Law School Discussion

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Messages - Haynes7

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11
Wow.  You are right.  I do get upset that women feel like they need big expensive wedding.  I feel like it is self-centered, egotistical and shows poor judgement and is fiscally irresponsible. 

I do think your comparison has a grain of truth.  Women who demand expensive weddings are much like men who require a woman to show her devotion to him by changing her name.  In both cases tho, the people are mistaking the symbols and icons of devotion for the real thing.  A woman changing her maiden name does not MEAN that she will be a loyal or devoted wife, therefore I do not change my name to show my devotion.  Some women think that the more money their husband spends on the engagement ring the more he loves her.  This is also not the case.     

You said that the symbols of commitment are important.  Well I say that they are empty and devoid of meaning and significance and everyone knows it.  Furthermore, they are boring and hackneyed.  Every relationship is unique and different and people ought to create their own idea of what marriage is rather than re-enacting the same tired pantomime with the virginal white dress and the woman being "given" away like chattel. 

You asked me what I expect from my husband... no more than I expect from my other family members because that is what he is, my family.  I don't have any clear expectations.  What do you expect from your family? 


12
Your right I DON'T understand the issue.  As I said "I don't really see your point".

In your initial statement you claimed that any given woman would be upset to be married without a ring at a court house and that to a male, having your wife take your name is the symbolic equivalent of a fancy wedding for a woman.  This sort of statement really does nothing to support the idea that it is either right or wrong for a man to expect his wife to change her name.  All you are saying is that "things like changing names and fancy ceremonies ARE important to people". 

You are counting on the fact that all women want diamonds and fancy weddings to prove your point. 

You final statement about how if "hypothetically" I did want a diamond, in principle, my husband should give it to me because in healthy relationships couples care about how their loved one feels.  This misses the issue entirely because the issue is how do we deal with a situation where two people who are about to get married get into a dispute where one wants one thing and the other wants the opposite.  The principle that "you should give your fiance what they want" simply cannot be applied if both people want opposite things.  The question becomes which person will give way.  Why ought the woman give way in this instance?  Why do you assume that the woman cares less about keeping her maiden name than the man cares about the woman taking his name?   

Um..I don't really see your point.  Tons of people get married and not everyone has rings or ceremonies.  Take me for example, I kept my maiden name when I was married but I also never got a diamond engagement ring and I did not have a wedding with a fancy dress and a string quartet.

 The ceremony of marriage doesn't interest me particularly.  I understand that some women are into those things but there are women out there who would trade the traditional trappings of marriage just to keep their maiden name.  Plus I don't really see your point because "traditionally" the brides family is supposed to pay for the wedding, all the man has to pay for is the engagement ring and engagement rings can be cheap or super expensive depending on HIS taste.  So the bride loses her name and puts her family in debt to pay for the wedding and you are talking about symbolism and unity.  It seems to me that "traditionally" men are the greater beneficiaries of marriage so stop complaining about what men have to sacrifice for marriage and respect women enough to see that we are not just silly romantic fools but rational creatures capable of sound financial and emotional judgement.   
That would hurt! The way I see it, there is not an objective correlation between happiness within a marriage and spouse name change. However, the name change symbolizes unity and togetherness which is obviously an issue in the event it doesn't happen. Just to illustrate my point - how would you feel if he expected you to marry him, but didn't give you a ring or a nice wedding ceremony? What if he wanted to skip the ring altogether? What if his idea of a nice wedding was to take you in his car down to the court building and marry you, then afterwards, take you to an all you can eat buffet then drop you off at home before going to work? You'd probably feel like crap because of what those things actually sybolize. On a broader scale, people rarely admit the importance of appearance and how things look to friends, family, and colleagues.
I'd probably react by explaining how important the name thing is. If I had to beg, I wouldn't want to move forward because begging is not cool. If I had to beg about this, then there is no telling what else i'd have to beg for. Just my thoughts. Be good

