Law School Discussion

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Messages - byebyeny

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General Board / Re: Feeling so depressed...
« on: November 29, 2011, 04:06:51 AM »
Thanks for your kind words guys.

Falcon: I think you are right about stressful events adding up. I remember way back in high school when I broke up with my first girlfriend things were pretty tough. But then I think I recovered in just few months. This time, it's taking me more than a year to get over a girl, and that's probably because I have much more stress in general (law school, feeling disappointed about my grades, fighting with my family members, losing most of my college friends due to distance). You didn't have an answer, but your words help a lot. Thank you.

Bigs: If I may ask, was it only your first semester of 2nd year? I started having depression only few weeks after the school started. Sure, I liked learning
about the law for the first time, and I still do like studying sometimes, but I just started feeling like Im totally worthless and wanted to kill myself for causing all the hardships for my family and friends. My self-esteem went up after I got ok grades and that reassured me that I probably will graduate if I hang on, but my obssessive thoughts have gotten worse since 2nd year started. From your experience, did it completely go away after your 2nd year? Was it like slowly getting better or just a single event that made it go away? Im thinking maybe if I get the diploma, it will completely go away. I don't know. Thanks for sharing though. I wish I could hear more. but and I also agree that I should just hang on, I invested too much into this.

Aglittman: Thanks for your advice. I actually visited my doctor but I personally did not want to take any of the anti-depressants. I always has been a substance free person and don't believe in strong medications like that unless it's an absolute emergency. I've tried to cure the depression in a natural way, by alternating my diet and exercising vigorously. (In fact, the first month of this semster, I barely studied, but went to the gym every single day just so that I will be physically exhausted so that I can sleep at night).

Thanks again guys. Any more personal stories/advice are welcome.

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General Board / Feeling so depressed...
« on: November 28, 2011, 08:14:28 PM »
Hi all,

I've been feeling so depressed for the past year... I am a 2L. I am not so sure what is causing the depression, it could be schoolwork, or maybe because Im super lonley because Im away from my family and barely have any friends... I do know some people at school, but I don't really talk to them much. Some are just annoying. If they are nice, I avoid them anyways because I don't want to get too close to them. The materials I learn don't seem too bad, I understand most of the concepts fairly well, my grades are mediocre.

It's so strange because I have so many obssessive thoughts, like I think about what happened in the past over and over again. Like the girl I broke up with, some people who did bad things to me, or sometimes I feel super guilty because I feel like Im so self-centered. sometimes I get super angry and punch the wall and yell. I seem to think a lot about how there is no purpose in doing anything, like what I am gonna do if I get a law degree, like I literally have no plans or goals, I just want to finish law school and stay sane.

I sometimes can't sleep or wake up after sleeping like 3 hours. I remember playing lots of video games and sports as an undergrad, I now realize how fun those days were. Nowadays, even if i have time to do such things, I don't really enjoy it. Im like whatever...

I also have trust issues, probably got a lot worse since i got here. I cant seem to trust anybody. Like when someone approaches me, i feel like they are going to take advantage of me or something. I do think it's irrational for me to think this way, but thats just how i feel, what can I do.

Anyone has similar stories or how they overcame depression? or is this really depression? Do people start to feel better after they finish law school? maybe take a leave of absence? actually start earning money?

I really appreciate your kindness... thank you

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General Board / LS = figuring out your professor???
« on: June 17, 2010, 08:53:06 PM »
You can know the law and still fail the exam if you don't know what your professor wants.
If you know SOME law and know what your professor wants, you can ace the exams.
So, is law school about knowing SOME law and knowing your professor REALLY WELL?

4
Thomas M. Cooley / Re: Law School should be approached with caution
« on: May 07, 2010, 06:24:30 PM »
Thinking about the uttered words from the perspective of the utterer always helps with understanding 'why'. Most people codify others' words with their own experience and start responding with cynical and judgmental attitude once they see conflicts between themselves and others. Doing this on internet is a lot easier than doing it in real life conversation. I suspect the reason for such difference is because the real life consequence of having judgmental attitude can lead to more serious consequences. The simple truth is, there is no absolute truth. It is all about how you frame it, how you say your words. We may know a little more or less information than the other person, but everyone's experience justifies it. Follow your heart, but respect others's codifying system, which is desperately trying to take in information that conflict with their ego and self-esteem, while not breaking themselves down. If you don't, no matter how right you may be in truth, you will also suffer as the truth you once knew becomes false. The more ego and cynical attitude you have in your heart, the more injury to your pride and self-esteem. It is fruitless to try to persuade. Wise people knew it long time ago. I write this with good intention and hope this will not seriously conflict with other's codifying systems. Maybe the first step is having trust, in yourself, in others' experiences, and in the world.

