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Messages - Number81
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« on: July 22, 2009, 04:10:33 PM »
Oh, umm yeah I guess I should have been more clear on that. I went in to meet with the recruiter.
We talked over the phone and the recruiter was kinda was like "well, I could send you next year I guess if you get ready." Then we met in person, talked for a sec, and he had me do some pull-ups and sit-ups, and it became clear that I was ready to go. He gave me a ton of paper work, made a few phone calls, and told me I could go to OCS if I wanted to this year. The process was a lot less like applying for a law job and a lot more like getting recruited in the military.
I decided not to do it. I might change my mind, but Marine JAG was not something I want to do and I was only considering it because all my other options looked terrible. It's probably something you have to actually want and if you're taking it as a last resort I think you'll regret it (talking about me and not you). Being deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan and getting paid the equivalent of $50-70k (really, 40-55k or so) for 4 years when you are 100k in debt isn't appealing to me. It would probably help if you were really committed to serving your country in that role.
(might have to delete this later)
« on: July 22, 2009, 11:20:29 AM »
For Marines, you can pretty much go through a recruiter and they want people that will succeed at OCS, so physical fitness and clear mental toughness are what matter the most.
For the other branches, my general feeling on them is that they pick people basically randomly. They say they look at, in order, patriotism/desire to be a JAG, previous PI stuff and e.c.'s, grades (without giving nearly enough credit to the school you go to, and in some cases possibly going off GPA and not class rank), physical fitness.
The problem with this is that it's hard as hell to determine someone's patriotism from a cover letter or short interview. Taking based on PFT and school/class rank would be much better.
« on: July 22, 2009, 10:38:02 AM »
No, that's not the case. They care about physical fitness more than academics, to an extent.
« on: July 21, 2009, 10:37:07 PM »
You should be good to go on the Marine Corps.
I went in last year and after it became clear that I was ready for OCS, my recruiter had everything ready to go in like a week. It sounds like you've got an even better background than I did. You should be good to go.
This isn't to say that the Marine Corps isn't competitive, but you seem to be a great candidate for them. They seem to legitimately focus on physical fitness.
That said, the other branches are competitive, but with what I gather to be a totally random selection process. You probably should be a good candidate for all of them, but who knows.
« on: July 20, 2009, 11:33:36 AM »
So, as part of my job hunt this year, I e-mailed about 20-25 associates/partners at various mid & biglaw firms and asked dumb questions and tried to start "networking" (don't worry Matthies, I'm doing other stuff, too!). Although I don't know how successful I was in actually networking, I did get some insightful responses from several people. Obviously every person I talked to said that the job market is unbelievably bad. In light of that, the advice I got from a couple of people was that I should do everything possible to improve my resume while delaying starting work; two suggested seriously looking into an LLM in tax, and hoping that by the time I finish the economy improves. (I'm also considering the idea of applying to G-Tech and taking 24 hours in physics so I can sit for the patent bar, or trying to convince the business school to let me do a JD/MBA).
Anyway, I read over most the relevant threads here, but a couple questions...
(1) It seems like biglaw basically ignores the tax LLM and instead picks people based on their JD performance. But, when I was looking for places to mass mail, I noticed a lot of midlaw firms with HYS/CCN law grads, along with T2+LLM students. I don't really care how prestigious my firm is, but I do care how much money I make. Will a tax LLM significantly improve my chances of getting a 110k+ job? Are there a significant # of non-biglaw jobs?
(2) Given that there are (relatively) probably a lot of people considering this path, any idea what my chances are of landing NYU/GULC/UF? Is it worth going to Miami/UVA? Would I be competitive for $$ at any of these places?
Relevant info: Based on my current GPA, and my plan to coast the rest of the way through law school, I'm guessing I end up 30-50% at Emory (ranked #20). I am planning on going through our Transactional program, so I should have a fair number of tax courses. I am mostly interested in a tax LLM because I am assuming I will not have a "real" job, so work experience is not going to be a selling point.
