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Messages - TeeTwenty

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Job Search / Re: Secured 1L summer job
« on: September 16, 2008, 11:28:22 PM »
Very unlikely.

Under NALP rules, employers are not supposed to even be talking to 1Ls until Dec 1st. Most firms that have summer programs pay 160k to starting associates. A few more regional firms might pay low 6 figures. Generally, getting a 1L position at a firm is pretty tough unless you go to Yale, Harvard, or Stanford.

There is the potential that someone could get a summer offer from a small firm that is not a member of nalp, but it wouldn't be a formal summer program like the big firms have.

Eh... big-market BIGLAW firms are paying 160, as are some of the more profitable boutiques. Regional firms in major markets, like NY, will probably follow the bigger firms, but in smaller markets, NJ/Philadelphia/Nashville/Anchorage/etc, expect the high-end to be closer to 140k, and some firms won't even break 6 figures.

As another poster said, is a good place to look.

Job Search / Re: Lowenstein Sandler, Roseland NJ
« on: September 15, 2008, 10:59:10 PM »
No yay or nay yet for me... Unless someone wants to ruin my week, I'm going to assume that I won't hear until October, after they've finished their OCIs.

Ugh. I hate the economy. It sucks.

Job Search / Re: Pre Labor Day Callbacks
« on: September 15, 2008, 10:57:01 PM »
I followed up and was told that I wasn't getting an offer and that a letter is on its way.  Meaning I get rejected by phone, and then sometime this week by mail.  Fuuuuuun.

In other words, calling only makes the pain come quicker.

Job Search / Re: Completely disheartened by OCI
« on: September 14, 2008, 09:15:01 PM »
Quick question for all of you: are big law firms the only jobs you are considering? 

I ask because there are GREAT jobs out there working for gov't agencies that you might be missing if you concentrate on OCI.  There are also many 20 lawyer firms that don't have the resources/time to participate in OCI that are great places to work.

Relying on OCI to get a job is like relying on the pull out method for birth control.  I have seen it work, but it isn't reliable.

If BigLaw is struggling, so is the 20 lawyer firm. The difference is, that the 20 lawyer firm doesn't have a program to run, and therefore doesn't have to hire anyone.

Also, Government agencies come to my school's OCI. I don't want to be a government lawyer though. In fact, as my resume prob. reflects, I'm much more comfortable working for someone who sues the government.

Current Law Students / Re: Law Schools To Avoid At All Costs!
« on: September 14, 2008, 09:19:45 AM »
Strange, Valide, I was under the impression contractors win much more than regular employees - this being one reason (the most important one) why they decide to become contractors in the first place. And although they are generally hired through contracting companies, some negotiate their own contracts with the companies. In many big companies employees are leaving and going into contracting whether they're retired or not. Many of these are former employees, often returning to the same jobs they had before they retired, and earning double or triple the salaries they made as government employees. Everyone seems to be doing it once they hit the magic 50: Retire on a Friday, back in the building Monday morning working on behalf of the contracting agency by now. A typical salary for a contracted employee is $100,000 a year, but that's only half of the $200,000 charged by the contracting agency for each slot.

Not in the law.

Job Search / Re: Callback Questions--any info/advice welcome
« on: September 13, 2008, 04:27:13 PM »
What's really funny is AT THE CALLBACK, attorney's will say things like: "this summer YOU WILL be working with so-and-so on such-and-such" instead of saying "OUR SUMMERS typically do this" - using the first person in this way seems to give the impression they HAVE ALREADY DECIDED to give you the offer.

Some of them will say that in screening interviews.

They have not made that decision.

Job Search / Re: Pre Labor Day Callbacks
« on: September 12, 2008, 04:31:46 PM »
Old NALP - you could only hold a certain number of offers open by a certain date, and one final deadline to decide.

New NALP - you have 45 days from the date of offer (date on offer letter) to reject or accept an offer.

So if you received 2 offers on Sept 15, under the old rules, you had until some date in Dec to decide.  Now, you have until Oct. 30 to decide.

Old NALP - Offer more people than you want, because a certain percent will always say no.

New NALP - Only offer the people you REALLY want. Hold onto everyone else until those awful 45 days are over.

Job Search / Re: Completely disheartened by OCI
« on: September 12, 2008, 04:20:24 PM »
TeeTwenty, I bet three callbacks will materialize into at least one offer for you.  You should also be hitting the letter-writing circuit pretty hard, though, and perhaps expand what falls into "reasonably acceptable" for you. 

"Reasonably acceptable" constitutes paid positions at firms of any size that have summer associate programs, in a relatively large geographic area.

Job Search / Re: Completely disheartened by OCI
« on: September 12, 2008, 08:16:12 AM »
Just looking to moan...

I am ranked 5th in my class, have Law Review, CALI awards, and 7 years great experience as a corporate paralegal - and I am just buggering up OCI. I bid for 8, got 8 screening interviews and have had 6 so far. Of the 6, only 1 call-back. One rejection and 4 "heard nothings" but these interviews were roughly a week ago, so I figure if I haven't heard from them now, I am probably not going to.

I am just so despondent. I did a couple of "mock" screening interviews with our Career Service and they went great. I genuinely don't know where I'm going wrong. It's hard to accept that you look so much more impressive on paper than in person  :(

OK, pity party over. Unless anyone would care to join me?

I'm unranked in my class. No Journal. No Moot Court. No Awards. My background is in Media/PR/Advertising (through college internships, and my "gap year" job). I bid on every reasonably-acceptable job we had posted on OCI. I had 10 at an off-campus fair and 12 on-campus. I declined interviews with the JAG Corps, but accepted everything else I was offered.

So far, I have received 2.5 call-backs from that process (one firm only counts as 1/2, because we skipped the screening).

I have no offers yet.

Many of my classmates do have offers. It kind of makes you lose hope.

Current Law Students / Re: OCI = disheartening
« on: September 10, 2008, 05:08:40 PM »
I think OCI is actually a waste of time. Firms interview people they have no real interest in, just to fill out their schedule. Wasting the student's time as well as their own. Maybe there is an outside chance left to "wow" the firm, but very few law students are all that impressive.

Firms are far more honest about their interest when you get an interview via a mailing. Hence why everyone seems to suggest doing these huge mailings.

And I say that after receiving a rejection email 2 minutes ago from a firm I had an OCI interview with yesterday.

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