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Messages - AmericanConsumer

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1
Transferring / Re: Top 5% @ T1- can I get into T14?
« on: January 10, 2007, 09:48:39 PM »
You'll lose your financial aid, but it's totally worth it for OCI alone.  If you're top 5% it may be true that you can "go almost anywhere," but if "anywhere" happens to be a region your school isn't in, you'll have to travel to interview, which is a serious pain in the ass.  At a T14 the employers come to you for OCI, and you'll probably end up with more options at the T14 simply because there are a ton more firms recruiting there.  Also if you plan on going to any of the truly elite firms, clerking, teaching, etc., a T14 is going to help out a lot.

For what it's worth, I'm a 3L who transferred from a T2 to a T14 last year, and it was one of the best decisions I ever made.

Edit: To answer your original question, yes you'll almost certainly be able to get into a T14.  Check out the databases on the transferapps group:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/transferapps/

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Transferring / Re: Miserable transfers?
« on: November 30, 2006, 10:53:21 PM »
Dude, assuming you're at Chicago, you don't have to write onto law review... You've probably got your job lined up already... The race is over man.  Relax.

3
Transferring / Re: Transfering Questions
« on: November 21, 2006, 12:31:28 AM »
1) You lose your rank, but when you do OCI you show the interviewers the transcript from your old school.  Some schools let you graduate with honors, etc.  others don't.

2) It depends on what you want to do.  If you'd like to take a public interest or public sector job that pays poorly, you'd be better off staying put.  If you want to work for a big firm that has a more prestige-driven hiring process, you'd be better off leaving.

3) At OCI firms generally viewed transfers in a positive light.  I went from a T2 (Case Western) to a T14, and had no problems getting the job I wanted.  Neither did any of the other transfers.  We did at least as well (if not better) than the "natives" at OCI. 

4
Transferring / Re: Do any schools give scholarships to transfers?
« on: July 24, 2006, 09:12:33 PM »
A lot of schools won't really give good students money to keep them from transferring.  Also for a lot of people the extra weight a t14 degree carries in the job market is entirely worth it.

That being said, I haven't heard of any school that gives transfers scholarship money.  I'm sure there are 1 or 2 somewhere that do, but it isn't common.

Yeah, that's sort of what I heard as well, just wondering if I'd missed something. I'm glad I'm happy where I'm at, as no scholarship would wound me DEEPLY. That sure makes transferring a much rougher decision, I'm surprised so many people aim for it.

5
Transferring / Re: Tulane/LSU?
« on: May 24, 2006, 04:23:54 AM »
Sorry, I'll have to disagree. This goes to having to know your specific market. LSU is viewed as being equal to Tulane in most of LA. It's better to come from LSU if you want to work in Baton Rouge actually. LSU students probably place a little worse in New Orleans, but that's about it. Throughout the rest of the state, LSU will get you just as far as Tulane...probably even more so because LSU alumni tend to stay in LA whereas Tulane grads tend to leave.

I'd ask the OP where he wants to work after Law school. If he wants to work in LA, then go to LSU and save the money. If he wants to head out of state, then go to Tulane.


Any advice...

I have to choose between transferring to LSU or Tulane.  While I prefer to attend Tulane, the cost is a big factor.  I would end up taking $50k more out in loans if I go to Tulane.  However, avg starting salary for Tulane grads is $83k and LSU grads is $48k. 


Any takers?? 

Tulane.

Based on the stats you just posted, you can expect to make up the difference in tuition roughly 18 months out of school.

Your grades and your school pretty much determine what kinds of jobs you'll be able to get.  Yes if you're "aggressive enough" you MAY get a high paying job out of LSU, unfortunately statistics are not on your side.  Of course you can always tell yourself that you'll be the one who "defies the odds" and that you're "more than a statistic," but the reality is, you probably won't. Firm don't care about how much "heart" or "moxy" you've got.  Aside from your school name and your grades, there's virtually no other way for them to make meaningful distinctions between the thousands of utterly fungible candidates they interview every year.

I actually thought there was no way in hell this could be true, but a quick glance at NALP, Martindale, and the ABA stats convinced me.  I guess it doesn't matter that much.

6
Transferring / Re: Is it worth it?
« on: May 24, 2006, 04:15:26 AM »
For what it's worth, Brian Leiter actually compiled a list of where all the tenure track faculty hired between 2000-2002 went to school:

http://www.leiterrankings.com/faculty/2000faculty_education.shtml


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Transferring / Re: Tulane/LSU?
« on: May 15, 2006, 04:30:44 AM »
Any advice...

