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Messages - yykm

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Incoming 1Ls / Re: Circus Ponies or Omnioutliner?
« on: July 29, 2008, 11:38:39 AM »
I do have Microsoft word but is that really good for outlining.  Wouldn't that be more of a simple note taking tool?
It has an outlining function to it.  I just don't see why you'd spend the money on something else when all you need is a simple outlining program.  Word works fine, and it's all I've used so far (I'm a rising 3L).

Semi-related question--if you apply to a firm (not through OCI) do they generally send rejection letters? Or is it like other fields where you just never hear back?
They should send rejection letters, though I've heard that some smaller firms don't necessarily send them out.  Regardless, you should keep a list of the firms to which you've applied and check back with them every 2 weeks until you hear a decision.

every 2 weeks?  Seems like they would be overwhelmed if everyone did that.  Although, it may force them to either reject you or actually consider you just to shut you up.

Do you suggest writing a letter or sending an email?
I stuck to email, though some firms may prefer paper.  Two weeks is the guideline my CSO gave me, but if a firm tells you that they'll get back to you in a month, wait that month before you contact them.  My CSO told me that staying in touch with the firm shows your interest, which you need to show sometimes when you're applying to firms outside of your school's region.  I remember a number of firms responding a few days after my first 2-week follow up email, though most with interest had contacted me before 2 weeks had passed.

Another good idea is to contact any alums at the firm a week after you send your application, which will get a few people pulling for you when your name gets tossed around.

Incoming 1Ls / Re: Circus Ponies or Omnioutliner?
« on: July 29, 2008, 08:03:42 AM »
Microsoft Office comes with Word.  I hear it's good.

Semi-related question--if you apply to a firm (not through OCI) do they generally send rejection letters? Or is it like other fields where you just never hear back?
They should send rejection letters, though I've heard that some smaller firms don't necessarily send them out.  Regardless, you should keep a list of the firms to which you've applied and check back with them every 2 weeks until you hear a decision.

Does it mean anything when a firm you've applied to asks for a transcript, or has my desperation driven me nuts?

I'm 3L at a top 20 school, in the middle of my class...I applied to a BigLaw firm a week ago and got an email today requesting a copy of my transcripts.

Does that mean they've seen the GPA on my resume and are still willing to consider me? Or is getting the transcript merely a meaningless formality?

I realize I could just wait for my rejection letter/email to come, but I'm desperate enough to ask what you guys think (I realize I am opening myself up to extreme abuse here, btw).

I've heard from an attorney who used to do interviewing that sometimes the recruiting administrator simply needs all materials required by the firm before the candidate is considered, regardless of his qualifications.

Then again, they might be interested.
This has been my experience.  I applied to some firms outside OCI as a 2L and a few asked me for a transcript (even though I attached one to my initial email).  All of such firms sent a rejection letter. 

The recruiting admin probably just wants to have everything in your file when she submits all of the applications to be reviewed.

Current Law Students / Re: Acceptable Salary to Debt Ratio
« on: July 24, 2008, 09:10:57 AM »
Buying a home isn't always a great financial move.  The market was just recently at the highest its ever been for housing.  Additionally, depending on the market, you may want to wait at least a few years for a better price.

Here's a general guide of the rent vs. buy delimma:

You may also consider that any savings reaped may very well need to be used for maintenance of the home.  You certainly will build equity, but if you have to push an average of $500+ into your home every year you may not gain as much equity as you may think.  You can play around with the calculations some too.  Consider a modest 5% interest on the extra money you have from renting vs. the equity you gain from owning a home that very well won't increase in value.  If the latter comes out ahead for the time period you set, then buy.  I'm just trying to paint a broader picture.  I think our culture has recently pushed home ownership as the only real way to live when it's not always the smartest move for everyone or even the right time.

So I've been doing a little research about certain firms in secondary markets, and, once in a while, I'll come upon a firm that OCIs at a school yet rarely hires from it.

For instance, I found a secondary market firm that regularly goes to Michigan, but they have only two Michigan graduates, and both of them are senior partners.  One graduated in the late 1960s.

