Law School Discussion

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Messages - FalconJimmy

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41
L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 28, 2012, 10:01:56 AM »
To the OP:  there are very, very few instances where I believe it is in a person's best interests to get a non-ABA accredited degree.

One instance would be for a person who intends to practice only in California, and will practice in an area of the law that is highly entrepreneurial, such as hanging out a shingle and opening a PI, criminal or family law practice.

The other instance is for people who simply want the credential, but don't intend to practice.  If I am understanding you correctly, this is your situation.

In business, there are very, very few businesses that are conscious of where degrees come from and those places really only care about schools that are in the top 10 or 20 or thereabouts.  For the rest of us mere mortals, there's precious little difference between going to the 40th ranked business school in the country and the 100th. 

Once you've been in the work world for 2 years or more, your education becomes largely irrelevant in 99% of most people's careers.  In business, it's not where you came from, it's what you've done and what you can do that's important.  Although MBAs are common these days, they're usually just a check-off, so getting an "executive MBA" from the local non-AACSB accredited liberal arts college is all most people will ever need.

If you intend to work in business, I'd say to let this go.  From here on out, you can legitimately say that you have a law degree.  Since you don't ever intend to practice, anything beyond saying that and listing a J.D. on your resume is irrelevant. 

I had a similar situation when I graduated from b-school years ago.  I went to the #43 ranked business school at the time, and was a little stunned at how little it meant.  However, as I looked over my LSAT and gpa, I realized I might have qualified to go to something in the top 30 or thereabouts.  However, once you have an MBA, the better schools are not about to let you get another.

I understand your desire.  However, I would advise that you don't spend any more of your precious years and precious dollars trying to further perfect a credential you already have.  If anything, getting a second J.D. would make you look either insane, or like a professional student, or perhaps like somebody with severe mental problems to a prospective employer.

Best of luck.  You have your law degree.  You passed the bar.  Don't keep re-living this episode of your life.  You did fine.

42
L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 28, 2012, 09:52:56 AM »

From the research I have done, which has only been in Southern California, none of the ABA schools accept transfer credits from unaccredited schools.   The lower-tiered schools like Western State, La Verne, and Thomas Jefferson will accept transfer from state accredited schools, but not unacredited.  So if any school does, it's probably outside the LA area.   I'll keep searching, but if you know one or two off the bat let me know because I am curious about that.

Ah, thanks for catching that.  When the OP said a non-ABA accredited California Law School, I was thinking a state-accredited school.  However, you are right to point out that a state accredited school has accreditation.  To the best of my knowledge, you are correct.  I don't think any school accepts credits from a school that is entirely unaccredited.

43
Studying for the LSAT / Re: Should I master the LSAT?
« on: June 26, 2012, 10:21:53 AM »
I got a 166 back in 2005. 

Impressive!

I am no longer a virgin. 

Equally impressive.  Congratulations!

I kinda want to master the LSAT for the fun of it

"Fun"?  Are you sure you're not still a virgin?


and to use it get into a law school.

That's generally what it is used for.  Best of luck!

44
L.L.M. Board / Re: Getting ABA after the bar.
« on: June 26, 2012, 09:56:19 AM »
Is an ABA-accredited school allowed to accept any transfer credits from an unaccredited school?

Yes.  Contrary to what some other posters have said, ABA schools CAN accept non-ABA credits.  They can even accept credits from non-law schools.  (For instance, Joint JD/MBA programs accept credits from business schools.)

Very, very, very few schools do, though.  To the best of my knowledge, there are only 2 or 3 and they're all in California.  Not to be demeaning, but generally speaking, look for the worst ABA accredited schools in California to begin your search. 

Outside of those very few schools, no other ABA accredited schools accept non-ABA law school credits, to the best of my knowledge.

45
San Francisco is a pretty competitive market...


Great point.

... so whatever prestige one school has over the other likely isn't worth much.