I have to choose between transferring to LSU or Tulane.  While I prefer to attend Tulane, the cost is a big factor.  I would end up taking $50k more out in loans if I go to Tulane.  However, avg starting salary for Tulane grads is $83k and LSU grads is $48k. 


Any takers?? 

Tulane.

Based on the stats you just posted, you can expect to make up the difference in tuition roughly 18 months out of school.

Your grades and your school pretty much determine what kinds of jobs you'll be able to get.  Yes if you're "aggressive enough" you MAY get a high paying job out of LSU, unfortunately statistics are not on your side.  Of course you can always tell yourself that you'll be the one who "defies the odds" and that you're "more than a statistic," but the reality is, you probably won't. Firm don't care about how much "heart" or "moxy" you've got.  Aside from your school name and your grades, there's virtually no other way for them to make meaningful distinctions between the thousands of utterly fungible candidates they interview every year.

8
Transferring / Re: Tough Choice
« on: April 18, 2006, 01:24:09 AM »
I think there are pros and cons to both options but what do you guys think is better? ???

Option 1: Stay at my 3rd tier school.  I am on law review and will be leaving law school 100% debt free.  I am a junior associate with a firm this summer that pays new first year associates close to $90,000 when they get out of law school.  I hate the city my school is in with a passion and my law school will very much limit me to this part of the country. (if not this state specifically).  With the exception of two or three close friends, I can't stand the people at my current school.

Option 2: Transfer to Georgetown.  Although I have not heard a decision from them yet, I have the numbers to get in there.  Greatly expand my options for places to practice but also come out swimming in debt.  Absolutely love D.C. area.  And I have good reasons for Georgetown specifically - Gov't stuff my school would not be able to get for me.

This isn't really a serious question is it?  GULC is the obvious choice.  You can stay in a city you hate and make $90k per year (assuming you get a job at OCI next year, which is by no means certain), or you can transfer to GULC and pull $125-145k (depending on market).  You're out $70k in tuition, but so what?  You can make that money back in 2 years at a legitimate biglaw job.  Add to this the fact that you hate your classmates, and you hate the city you're in, and this is a no-brainer.

9
Transferring / Re: LSAT scores in regard to transferring
« on: April 04, 2006, 09:20:06 PM »
Katusha, my lsat score (which was lower than yours) was sufficient to get me into a similarly ranked school.

They don't care, and if they do, the value they attach to it is minimal, and it probably isn't even worth the 4 hours of your time it would take to bubble in the scantron, much less the prep time you'd have to invest.  It can't be repeated enough: Quality of School/Class rank is to transfer admissions as GPA/LSAT is to regular admissions... that is to say, it's pretty much everything. 

LSAT is used by schools to predict first year grades (poorly, might I add... however it seems to be the best thing we've got).  The 1L GPA is a much better piece of data to use in judging your academic capabilities than the LSAT.


Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anybody can give me some advice.

I didn't apply to my dream schools (NYU or Columbia) due to my low LSAT score (162, 4.00 GPA). I will be going to a T2 school (or hopefully a mid-range T1 if I get accepted off the waitlist).

I know I will work my ass off during the first year of law school to hopefully get into the top 5% of my class. I want to try and apply as a transfer to the two schools after the first year.

My question is, should I retake the LSAT? I know I can do significantly better if I took it again this fall. Would that be a consideration factor at all?

I know that many of you said schools don't even look at LSAT when transferring. But if I improved (and got into their 25/75 percentile range), would that improve my chances any amount at all?

Thanks for the input.

10
Transferring / Re: Personal Statement
« on: February 13, 2006, 01:37:15 AM »
While this may be incorrect, your perception of transfering becoming more popular could be caused by your increasing interest in transfering. Additionally, you have to think that the people on this board are not representative of the law school population as a whole.

One caveat, I do believe that transfer numbers have been going up over the past 10 years, not sure about the last 2-3 though. If you could provide those numbers to prove me wrong, that would be great :)

There's some indirect stuff you can look at that leads me to believe it's becoming more popular... there was an article in the rankings edition of US News last year that dealt with transferring.  They interviewed the Dean of Admissions at GULC and I believe he said that they were receiving more apps.  Also the fact that the article was in US News probably means that transferring is becoming more mainstream.  Plus the yahoo group seems to be have experienced an increase in the number of posts between this year and last, which could be an indication of increased interest in transferring.  I've been told by more than a couple of people that transferring really wasn't all that common until about 5 years ago. 

I'd also be interested in seeing hard numbers.  But I'd be willing to bet that transfer applications are up by at least several hundred percent over the last 10 years.

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