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Messages - ElMismoPandejo

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How common/easy it to get a job in Phoenix paying around $75K?  Or maybe put it this way:  Of the midsized firms that participate in OCI, what is the most common cutoff?  25%?  33%?  They all say something like "good academic record" but what do they mean by that?

Also, is the school a feeder for state/local government jobs?

Do any people head over to San Diego?

Thanks Botbot.  I'm more interested in Houston than Dallas anyway.  (BTW, I hope people realize you can buy a sweet condo there for about $150,000.)

I would guess that Texas firms will see Tulane kind of like how they see Emory, W&L, Carolina, and other mid-ranked southern schools.  Like, they will have heard of these schools and recognize them as good, but they don't really go interview there.  Does Tulane stand out because it's close to TX, and do a lot of the BigTex firms come to Tulane, or does Texas really require your own legwork?  I suppose I could just go look at the NALP form but I'm too lazy.

I feel for you, but you really have to rethink this.

I have a poor family situation and am practically homeless ... that is a sad term ... "domicile challenged" after I graduate next week. Thus, I am attending law school without any family backing/support. A break in my education will cause me to  start paying on my student loans (because I waived my grace period to consolidate them) and with the job market in my area I'm not sure I could support myself for the year. I don't know, perhaps I'm just being negative about the year off option. Do any of you feel that is the best option?

How much debt do you already have?  Maybe you could try to pay some of it down before trying law school.  For example, if you have a bachelor's degree, you can teach English in South Korea and make some decent coin, you could probably pay down a chunk of it that way.  Just think up something.

What you should NOT do, however, is rush off to law school while you're all stressed out over other stuff.  You really have to think up a way to beat your fellow classmates, and it's hard to get ready to do all that if you're in a stressful personal situation.

I am very interested in international law and will attempt to transfer to Georgetown, my ideal school, after 1L if I manage to get into the top of either school's class. Which school would give me a better shot at a transfer to Georgetown?

WTF?  No.  Just no.  The answer to all this is NO.  "Interested in international law" is a red flag for not truly being interested in practicing law at all.  There are easier ways to make a living, you know.  You can pick just about anything and it would be easier.  You would have to beat ALL your other classmates to transfer up, and what makes you think you can?  Do you have some secret preparation method for LS that no one else has?  Did you outperform your smartest classmates on the LSAT by 10+ points?  No.  It is much, much easier to score 10 more LSAT points than it ever is to transfer up.

Villanova @ Cost or Case Western w/ $13,000 per year? ... Tuition @ both schools is absurd.

I plan on practicing in either Pittsburgh or Philadelphia. Will a Case Western degree carry to Philadelphia, or Pittsburgh for that matter? Additionally, will a Villanova degree carry to Pittsburgh?

The answers to this are a) Case Western is marginally better, b) the schools will not help you out of their respective metro areas.  Listen, are you a Pennsylvania resident?  If so, go to Temple/Pitt, or better yet move to a cheaper state.  Actually if you go to Rutgers-Camden you can get in-state in NJ after your first year, and that's equivalent to Nova/Temple for the Philly area.  These schools will allow you to be a local general practice lawyer and little else unless you completely destroy your classmates.  If you're not 100% enthusiastic about doing this--and few people are--then you just shouldn't.


I have a question for you.  It seems like Tulane people do alright in Dallas and Houston, but I'm afraid I'll never have access to Texas markets because I have no Texas ties.  Do people fix this problem by doing an unpaid 1L summer in Texas, or do you have to have a more significant tie?

Texas has such great markets, I'm pissed I'm not from there.  But I can't get into UT and I don't want to go one of the Texas T2s, as I don't want to be confined to Texas.  Coming from Tulane or a similar school, I feel like I could get what a SMU/UH student could get, if only I could convince firms that I'm serious about Texas.

You should probably get into Davis, decent chance at Hastings, just try UCLA but you're not going to get it.  Don't bother with any of the other Cali schools, they really suck and I doubt any of them would give you enough $$ to make it worth it.  Well if you want to live in San Diego, apply to USD but don't go unless they give you enough money to bring the tuition down to in-state CA level (~$25K).  USD is by far the best school for SD but even so, it's not worth whatever they're charging in private tuition.