(3) Serious newbie question. Let's say they completely reform the tax code. Would an LLM in tax lose a lot of value? Will classes in tax turn out to be a total waste?
(4) Will I be able to defer my loans while I am doing the LLM thing?
(5) Are there other LLMs or other degrees I should consider? Law in general is very interesting to me ... so I'm not worried about being uninterested regardless of what I pursue -- I want to do whatever I can to maximize my earning potential. Also, I am not afraid of hard sciences or other grad schools.
« on: July 18, 2009, 05:37:30 PM »
This is something I wondered a bit about. I took down as much info as I could, but held off contacting most of the firms that didn't advertise SA positions. I figured that they would make absolutely no decisions until the spring and so it would be a waste of time. Maybe I should go back to my spreadsheet and get ready to mail these places?
« on: July 18, 2009, 05:23:55 PM »
I've had a lot of conflicting advice from sources I trust on the "when to send" deal. I don't think there's a great answer. This is probably because it doesn't matter that much.
It's going to depend on the market and the expected SA class (basically, firm size). I think NY/DC are pretty early on the SA deal, whereas Dallas(?) and smaller markets (and smaller firms) are slower.
Anyway, so far I've only sent out stuff to NY and DC (sending the rest next week). I sent on Tuesday and have heard back from a couple places saying they received my "application," (etc) so it seems like at least some of the firms have started prepping for next year. You want to send early because you want to get interviews before these firms do OCI and already have all their SA's picked out. You also don't want to go so early that they get confused on which summer you are applying for, or to where they haven't picked out a staff member to take apps.
I think most schools will require students to submit their resumes for OCI by around July 23rd or so (Emory was July 6). So, the sooner the better I guess.
BTW... you're going to submit to 200 firms in just a couple geographic locations? That's seriously not easy to do. There's only so many firms that take SA's. I figured the more places I sent my stuff to (as long as I legitimately individualized the firms in my cover letter), the better chances I had of getting hired. With such a bad outlook, I applied to as many non-vault firms as I could (and some vault firms, too, mostly by mistake). I couldn't find much more than 40 or so employers in Atlanta, DC, or NY (40 each place), although if you are applying to the vault firms as well, then that number will increase a bit in the bigger markets. But 200 will still be seriously tough. You'll probably only get like 90 of those off NALP, and working through Martindale is annoying, since only like 1 in 4 non-NALP firms with 25+ attorneys has SA programs that they advertise.
And also, the CA connection is good, but as I understand it, you dudes are struggling even worse than most other places. The only markets I've heard decent things about (and, relative to most years, these places are still doing terribly) are NY, Dallas, Houston, and Seattle. DC is mixed, and Chicago might be doing fine. But Atlanta/LA/San Francisco/Miami/Charlotte/Las Vegas are all markets I've heard (from mid/biglaw partners, in most of those places) are getting absolutely destroyed.
« on: July 18, 2009, 11:38:21 AM »
I just finished my mass mail for 160 firms and it cost me $350 (and I didn't do the big envelopes, which I sorta regret). I e-mailed another 150 and it was free.
The way I picked it was I made snail mail my default method. But, if all the site had was "Send Resumes to Denny Crane
, Hiring Partner," then I e-mailed.
One thing I will say is that when you see a high-quality envelope with high quality paper and "Best" printing inside of it, it really does look good and seem like you took a minute on the firm. If you can add to that a couple lines that individualize the firm, I think it's meaningful.
« on: July 18, 2009, 11:26:46 AM »
Gulc [has] 475 offices this year
Good luck guys.
Holy sh!t. We have 27 and dropping!
One of my friends just transferred to Chicago and was in awe at how awesome their OCI was. All you T14 kids must be doing great!
« on: July 04, 2009, 09:12:21 PM »
Any idea on this?
How much do the chances change if you meet the OCI criteria?
What if you're mass mailing firms that you should be competitive for?
And, when going into the interviews, does your resume still matter a lot? Or, have firms already weeded out the people that don't have the qualifications, and are just looking to pick someone they like at that point?
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