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Messages - AssaultAndBattery

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Small and medium firms often have summer associate positions, but they aren't able to float 10 summers knowing only 3 will come back.  They need to be 100% sold on your interest in the firm.  Also, some small firms only have half-summer programs.  I've found that firms in the 40-150 range in secondary markets pay anywhere between $1350-2500/wk.  Most have tended to cluster in the $1600-1900/wk range for summers. 

Those are generally on their website.  Westlaw has a colleciton of those, your school should have a database of everywhere that people have summered before, and send cold e-mails with targeted cover letters and resumes attached.  Keep a good database of your e-mails sent out and when you sent them.  Follow up by telephone two weeks later. After that, follow-up again 1 week later. 

If you're looking for a job somewhere that is not in the geographic area of your law school, get a 0% APR credit card.  Plan a trip to wherever it is that you want jobs in October (over the weekdays) and put in your cover letter the dates that you'll be in the area.  Small and midsize firms will appreciate your commitment to the geographic area and are more likely to take a chance on you when they don't have to pay for your callback.

In this market, you should send literally hundred(s) of targeted emails. 

When many top 14 kids are worried, you know you're going to have to work a hell of a lot harder and the competition for midsize is going to be fierce. 

Great advice, Thanks!

I will begin a heavy session of applications to small and mid size firms in my area next week with targeted cover letters.

My school is located in the exact region I would like to work.

Yeah, you are not kidding in this economy, even the top students are having trouble landing SA gigs. *Sigh* I wish I was a law student in late 70's early 80's, but alas, I was a mere fetus.

Biglaw is probably out of the question, but you can try for small firm gigs, government jobs or public interest. Networking is key, so do take the time to attend every little wine & cheese hour or talk your school hosts. I certainly didn't feel prepared to do it right after graduating from law school, but you could go solo.


Do small law firms/ medium firms offer summer associate positions?
Are these normally unadvertised?

Just a couple of examples:

Steiger Fellowship in Antitrust / Consumer Protection Law

Peggy Browning Fund (workers' rights, etc.)

Cool thanks.  could you provide the link with all the fellowships so I can search for more? Those two were expired.

Outside the top of your class at T3/T4 you're not getting a traditional big firm SA job, but of course it always holds that the only time you really have no chance is when you don't apply.

Apart from your traditional big firm SA jobs, if you are looking for a paid position I would consider:

medium / small firms
fellowships (such as various ABA ones)
paid federal or state gov jobs (attorneys general, alphabet soup agency)
paid research assistant

Good luck !  I'm a former T3 student and almost had a paid 1L gig through an ABA fellowship, I don't think school name matters much with those.

THANKS. greatly appreciated. Goodluck to you in your career.

Where are some places to look for the job positions you listed? ABA website?

Hate to say it, but I'm afraid your chances are slim to none unless you have some crazy connections (i.e. you are the son/daughter of a 20M/yr client). Most firms will only consider the top 5% or so at a tier 4 school. It may be snobbish and unfair, but that's generally the cutoff. Usually that cutoff is only deviated from under extraordinary circumstances. Additionally, most firms do the vast majority of their hiring through OCI. Since you are asking the question, I'm assuming that boat has already sailed.

My advice is to start networking aggressively (search around for old posts from Matthies on the subject).

Thanks for the straight answer.

I have been networking lately, joining local bar associations, and attending some events. I plan to become much more aggressive however.

Do you have any suggestions for alternative employment opportunities for 2L summer?

OCI has not arrived at my school yet, but I know, I most likely will not benefit from such a program although I will participate if permitted.

Job Search / How often do Tier 4 lawstudents land 2L summer associate gigs?
« on: September 07, 2008, 03:20:55 PM »
Hello everyone,

I have been researching the question above and I cannot
seem to find much data.

I am a tier 4 student in my second year with median grades, lots of extra curic's but no law review or moot court, and my 1L summer I worked as a clerk at a small law office. I am in so cal and my school enjoys a strong regional rep.

I know my chances at landing a 2L summer associate position is slim.

I am really looking for success stories or feedback regarding how slim my chances really are.

If I don't land a 2L SA position, what should or could I do with my 2L summer? I really could use some income.

Thank you for your time,

Job Search / Re: Good Websites to Find Positions? (DONT SPAM)
« on: August 19, 2008, 09:03:26 PM »
For in-house counsel, the company websites themselves (ex: Yahoo, Google) will have attorney postings on their HR/hiring page.

Thanks, I searched googles and in my area, there was no HIRING going on at all. Yikes

Job Search / Jobs for 2L's
« on: August 19, 2008, 04:32:34 PM »
As I am preparing to begin my 2L year, I am really hurting financially. I know all grad students hurt, but due to unexpected medical bills that arose this summer, I am hurting bad.

I have had a tough time trying to find legal part time gigs as no one seems to be hiring in this economy.

I was wondering what some of your fellow 2L's did for work during there second year to make some cash?

How many 2L's actually work during there second year?

I am willing to consider non-law related jobs at this point.

Any tips or advice is appreciated.

Current Law Students / Re: What Are 1L Jobs That Pay? (Besides Firms.)
« on: August 13, 2008, 02:50:49 PM »
Look for hybrid gig that combine law and business. In-house counsel internships and IP shops are good for this. I worked this summer for the lab that invented doing IP and entrepreneurial business research and summary writing.Paid $650 a week ... barely enough to cover my bills, gas and incidentals but not bad either. As someone mentioned, often times smaller to mid-sized firms will pay for "law clerks" which means you do as much grunt work/organizing of files and putting them together/mailings/related tasks as you do real writing, research and motion work. Also, check with your school regarding its clinics ... several of my friends got clinic jobs for the summer that paid $10 to $15 an hour. Yeah, it's not glamorous and some of the uppity jackovs on this board would look down their nose at such a thing, but those folks are getting GREAT practicial experience, attending court hearings, meeting with clients, lots of memo writing etc. 

I agree.

This summer, my 1L summer, I worked as a legal clerk for a small law firm. The work was not glamorous, the lawyer I worked for was a rude scumbag but I got experience putting together motion binders, filing legal documents, going to court houses to file documents with the court clerk, as well as seeing all the work that goes into a clients case. The experience was valuable even though the pay was minimal $12 an hour.

OConnorScribe, how did you go about applying for you're gig?

Where does one go about applying for In-house counsel internships and IP shops gigs?

Current Law Students / Re: Please help
« on: August 11, 2008, 06:07:04 PM »
Thanks for the reply.  My problem is that I do not have a good reason for quitting law school.  I dont think I could even give a good bs reason.  I simply stopped going to classes and did not withdraw.  That means that my final exams for an entire semesters were recorded as zeros.  I have a full time job as a teacher and my salary is around 50,000. I like teaching but would like to practice immigration law part time.  I know of another teacher who is doing that.  He only takes cases that require filling out the forms without going to court much.  However, he went to a traditional law school.

You mentioned that the correspondence school may not be a good idea because I will not makeconnections.  I am not looking to get into a private firm.  I have worked as a law clerk at one and did not enjoy it.  I would like to do my own thing.  My main concern would be passing the bar.  I am somewhat of a "loner" when it comes to studying. I like to do so on my own. Again, I did get the highest grade in immigration law at SMU so I feel confident about my intellect and ability to grasp legal concepts. I also have a strong undergraduate gpa.  Thank you for replying though.  I am new here so I am not sure I understand what a "flame" is. I am assuming its a fake post. I am not fake lol.

What level of education do you teach?

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