open admissions which are used as a stepping stone to higher education.

I'm curious, what was your experience in law school like? I imagine that you still used the same books and followed the same general format as most ABA/CBE students?


L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 26, 2012, 03:10:58 PM »
Golden Gate, Western State, TJSL, and La Verne will accept only CBE/ABA units. Further, the general tone of their admissions info seems to indicate that CBE units may be accepted. La Verne's website further states that if accepted, CBE units will be limited to 29, while an ABA student can transfer 44. If none of those schools are willing to accept unaccredited units, who is?

L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 26, 2012, 10:53:41 AM »
Is an ABA-accredited school allowed to accept any transfer credits from an unaccredited school?

Yes.  Contrary to what some other posters have said, ABA schools CAN accept non-ABA credits.  They can even accept credits from non-law schools.  (For instance, Joint JD/MBA programs accept credits from business schools.)

Very, very, very few schools do, though.  To the best of my knowledge, there are only 2 or 3 and they're all in California.  Not to be demeaning, but generally speaking, look for the worst ABA accredited schools in California to begin your search. 

Outside of those very few schools, no other ABA accredited schools accept non-ABA law school credits, to the best of my knowledge.

That's interesting, I didn't know that. I had looked into transferring when I was in law school, and I remember that the various law schools' policies always stated  that credits from an ABA school would be accepted, period. But, if any ABA school would accept credits from a unaccredited law school it would be in California!

What do you think about the OP's status as a member of the bar? I think that might be a much bigger hurdle to overcome. Sorry, OP, I'm not trying to be rude. I'm actually kinda interested by the question: can you get accepted to an ABA JD program if you're already a lawyer?

I'm kinda fascinated by this place. Most DL law schools will gladly accept anyone who's willing to pay the tuition, but perhaps these guys are trying to do something else. Perhaps they are actually trying to start a respectable, selective online JD program. It's interesting. Do you know anything about the school's history, and who founded it?

L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 25, 2012, 07:55:48 PM »
If you plan to practice tax law an LL.M is a good idea, if you plan to work as an accountant only, it might not be worth the extra expense. Taxation, as I said before, is one of the few areas in which LL.Ms are often required/beneficial.

As far as programs in the LA area (my hometown too!), I'm not sure. I imagine that UCLA and USC have tax programs, and maybe Loyola. If you plan to open your own office it doesn't really matter where you go, you'll be your own boss. If you want to get into a decent sized firm, however, it matters alot. The bigger firms will want to see a bigger name, ideally someplace like NYU. Hiring at those places is very competitive.

Where should I go next fall? / Re: Entertainment/Media Law Schools
« on: June 25, 2012, 05:17:57 PM »
I worked at a very successful entertainment firm (as a clerk, not a lawyer) in LA. Some of the attorneys were from Ivies, others were from Loyola, and one was hired while still in law school at Southwestern. I met tons of lawyers from other entertainment firms at local bar association gatherings, etc as well as in-house counsel from the studios. Some went to T14 schools, but plenty were from Loyola, Southwestern, and Pepperdine. The people hired at the firm I worked at didn't have industry connections, but they did have extensive contracts/negotiations experience. I also worked at the largest film distribution and marketing association in the United States, and it was the same story. I don't remember all of the attorneys' bios, but we had T14 as well as Loyola/Southwestern, etc.

I agree, however, that specialty rankings (especially at non-elite law schools) are highly overrated. The fact that you can take a few classes in entertainment law will not really matter too much. As Jack24 said, a focus on agency/contracts is really what they look for. Think about where you want to live, because outside of truly elite national schools pretty much all law is local.

Of course, it will be easier to get internships and a job if you go to an elite school. But if you go to someplace like Loyola and focus on obtaining good, marketable experience, you can do fine. Just be realistic and informed about the costs and options.

Syracuse / Re: Warning regarding Syracuse Law
« on: June 25, 2012, 01:29:30 PM »
That's exactly right. Syracuse's mean is 2.9 - 3.11, which is not bad at all. Most of the people at my law school would have been thrilled with a mean that was anywhere close to 3.0. Grading was very harsh at my school, and many classes had a 2.5 - 2.7 mean. They actually got even tighter on grading in my last year because too many people were skating by with 2.0 -2.2 grades, and then failing the bar. 

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