Idiotic conclusion.

46
Law School Applications / Re: Chances of getting in 2.4 GPA 165 LSAT
« on: June 18, 2012, 02:32:09 PM »
In your shoes, I'd still apply to some schools that are at the bottom of the top 25.  So, something maybe in the 18-25 range.  These will clearly be a stretch for you, but that's the point of a stretch.

With a 165, I would be shocked if you didn't get accepted by something in the 2nd tier.  (26-50).

Almost certainly, there are 3T schools that would accept you.

Best of luck.

47
Law School Applications / Re: Chances of getting in 2.4 GPA 165 LSAT
« on: June 18, 2012, 10:46:17 AM »
The money is not an issue I am lucky to have some help in that area. I am hoping that not applying for financial aid will help. I put the numbers into the UGPA/LSAT calculator but I am not sure how right the results are.   

Your results are completely unpredictable.  You're what's called a "splitter".  I am one too, but not as bad as you.  That makes those calculations basically worthless.  You'll get in somewhere, though.  Your 165 is truly exceptional

48
General Board / Re: 2011 Employment Prospects worst in 18 Years
« on: June 18, 2012, 10:45:04 AM »
Here's a stat:  Just before the bar exam in 2011, I applied for a state district court clerkship that was paying $41,000.  This clerkship was located in a medium market.  I spoke with someone in the office and they said they received 120 applications from law graduates. 

Maybe it's not the worst ever, but it's bad.

Anybody who denies that it's bad just isn't looking around.

Interesting, but the book "Outliers" talks about one of the founding partners of Skadden Arps (I believe... memory might be faulty) whose father was also an attorney.  His father used to work for bare subsistance.  Like, if they needed money for milk, he wouldn't be able to eat lunch that day.

Not sure that this is worse, but it's freakin' horrible.  I feel bad for young folks who are coming out into this market.

49
Law School Applications / Re: Chances of admission
« on: June 18, 2012, 10:35:02 AM »
prolly lower...about 176 or 177 and im not trolling i really do want an honest opinion

A leadership position is probably the only thing you could do to enhance your chances.  Your numbers are exceptional.  I'd say you're on your way.

50
General Off-Topic Board / Re: My 1L neighbor is driving me crazy
« on: June 18, 2012, 10:32:03 AM »
The Attorney I'm speaking of who graduated from GGU, was a retired Deputy Sheriff who also teaches criminal law at the local Police Academy. I took a class from him several years ago, and then later I discovered his fierce reputation in the courtroom. Again, I've never attended GGU, but if he is any indication of what they produce, then GGU can't be all that bad IMO.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Law School doesn't really produce attorneys.  Pretty much every ABA accredited law school uses the same books, and with a few exceptions, all the profs come from the same schools. 

Thing is, in the law, moreso than in any other profession I can think of offhand, the school you go to stays with you for the rest of your life.  In business, the school you go to usually doesn't mean squat once you've been working 2 or 3 years. 

GGU will, absolutely, close some doors to you, forever.  If you want to ignore this reality, go right ahead. 

However, it doesn't prevent you from becoming a great attorney.  You just have to have that within you. 

Whether by design or default, almost all the areas of the law I want to practice don't really require a top degree from a top school.  $160,000 is a lot of money, but for 70 hours a week?  Of course, the type of attorney who gets that starting salary is probably not big on work/life balance... at least not at first. 

So, getting a degree from GGU allows you to sit for the bar exam in all 50 states.  What you do with it beyond that is your business.  Is it worse than, say, most other 4Ts?  Who knows.  Who cares.  If that's the best school you can attend, then go there.  Then, practice in areas where a prestigious degree doesn't matter much.

If you can go to a better school, though, you'd be a fool not to.  Don't point to anectdotes and think that this is a roadmap.  Otherwise, everybody in the country would be going to Texas Tech to be the nation's biggest plaintiff's attorney like Mark Lanier. 

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