What's the point?  Do some of these places go for other reasons?  What might they be?  If a firm OCIs at a school yet never hires from it, is it a good sign for someone trying to drum up 1L employment?

Which firm is that?

If they have offices in multiple locations, firms will often interview for all locations at the same time. It's possible that they have a lot of Michigan grads in other offices. Or that those two senior partners want them to recruit at their school. Or...I don't know.
It's possible that the firm sends one or both of the UM partners in on a Friday before a home football game.  At the few good schools with good football, you'll see many more firms conducting OCI on the day before a game.

I finished my first semester around the top 5% at Fordham, however I fear I may fall to around the top 3rd when all my grades come in.  I was accepted EA into Gerogetown FT.  I want to work in biglaw, preferably nyc, but I also want the option of working in other cities, as I have two years to go and often change my mind about what I want to do.  other things about me: not much work experience, ivy undergrad.  Any insight would be greatly appreciated, thank you.
If you remain in the top 20% after the 2nd semester, I'd advise on staying at Fordham.  Even in a bad market (such as the current one), top 20% should land you biglaw from Fordham.  Additionally, if you leave Fordham to attend GULC and interview at NYC firms, don't you think this will sned mixed signals to interviewers?  You're also bound to interview with a Fordham grad too, which would be one awkward interview.

If you had an interest in academia, clerking, or working in DC; then GULC becomes more desirable.  You haven't mentioned any of these interests, so I won't speculate anymore.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Florida vs. American P/T
« on: May 31, 2008, 07:00:44 AM »
I'm actually from D.C. and would live at home during school at AU to save money. I've been with the SO for almost 6 years. I don't necessarily want BigLaw. I'd rather work for the FBI or some other gov't agency.

Miami is my favorite city in the world, if that makes any difference.

Going to American, and living in DC in general, is going to place you in a better position to work for government. I don't get why you would leave your family and your SO of 6 years in order to attend a peer school. Am I missing something here?

PS: It makes no difference that Miami is your favorite city. The city of Gainesville is the complete opposite of Miami and is also located 5 hours away from Miami.

I thought your remarks were spot on up until the PS.  If the OP likes Miami and wants to work there, it makes a difference.  UF, while 4-5 hours away from Miami, will provide the OP with the opportunity to work in Miami.  The OP may not get biglaw there, but he will still get to live in his favorite city. 

Additionally, UF may cost less than American for the full 3 years.  I believe FL residency remains easy to obtain, which would mean 2L and 3L are very inexpensive.  American's tuition is probably just under $20k, so three years will run you $60k if you live at home.  UF's cost for 1L is just under $30k tuition and roughly $6k for housing.  Tuition for 2L and 3L (assuming you get residency) is $9k each year.  This computes to $48k in tuition and $18k housing for a grand total of $66k.  Still, attending UF comes at a cost - stress on the relationship with the SO.  Outside of the relationship the both schools will likely cost roughyl the same amount.

Another consideration is that P/T students aren't the equivalent of F/T students.  If you were admitted into American as a F/T student, I'd conclude that your options are between two similar schools.  However, P/T is a notch below both UF and F/T American.  Most employers think that you're PT because you didn't have the scores to get in as a FT student, which means that they look for even better credentials from PT students.  Still, American even at PT provides more federal gov't opportunities than UF, but you'll have better overall employment prospects from UF.

If I had the same options, I'd go to UF and try to persuade the SO to come with me. If I couldn't get her to come with me, then this would turn into a question of whether you're willing to jeopardize the relationship for law school at UF.  I'd have to go with the SO if I saw a future there and just attend American.  (Note: if you were in at American as a FT student, I'd go with American over UF.)

Current Law Students / Re: 3L OCI
« on: April 10, 2008, 02:21:03 PM »
I asked a partner at one of the top NYC firms about this, and he told me most firms will likely pull back in hiring generally next year not only because of the economy, but the election too.  He advised me to make sure I take an offer at a firm I wanted this year because chances for similar level job as a 3L will be even scarcer than usual.  Let's just say 3L hiring in NYC will be more difficult than usual.

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