MaCNCheese

You don't see the real issue here. You'd only understand my point if you could somehow understand that somethings are important to a potential spouse and when these things are disregarded by the fiance, it hurts. So, hypothetically speaking, what if a diamond ring and a fancy dress with a quartet string was important to YOU? If you didn't get those things, you'd be disappointed and therefore hurt. Furthermore, it's irrelevant to mention whether or not the groom or the bride is financially responsible for the wedding. (doesn't really matter who pays the bill) If the bride expects it and doesn't get it, she will be a bridezilla! Period.More importantly in this issue, is its IMORTANCE to either person. Obviously, if two people could care less about the jewelry, then it is not an issue - but thats not what we are talking about. Were talking about a situation in which one person values something and deems it important for the relationship, but the other does not.

MaCNCheese

13
Um..I don't really see your point.  Tons of people get married and not everyone has rings or ceremonies.  Take me for example, I kept my maiden name when I was married but I also never got a diamond engagement ring and I did not have a wedding with a fancy dress and a string quartet.

 The ceremony of marriage doesn't interest me particularly.  I understand that some women are into those things but there are women out there who would trade the traditional trappings of marriage just to keep their maiden name.  Plus I don't really see your point because "traditionally" the brides family is supposed to pay for the wedding, all the man has to pay for is the engagement ring and engagement rings can be cheap or super expensive depending on HIS taste.  So the bride loses her name and puts her family in debt to pay for the wedding and you are talking about symbolism and unity.  It seems to me that "traditionally" men are the greater beneficiaries of marriage so stop complaining about what men have to sacrifice for marriage and respect women enough to see that we are not just silly romantic fools but rational creatures capable of sound financial and emotional judgement.   
That would hurt! The way I see it, there is not an objective correlation between happiness within a marriage and spouse name change. However, the name change symbolizes unity and togetherness which is obviously an issue in the event it doesn't happen. Just to illustrate my point - how would you feel if he expected you to marry him, but didn't give you a ring or a nice wedding ceremony? What if he wanted to skip the ring altogether? What if his idea of a nice wedding was to take you in his car down to the court building and marry you, then afterwards, take you to an all you can eat buffet then drop you off at home before going to work? You'd probably feel like crap because of what those things actually sybolize. On a broader scale, people rarely admit the importance of appearance and how things look to friends, family, and colleagues.
I'd probably react by explaining how important the name thing is. If I had to beg, I wouldn't want to move forward because begging is not cool. If I had to beg about this, then there is no telling what else i'd have to beg for. Just my thoughts. Be good

MaCNCheese

14
You sir...are the idiot.  I cannot even understand what you are talking about.  Try to be intelligible in the future.  What is this about an Einstein quote???  I'm trying to follow what you are saying but I just can't.  I'm sure it is my lack of intelligence and not yours tho...
Dear God, you are an idiot. Reread the post you quoted Einstein, it was saying that quiting is for losers and encrouraging people not to quit. Learn to read.

Calm down now Thelo.  My loss is your gain right?  I wouldn't complain so much about other people failing. 

All I am saying is that I am not going to stick with law school if I am miserable there and show no aptitude for law.  You should be thanking me because thanks to my self judgement the world may be spared a terrible idiot lawyer.  I'm sure you are smart and will be brilliant at law school but not all of us assume the best.  I am sorry that you "hate those ******"  but wouldn't it be ironic if you end up failing out of law school?  I have this weird feeling that you will.  Life has a way of doing that... 

So if you are still passing you plan to quit? Are you one of those guys who stops the 2 mile run one lap into it since he dosn't have the guts to sprint into the front or passout puking and pooping himself to death in the process? I hate those pussies.

I don't think this is a "negative" thing to ask.  She is just asking us to consider the possibility that we won't all be brilliant at at law school, which you have to admit, is true. 

If I am literally in the very bottom of my class then I plan to cut my losses and drop out.  On the other hand, I don't plan to be too hard on myself if I am not in the tippy top of the class.  I do think it is important to manage your expectations.

