Law School Discussion

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Messages - politicolaw

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I would strongly urge you to look at bar passage rates. The "lower tiered" California schools often have very scary bar passage rates. Whittier looks to be near the state average, but the other two are far below.

There are bar prep programs that you should use, but the published bar passage rates should really be cautiously considered. www.lsac.org gives you official statistics to compare.

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Where should I go next fall? / Re: Small Debt vs Big Debt (Cali)
« on: June 26, 2011, 07:05:52 PM »
The debt difference is substantial, but be sure to look at the difference in bar passage rates. Theres over a 20% difference between Chapman and Western State. And Western State has had notoriously low bar passage rates- at least in Cali. LSAC reports Western with less than a 50% bar passage.

Please consider this. If you can't pass the bar then the whole 3-4 years of law school is far less valuable.

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LSD needs a "like" button  :) ^ on bigs post

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The sad thing is law schools have not banned together to focus on producing competent lawyers. Instead schools will discuss how high U.S. News ranked them in some speciality or my school for my example hired our Dean to boost our ranking. That was the reason and needless to say it didn't happen, because nobody can boost a ranking the system makes no sense. I just wish law schools would disregard U.S. News and ban together to stop it and focus on producing competent lawyers not lying to to get into an 11 way tie for 84th place. That kind of behavior is not good for anyone.

I wish law schools would market what they are doing to improve their quality and how they are producing more competent lawyers as well. I read an article at above the law a few months back on how prospective law students reported on a survey that a large majority choose a law school based on the us news ranking, and not on more practical things like job placement & bar passage. These sort of changes also will not come until the students/customers demand such information.


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Thomas M. Cooley / Re: Starting Cooley in May
« on: June 16, 2011, 11:20:30 PM »
Do yourself a favor and read: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/business/09law.html

Cooley is a mill. It is truly helping to ruin our profession.
It does happen to be the largest law school. No, legal zoom is helping to ruin our profession.

It advertises as though law school is some type of trade school and, as far as Cooley goes, it is. Everybody gets in; no standards at all. Frankly, most people attending Cooley couldn't get into a reputable law school.
Everyone does not get in, about a third do not get in. To attend full time an applicant would have to have a 149- about an average LSAT score. Part time generally requires at least a 145. The past few years have been some of the most competitive years in law school admission.

Moreover, for those who do graduate, they leave with a mountain of debt and a degree from a disreputable school.
The school has maintained ABA accreditation for decades and still currently does. A large percentage of students receive scholarships and/or work and attend part time. Over 70% of Cooley students attend part time indicating that they work to offset the cost to minimize debt after graduation.

They in turn drive down rates for other attorneys as they will work for peanuts so they can service their debt load.
Sounds personal to me, maybe you should have gone to a more affordable law school. More than likely, the economy has driven this concern and not one particular law school.

 If you have an option to go to any other school, avoid Cooley. If you are offered a large scholarship based on your LSAT and ug GPA, then you can probably get into a real school. If Cooley is your only option, you probably shouldn't be in law school.
overly exaggerated, stereotypical opinion. I bet you would only recommend going to law school if an applicant can attend a top tier school or at least an instate law school- thus telling the majority of law students that they should not attend law school.





Thanks for telling us the repeated Cooley stereotype on the Cooley Law board.

Cooley Law has maintained its ABA accreditation for decades, and continues to do so. Additionally, the standards for admission are increasingly rising. To be admitted full time an applicant would have to have at least a 149. A 149 is in the median of LSAT test takers- gone are the days of low 140s acceptances. Today's Cooley students are generally average or better test-takers, and most are working professionals making their way through law school part time **while also gaining experience.

Cooley is a tier 4 level school, and the people that attend accept that and work to make the most of it. Compare Cooley to Detroit Mercy or Dayton or any other private, 3rd or 4th tier Midwestern law school and you will see both benefits and disadvantages to Cooley.

If you go to an ABA law school congratulations on your accomplishments, to get to that point it requires great preparation and dedication- and more so to finish. Going to a "lower tiered" school does not mean that you should not go to law school, it only means that you have specific circumstances, a scholarship, or geographical preferences.

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General Board / Re: Financial Aid?
« on: June 10, 2011, 05:43:25 PM »
True, but if you weren't in law school you would be more flexible with how much your able to work or not.

Its true also that you would have the debt of living expenses regardless, but the ability to pay for them and the level of budget is different while in school. Nonetheless, financial aid & budgeting definitely should be planned out in the greater sense.

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General Board / Re: Financial Aid?
« on: June 08, 2011, 08:08:00 PM »
I would be likely to believe Falcon Jimmy's situation to be more the exception than the norm. A half tuition scholarship plus living expenses is more than 10,000 at almost every law school I'm aware of.

There are some outside scholarships for underrepresented minorities, and school sponsored scholarships for merit. Otherwise, there's more loans and the option of working and going part time. The only way I could imagine going without substantial loans would be to go to a state school- or to have top grades & a high lsat in at least the top 25%.

Good luck!

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I looked at Washburn, and that seems like the better choice. It definitely is more established, and also is a public law school- so clearly a lower tuition rate at least by the 2nd year. 

Also, Kansas has only 2 law schools, while Florida has 11.

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General board for soon-to-be 1Ls / Re: am i screwed?
« on: May 30, 2011, 10:30:58 PM »
Also, it is important to note that a 2nd bachelors or a masters degree do not go into the LSAC report. They would be reviewed by the law school as a "soft" factor, but do not go into the official lsac report.

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Financial Aid / Re: crap credit score, but I got that PLUS loan
« on: May 27, 2011, 09:28:25 PM »

My credit score is poor (595), but I got approved for my Grad PLUS loan yesterday! I have been hard at work improving my report for the past year, but the score itself did not budge and there were records of "more than 90 days past due" within the past three years (just none that were current). Good enough, skated thru and got that loan approval!

None that were current? I have some that are closed, but were past due. How do you address this? Again, nothing recent but still on the report.

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