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Messages - john4040

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Look, I know my tone was over the top at times, but my facts were accurate.  My OP was intended to give a student's perspective of St. Mary's.  We don't have a marketing department like many schools, so I've decided that it's up to students to speak up about their experience.

John4040, I apologize for reading you as a pre-law student.  Nevertheless, I often do see a school getting flamed by young posters who have no actual knowledge.  I thought I'd just contribute my part.

My overall point still stands.  St. Mary's was very well respected in the past, and I am thankful to be a part of the gradual, continuing process of rebuilding its reputation.  It's exciting to see the direction everything is going.  I particularly emphasize that we've had Supreme Court Justices teach summer classes to St. Mary's students abroad for the last five years at our Innsbruck Institute.  Additionally, I think everyone is thrilled that we now have a China program, at which students will learn how to help businesses navigate the Chinese legal system.

St. Mary's definitely has its issues.  And yes, if you don't perform well, you'll have difficulty getting a good job.  But at the end of the day, I'm glad that I found myself here, and I'm excited that the class below me is even more impressive than my own.

I commend you for your school pride - I do not share your same enthusiasm for my school.  Nevertheless, my position still stands:  these opportunities that you have cited (summer program abroad taught by SCOTUS Justices, opportunity for clerkship / BIGLAW positions, etc.) are not particularly unique to your school and they do not justify taking on significant debt (~$90K tuition + living expenses).

Many schools offer summer abroad programs which typically feature elite professors, attorneys, or even SCOTUS Justices. Furthermore, clerkships and BIGLAW positions are typically available to top students at T3s and T4s.  This is nothing new.  Nor is the concept of alumni from a regional school maintaining a close-knit relationship with current students of that same school an anomaly.  Add to that the fact that state T1s and T2s are cheaper than St. Mary's, and you really have problems with your argument.

Once again, I understand your school pride, but nevertheless fail to see why these opportunities distinguish St. Mary's from any other law school.

thanks for filling me on the difference(and not wasting tax dollars on the clock too)

Does your position require a JD?

No problemo.  Yes, it does require a JD.  Wikipedia provides a decent write-up here:

Can a mod confirm that my IP is 208.27.203.x?  

That's not your IP- but I'm not sure why you feel the need to proove your status.

Well, I took a screen shot just to confirm that my IP address is, in fact, 208.27.203.x.  I deleted the last string of digits because I do not wish to identify my circuit.  I deleted the entire IP from my second post because it is my home IP.

I felt the need to prove my status because apparently roblaw believes I'm "an anonymous poster who has yet to even apply to law school."

Right click, view image to see larger image.

That dosn't really prove anything. I've known a lot of court clerks with less than a full undergrad degree. Better point why waste our tax dollars doing it at work? Are you that bored to go online and BS on the clock with lawstudents? What's your boss think of that? Isn't bragging about your IP address a way of snitching on yourself to get caught?

(1)  You wrongly assume that I was on the clock while posting.
(2)  I am trying to give prospective students advice based upon my experience - not trying to BS anyone.
(3)  I'm a federal judicial law clerk - i.e., an elbow clerk for a judge.  I am not a clerk of court.


Can a mod confirm that my IP is 208.27.203.x? 


St. Marys / Re: About St. Mary's: Read This
« on: January 21, 2010, 08:35:53 PM »
People in the bottom of the class are getting jobs - jobs they enjoy.  

Please elaborate for everyone reading this post.  Go ahead and tell them how much money one can expect to make at one of these jobs.  If it's anything less than what they would have otherwise made straight out of college then please explain why going to St. Mary's without a scholarship is a good idea.

I understand that you like your school, but I still don't understand why you troll so hard in an attempt to lull others into drinking your "St. Mary's has great jobs prospects" Kool-Aid.  What is the median salary for recent graduates at your school, and if/when you find a statistic, what % of the class reported?

Here's a statistic I found:  $55K median with 75% reporting  (  I wonder what the median would have been had 100% reported (I'll be generous and assume that the 25% that didn't report made $30K = ~$48,750).  Now, let's adjust for the current economic climate... ~$35-40K.

I know it's a bit unscientific, but I would be willing to stake my life on the fact that those numbers I cited are substantially accurate.  Why would anyone go $90K in debt for the prospect of making the same as a college grad?

Anonymous poster who has yet to even apply to law school?  I'm a federal clerk...  I will post from work, let a mod check my IP address, and have them confirm for you if you wish.

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: St Mary's School of Law
« on: January 18, 2010, 12:04:09 PM »
I fail to see how your opinion is somehow worth more than mine. Prospective students deserve to hear more than just one perspective. I'm not trying to mislead anyone and to make such a suggestion is just plain incorrect, and I resent that statement. It's time to let go of preconceived notions about St. Mary's and accept the fact that this is not the same school it was several years ago.

I don't take issue with your characterization of St. Mary's as a different school than it was in years past.  What I do take issue with, however, is roblaw's citing of particular job prospects in his original post which would not be legitimate prospects for anyone below the top 10-15 students at St. Mary's. Not only was this specific post misleading, but he continues: "My 'average' friends are landing great internships, opportunities, and jobs [from St. Mary's Law]."  To this I simply responded that one of my friends, a slightly-above-average student at St. Mary's law, came begging for any type of internship within the last week.  I simply don't believe the job prospects are quite as bright as roblaw imagines - that is all.

Read this and then tell me with a straight face that this is not misleading:  
Quote from: roblaw
"All in all, St. Mary's has some incredible momentum behind it.  With top Journals, extremely well-regarded professors, the best judicial internships in the state, the ability to study under a U.S. Supreme Court Justice, and top advocacy programs, you cannot go wrong."

I'll tell you how you can go wrong... by taking on significant debt (~$30K/yr.* 3 = $90K) and not being within the top 10-15 students at St. Mary's.  

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: St Mary's School of Law
« on: January 17, 2010, 07:04:45 PM »

I beat you to it.  See my post above yours.  

You sure did... sorry about that.  At any rate, it's good to know that I'm not the only one who thinks that this guy is trying to grossly mislead prospective students.

An excellent post on the subject can be found here:

Edit (11/1/2010):  Looks like they're charging to view the forums now.  Cache is still up - not sure for how much longer.

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