15
Calm down now Thelo.  My loss is your gain right?  I wouldn't complain so much about other people failing. 

All I am saying is that I am not going to stick with law school if I am miserable there and show no aptitude for law.  You should be thanking me because thanks to my self judgement the world may be spared a terrible idiot lawyer.  I'm sure you are smart and will be brilliant at law school but not all of us assume the best.  I am sorry that you "hate those ******"  but wouldn't it be ironic if you end up failing out of law school?  I have this weird feeling that you will.  Life has a way of doing that... 

So if you are still passing you plan to quit? Are you one of those guys who stops the 2 mile run one lap into it since he dosn't have the guts to sprint into the front or passout puking and pooping himself to death in the process? I hate those pussies.

I don't think this is a "negative" thing to ask.  She is just asking us to consider the possibility that we won't all be brilliant at at law school, which you have to admit, is true. 

If I am literally in the very bottom of my class then I plan to cut my losses and drop out.  On the other hand, I don't plan to be too hard on myself if I am not in the tippy top of the class.  I do think it is important to manage your expectations.

16
I don't think this is a "negative" thing to ask.  She is just asking us to consider the possibility that we won't all be brilliant at at law school, which you have to admit, is true. 

If I am literally in the very bottom of my class then I plan to cut my losses and drop out.  On the other hand, I don't plan to be too hard on myself if I am not in the tippy top of the class.  I do think it is important to manage your expectations. 

17
General board for soon-to-be 1Ls / Re: LSD Facebook Group
« on: June 09, 2010, 11:03:32 PM »
Yay! Two addictions for the price of one...

18
General Board / Re: 146 LSAT Score , 3.2 GPA - What to do?
« on: June 09, 2010, 01:07:01 AM »
ghu.  When I was in your position I asked questions like this.  Now I realize how impossible they are to answer.  You can probably get into a law school with scores and grades like this but it is a huge risk.  On the other hand if you know that you really really really wanna be a lawyer I would apply and go.  Don't stress so much about the LSAT.  Retake it if you can but make sure you study incredibly hard before hand. 

Or you could go to Cooley...

19
Well if I pissed them off its too late to rectify it.  I was very polite on the phone.  They even thanked me for being so determined and active in making sure my file was complete.  Go figure.

20
General Board / Re: Too Many Lawyers
« on: May 24, 2010, 02:51:01 PM »
So the only thing that bothers you about the ugly stupid people is the fact that they breed successfully?  You are so WEIRD!  I think you saw that movie "Idiocracy" one too many times.  You have a point albeit a sorta messed up one. 

I would argue that anyone who has the wherewithal to get through their undergrad degree and complete a law school application has by definition above average intelligence when compared with the general population.  As the saying goes "Better to be at the bottom of a latter you do want to climb than at the top of one you don't".  Do you really begrudge people a chance to prove themselves in law school?  The bar exam tends to winnow out the weak and unsuited.  Life and Law is not a zero/sum game.  Someone else's loss is not necessarily your gain.  At least, you will not directly benefit from a more limited number of lawyers.  There is too much ideology in your ideas.     

I don't need to kill myself. I just needed a day or two to finish up my duties. Yeah, you hate the smart ones alright. Here is a tip, instead of hating them, why not either A) be smart, or B) get out of law?

Wham! Wham!  I love you guys for your passion and energy here.  Though I have to side against sonofapickle because he is so weird and nasty.  If it were not for people like sonofapickle we would never have anything to talk about on LSD so for that...I thank you!
 I must ask, why do you dislike "stupid" people so much?  Is it just lesser intelligence that bugs?  Do poor people bother you?  Do ugly people bother you too?   

I dislike ugly and stupid people as they do not produce smart and beautiful people. Look at the crime statistics, an ugly child is more than likely to be raped by an ugly human. Those are the facts. Ugly children tend to be favored by natural selection because they breed more humans due their ugliness is what gives them a sense of, "this is it, I better breed more children." Smart, pretty people tend to have less babies than an ugly one. Natural selection does not favor pretty and smart people.

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