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Messages - NATUREBOY

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Current Law Students / Re: Fifth Tier Toilet
« on: July 10, 2008, 11:01:47 PM »
Anyone who passes the bar can go out and hang up a shingle.
This is what most law students fail to realize.  The vast majority of lawyers are self-employed.

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Current Law Students / Re: Attire for EIW
« on: June 15, 2008, 09:16:39 PM »
Your first suit should be a basic 2-button, solid black.  Its conservative and matches everything.  You should have a couple of white shirts, but it isn't written in stone that lawyers need to look like undertakers.  You can wear pretty much any color as long as its conservative and paired with a nice tie.  You will also need a nice pair of black leather dress shoes and a black leather belt.  $400 should be more than enough, if you shop smart.  Make it a point to buy at least 1 or 2 new suits every semester.


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I strongly recommend that everyone take a full load of classes during their first summer.  1L jobs are usually non-paying, do not provide you with any substantial legal experience, and do not give you an advantage during your job search later down the line.  The only people I'd recommend take one of these jobs are 20-somethings with zero work experience.

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Current Law Students / Re: Curve? What does that end up meaning?
« on: March 27, 2008, 11:40:45 PM »
Yes, in your happy little dream world, on AVERAGE, the T3 and T4 grads will do as well or better than the Top 25 grads...... That's not reality though.  Sure, there are EXCEPTIONS, but they are just that.....

In my happy little dream world there are unicorns and people can ride them and they give you free icecream.
I'm pretty realistic about the fact that people from better schools have better odds at better jobs, and I don't think I've ever said otherwise.

I am just curious to see how it plays out in ten years.  I am curious whether the "oh wait we're just as good" group faces a harsh reality, or if the "oh no, I am so much better because of my school" crowd finds out that it doesn't make as much of a difference as they thought.

I'm interested in public interest law and government work, so all the bickering about the top of the food chain is really abstract for me.
There are 2 types of lawyers.  Keanu Reeves from Devil's Advocate and Rudy Baylor from the Rainmaker.  90% of law students are going to end up being Rudy Baylor.  I have several friends that graduated from very highly-ranked schools (T25 or better) that are making less than $50k/year.  All of them had summer associate gigs and thought they were superior to everybody else when in law school.  People overestimate how much a school's ranking helps.  All it does is give you better odds.  Wanna be Keanu Reeves?  Here's your odds: T1 (20-30%), T2 (15-20%), T3 (10%), T4 (5%).  The rest of us are all in the same boat and if you disagree, PM me in 10 years.

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Job Search / Re: funding sources for unpaid summer?
« on: March 17, 2008, 10:47:05 PM »
I received an offer for an unpaid internship for the summer in DC. I'm self-supporting (no family) and paying out of state tuition at my school in FL. Any recommendations on places to look for summer funding? I will probably take some kind of PT paid job, but if there are any stipends or grants out there whose deadlines haven't popped up yet, I'd appreciate any suggestions! I'm a female non-minority student in FL. My school isn't cooperative about creating your own externship programs, either.

Thanks!
Just take a full load of summer school and graduate a semester early.

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Job Search / Re: Job offer but pay is low...should I counter?
« on: March 04, 2008, 07:25:40 PM »
I was offered a job in a city about 35-45 minutes away. Small firm, salary is 10 per hour. I'll be taking over for the paralegal (and his duties) all summer long (leaving to take the bar)he does all the paperwork for immigration, juvenile court, etc. I'll also be translating at court on certain days, and some other clerk work. They've offered 10 dollars per hour w/ a review at 90 days for a possible raise. The owner guaranteed position when I graduate and pass the bar (salary unknown). I'll also have work on a p/t basis during the fall of next year and whenever I'm free. I'm top 25% at T4. The salary is imo insanely low and I'm wondering if I should counter, further is it appropriate to make a counter offer at this stage in the game. I think I'm probably the top candidate from either of the two schools near the firm because I can speak and write in Spanish which is the firms main clientèle and really no one in these area seems to speak or write spanish. Advice appreciated.
Let me comment on something I think everybody else missed.  You are not taking the bar, right?  The paralegal is, correct?  You are a 1L, right?  OK, then.  Let me give you my standard advice regarding summer jobs.  Unless you get an offer from one of these big firms paying you $2k a week or something comparable, at least for your first summer, you should just go to summer school.  Get ahead in your hours.  Try to graduate a semester early.  Whether your attend summer school or take a $10/hour job will have ZERO bearing on your interviews as a 2L.  Trust me!  A lot of people here will say I'm full of *&^%, and I myself would had told you the exact opposite of what I'm telling you now when I was a 1L, but it's true!  2L OCI is all about grades, grades, grades.  What you did the summer before is just something to talk about during the interview.  If you choose NOT to believe me, do so at your own risk.  I don't care.  I'm going to get totally scoffed at for even posting this.  I don't care; in my experience it's the truth. 

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Current Law Students / Re: Obtaining a job in DUI law?
« on: February 07, 2008, 11:27:21 PM »
Nearly all criminal law "firms" are solo practitioners or small partnerships.  Few hire clerks or associates. Your best bet is to get in with the DA first.  Practice there for a few years, and then after you have some experience, open up your own gig or partner up with somebody.

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Current Law Students / Re: Help on deciding what to do this summer
« on: February 01, 2008, 06:31:28 PM »
I am a 1L, thanks for the advice.

See I'm just so torn. I am afraid that if I participate in the clinical, I will be pigeonholed into doing criminal work, which I am positive I don't want to do in any shape or form (for strong personal reasons), but again I am afraid if I commit the Diversity program, because I don't have great grades, the firms will take the "better" students and I will be stuck with a governmental agency or the last pick.
In that case, I would just take a full load of summer school classes.  That's what I wish I would have done my first summer.

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Current Law Students / Re: Should I drop out?
« on: February 01, 2008, 06:28:00 PM »

This is plain out false if you are talking about a major city.  Getting a DA gig at a large metropolis is just as difficult, if not more so, than biglaw.
Maybe where you're from.  But not in my neck of the woods.  I got a job offer (from a T4) with no problem and my grades are nothing special.  I couldn't even get an interview for biglaw.

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Current Law Students / Re: Help on deciding what to do this summer
« on: January 31, 2008, 11:20:49 PM »
The answer depends on whether you're a 1L or a 2L.

If you're a 1L, you should just take summer school (to include your clinic).  Get ahead with your hours.  Don't worry about "getting experience".  It is not necessary to work as a 1L to get employment offers as a 2L, nor does it help.  Moreover, employers only give permanent employment offers to 2L's.  Anything you do your 1L summer is generally a one-time deal.

If you're a 2L, and you want any shot of having a job lined up at graduation, you need to go to work...with whomever will hire you. 

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