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: CUNY or Pace?
« on: May 06, 2010, 05:09:50 PM »
CUNY

-cheaper tuition
-similar dismal job prospect

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Studying for the LSAT / Re: shooting for a 180...final stretch
« on: May 04, 2010, 01:50:57 PM »
In order to get practical advice on such topic, you will first have to make sure the advice giver is someone who already got 180 on the real exam. I would say you are unlikely to find someone like that on this board. Even if you find someone who is claiming to have done so, they probably won't post their score just so that you can see it. If you are indeed shooting for the perfect score, you need to rise above everyone else. Maybe not ask advice from those who probably didn't score higher than you?

P.S. I don't think you are doing this, but just to let you know: law school itself has almost nothing to do with your GPA/LSAT. Learning the law has very little to do with how fast you read or process information. If you are shooting for a 180 just to make yourself feel good or brag to others about how well you have done, forget it. There are better things to do. Learn about the law and what you are getting into. Assuming you are in the safe score range, top schools will care more about what attitude you are approaching law school with (which separates those who know what they are doing from many others who have no clue as to why they want to study law). This is the harsh reality one faces as they start law school and finds out their 'supposed' superior reading skills mean jack sht.

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: How bad is Touro?
« on: May 04, 2010, 03:36:06 AM »
You are right on the real job comment. Legal work affects peoples' lives. Would partners teach you the secret of practice? No. Possible consequences are much more severe than merely failing out of school.

GPA/LSAT could be an indicator of aptitude, but then again, aptitude doesn't mean jack sht if you don't know how to play the game. Law school/practice/life/financial management are unfair/difficult because there are certain rules that are well accepted/generally supposed to work if applied correctly, but no one will teach you the rules. Figuring it out is the part that troubles most people.

In this sense, most liberal arts education one receives in college is totally useless. College graduates think they can make rules/arguements (this is well demonstrated by 'jumping to conclusion' mistakes made by numerous law students who think they know what they are doing, but in fact have no clue how to make legal arguments)

I mean, that's horrible quality to have for someone to start law school(or real life). I think paralegal working experience may be valuable not necessarily because you will somehow learn the law from the lawyer guy you are working for, but because your experience of working in a busy legal office and 'seeing' the seriousness of this business called 'the law'. To maximize the benefit of such working experience, I would recommend the paralegals to actually learn substantive law/legal writing skills while they are at it. (But then this would be a bit to much to expect for those who are working full-time)

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: How bad is Touro?
« on: May 04, 2010, 01:23:46 AM »
Yes, I was. Many 1st year students who come straight from the undergrad are more likely to be unprepared because they were in school just couple months before they started law school. We all know undergrad education is largely about getting spoon-fed knowledge/expressing your opinions. Not only that, the last year of college is considerably more work(larger amount of info to memorize, more papers to say what we THINK is right, etc) After doing all that stuff, you just want to forget about school for a while, and naturally, when you get to LS, you find yourself very unprepared. Unless you are the son of a judge or have siblings who are lawyers, dramatic change in academic setting can be a problem. Having said all that, I don't want to exaggerate the problem, but still, it's better to warn and warn some more than just say 'be happy now and work hard when you get here' I don't think being cynical about people who complain is the way to go. I belive better approach would be try to suggest different approaches and helping people understand that what they are about to get into is a new world. If you have been attending law school for a while, you know it's an unfair game. Life/job opportunities are unfair game. Undergrads (usually) don't fully realize that, esepcially if they got 4.0's and 165 LSAT that confirms their supposed intellectual superiority.

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: How bad is Touro?
« on: May 03, 2010, 11:12:17 PM »
That's just your opinion. I don't believe there is anything wrong with warning pre-law students about the reality. Also, there is nothing wrong with being bitter. Maybe your experience was not hard enough for it to make you bitter. Mine was. Absolutely nothing wrong with saying what my/many of my friends' experiences were. Plus, I wasn't talking to you. You seemed to be doing good? Good for you. Remember many people are not doing so well, and doing well in law school has almost nothing to do with one's intelligence, it has a lot more to do with the way you approach the material. What I intend to do by posting is to make these new students realize what they are getting into. Not such a bad intention, eh?

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: How bad is Touro?
« on: May 03, 2010, 09:55:00 PM »
If you got into CUNY, go to CUNY. DO NOT GO TO TOURO. Do yourself a favor. This is not a pride game where you tell those around you that you go to a certain school. Do not merely be intrigued by the law, KNOW WHAT THE LAW IS. Why? As soon as you get to law school, you will be surrounded by the people who are very much INTRIGUED BY LAW. Majority of those students have miserable life for 1, 2, 3 or 10 years or more. Why? They don't know what the heck they are doing. If you still have doubts, think about the moment when you have to write $ 1000 paycheck each month to your lender, for the bad experience you had in an institution where you were bashed and stepped on or (if you are lucky) just totally ignored. Be smart. Be doubtful. Don't just smile and think you will somehow be fine.

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