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Messages - ethelmag

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Incoming 1Ls / Re: Georgetown
« on: May 21, 2005, 05:13:32 PM »
The web page with the _Gideon's Trumpet_ information is dated July 1, 2004, so it probably refers to last year's orientation. Not that they won't have us read it too, but they could change it.

There is a GULC reading list?  Where can one find it?


On the Georgetown Law site there's a section under "Orientation Information" titled "Required Reading" (which happens to be "Gideon's Trumpet").  There's a link to a "list of books recommended by our faculty." Unfortunately, I just tried it and the link no longer works.

I have the list but don't know how different it is from the original as I went through and deleted info I didn't think I'd need.  As it is, it is 8 pages long in Word.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: SCOTUS clerk list
« on: May 17, 2005, 07:07:53 PM »
It's not very scientific, but there's a judicial gossip site called Underneath Their Robes run by one Article III Groupie, who has a bizarre obsession with Supreme Court clerks. Here are her lists:

October Term 2000:

OT 2002 and OT 2003:

OT 2004:

And her ongoing intensive profiles of the incoming class can be found here:

Acceptances, Denials, and Waitlists / Re: G-town waitlisters
« on: May 17, 2005, 04:40:33 PM »
Georgetown seems to have, shall we say, a flexible approach to deadlines. First there were all those extensions to the application deadline. Now this with the waitlist. And they said that there would be message boards available on the admitted students website starting yesterday, but they're still not there.

They also told admitted students who sent in the first tuition deposit that they would get a second mailing through US mail in "early May". Then they decided not to mail anything at all, but sent a mass e-mail on May 12. That's mid-May, if you ask me.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 07, 2005, 06:41:11 AM »
Ethelmag, that was a really helpful post--I'm not a total novice where philosophy's concerned, just not at all an expert (alas, if Chaucer and a background in postmodernism were all we needed, I'd be set) and, I, too, would be really interested to hear more first-hand accounts...I mean, this is an awfully big decision for all of us, and the way I see it, the better informed/prepared we are, the better....

You should talk to my husband - he's a Chaucer fanatic and wants to set up a Middle English reading club.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 07, 2005, 05:24:55 AM »
Wow, that's a really interesting and possibly troubling something...Thanks so much for posting it! I was an English major in college, and while I did take some philosophy and political philosophy classes, my grasp of legal history and such is about as firm as warm water, and I haven't taken any Econ. Those of you who've signed up for B, I'd be interested in the depth (or lack thereof?) of your background for B...I mean competing against guys who've been reading The Economist cover to cover and philosophical treatises in the meantime....The worry of starting from behind and trying to claw my way to mediocrity is, well, filling me with trepidation--nevertheless it still sounds powerfully alluring...

I can't imagine you'd have to be a philosophy major to do well in curriculum B. The epinions reviewer didn't talk about the extent of his/her lack of aptitude for that kind of thing - maybe he/she had never taken a philosophy class at all.

I sat in on a B class when I visited GULC. It seemed a lot like an undergraduate political theory class. It was the Government Processes class. The professor put up a PowerPoint slide of the law that created the rulemaking and public comment procedure for some government agency or other, which was about one page long. She then described how the process works in real life. All this was probably in the reading for that day, too. Then the class discussed the ways in which the real-life process differs from what Congress probably had in mind when they wrote the law. They discussed possible alternative procedures, both procedures that could have developed differently from the same law, and procedures that could be developed if the statute were amended. There was some discussion of the rights of companies directly affected by the procedure, and the rights of companies/communities/individuals that are indirectly affected by the outcome of the rulemaking process.

It was really interesting, and I don't imagine you'd need a degree in philosophy or political theory to follow or participate in the discussion. (My view may be slightly distorted, since I do have an undergraduate degree in philosophy and political theory, but the discussion didn't seem to be engaging any of my particularized knowledge in the field.) If you've never taken any classes in that area and thus have no idea whether you are good at thinking in that way, you might be a little wary about signing up for a whole year of it. But I think even just a little bit of experience is enough.

Has anyone else sat in on a B class? What were your impressions?

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 06, 2005, 11:16:18 AM »
Thanks y'all. I appreciate those very thoughtful comments.
What I find interesting is, as the thread I've quoted from demonstrates, Curriculum B sounds like a no-brainer--in theory at least. I mean, isn't this why any intellectually curious (and not simply greed-mongering Hun) individual goes to law school? ...

I hope so.

Okay, let me elaborate.

One of the main points of support the "don't ever go to law school" crowd has for their belief is this: Lots of people go to law school hoping for an intellectual experience, a continuation of undergrad. But law school isn't like that. It's a professional school, and the attitudes and expectations there are exactly what those people are not looking for. I'm hoping that curriculum B will be an oasis of intellectual experience in an otherwise professional-school setting. I'm hoping that the people who are looking for that type of experience will gravitate toward curriculum B, and even gravitate toward Georgetown because of the alternative curriculum option.

On the other hand, I do think that there are good reasons for a lot of people to choose curriculum A. Some of them like the "tried and true" method and don't want to place themselves in a curriculum that is still experimental and evolving. Some want to "share in the experience" that law students have all had, nationwide, for 100 years or more. In Georgetown's case in particular, some people might be attracted to being allowed to choose an elective in the spring semester of the 1L year and getting an early start on the area they really want to study. Some aren't interested in the interdisciplinary areas that can be easily related to law - for instance, if one has a science background and wants to practice patent law. Some might find out that libertarian superstar Randy Barnett is teaching one section of 1L Constitutional Law and really, really want to take his class.

So, there are any number of reasons Curriculum A could be a better choice than Curriculum B. It all depends on your interests and goals.

Visits, Admit Days, and Open Houses / Re: GULC Photos
« on: May 06, 2005, 09:30:07 AM »
Shouldn't there have been professors in their offices, and research assistants in the library, even in the middle of summer? That seems weird.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 05, 2005, 04:09:06 PM »
As I posted above, I just signed up for Curriculum B, and I am no liberal. I'm a moderate libertarian of the "work for change from within the Republican party" variety. So, RobinHood, I definitely think you should choose B too! I've got to lobby for the diverse voices now.

Scott Scheule is a GULC blogger and extreme libertarian who is just finishing up Curriculum B now:  He doesn't write very much about it; his blog is more personal. But if you e-mail him, he'd probably be willing to talk to you about it. I've been talking with him a lot in the past month or so.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 04, 2005, 03:23:51 PM »
I went on the admitted students website, and there is a new option on the bottom to choose your curriculum.

Thanks! I just submitted my Curriculum B choice.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Anyone else going to GULC?
« on: May 04, 2005, 02:09:25 PM »
On the website, they claim that B might be more reading, but the extra reading is usually pretty interesting.  It also should be noted that you are ranked in your own section, if I recall, so it isn't like the A curriculum people end up with an advantage becaue of lighter workloads.

As for me, one of my majors is philosophy, so its a bit of a no-brainer choice.  I chose B today.

When you say you chose B today, do you mean that you filled out a form for it? When did you get such a form? I haven't gotten any mail from them in about 6 weeks, though I did get an e-mail confirmation that they got my first deposit.

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