You know what might be a good idea for you:  try the University of Arizona.  You'll probably get in and you can get in-state your second year, which would make it cheaper than Hastings or Davis.  Big SD firms are huge on local ties, and if you're from SD I doubt they'd apply a worse cutoff do you than they would an SD native at Hastings, Davis or USD.  They might not interview on campus though, but if you hustle you can get around that.

At the U of A, small firms in SD will probably give you the same look that they'd give a USD grad, provided you're from SD.  You'd also open up the Phoenix legal market for you, one of the few in the country that's actually growing.

Don't go to William Mitchell.  Minn is a small market, everyone is from the same school (UMinn) and they all want the same firms, so it's kind of a clusterf***k.  At William Mitchell this problem is multiplied X10 because it's a TTTT.  You'd only want to go to WM if they give you lots and lots of money, and they probably won't in your case because there are many others like you.

Try to retake the LSAT is the best advice I can give you.

If you're dead-set on working in Minnesota, with your numbers I don't know.  Apply to UMN just for the hell of it, and apply to Wisconsin and Iowa; you'll get reciprocity tuition at Wisconsin and there are ways to get in-state at Iowa.  I actually wouldn't apply anywhere else unless you just want to be a solo or something.

Most big Mpls firms recruit at Wisconsin and Iowa, and all will be open to you with your MN ties.  You'll still need at least top 20% to get close to Minneapolis market-rate pay.  At Minnesota you'd probably need to be within 25-33%, but you have closer access to smaller firms in your market if you go to UMN.

You might not get into either Wisconsin or Iowa without at least a 163-164, Minnesota looks much better with a 165-166.  That's only like 3-4 more questions right and you've got a month and a half to get ready.  So do it!

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Stetson vs FIU
« on: October 16, 2007, 07:43:16 PM »
Um, wait until you get your score?

The Florida job market is not that good.  That said, there is no better deal than UF/FSU at around 10K/year.  That degree is worth about that much.  FIU is worth much less because it may not lead to employment at all.

Miami doesn't like to give out lots of money and it is no better than UF/FSU.  Stetson has a decent reputation within a small radius, otherwise it is useless, and it also is worth much less than UF/FSU.

LSAT and GPA are the ONLY things that matter for LS admission.  Other factors matter so little or are so school-specific that they're not even worth mentioning.

Also, shooting for HYS is not a realistic goal for anyone.  Just make sure you get a T14 school, top 10 if possible (HYSCCNMVPB).

If you're an undergrad now and you really want to be a lawyer (and sometimes I wonder why you would...)

Do 3 things:  1) Get a near-perfect GPA; 2) Become an expert on the LSAT; and 3) Minimize your debt.

A really ideal thing would be to take easy prereqs and the easiest classes you can possibly find at your community college.  Then get your 4-year degree at the cheapest institution  you can find, and don't take any class you aren't absolutely sure you can get an A in.

While you're doing this, you should have some free time because you will have pretty much the least rigorous course of study possible.  So learn the LSAT and understand it inside and out.  Treat it like an athletic event--practice, practice, practice until you're perfect.  If after enough practice you realize you'll never get less than 8 wrong on the LSAT, you are in trouble and need to question this career path.

This formula won't necessarily get you into Yale or Stanford, but with high enough numbers it would work for every other school including Harvard.  You would need to pull off a 3.9/175 for a strong shot at H.  But you could do as poorly as 3.6/170 for a lower T14, or 4.0/166 for Boalt, and honestly, if you take the easiest classes possible you should have no business getting a 3.6; if you study for the LSAT for 2-3 years you better be able to break 170.

But some people just can't hit the LSAT no matter how much they try.  If you happen to be one of these people, it doesn't mean you're dumb or anything, it just means that law school becomes a bad financial prospect.

Basically when wondering about law school you need to figure out your LSAT potential right quick and then follow the above plan if you know you can beat the LSAT.

If Clarence Thomas was white he would have had to go to Florida Coastal.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Give me a dose of reality
« on: October 14, 2007, 11:14:09 AM »
It doesn't matter how well you do on the LSAT or where you can go.  Basically there is no law school you can get into, unless you basically get a perfect score, that will not be GUARANTEED to DOWNGRADE your current standard of living.

Unless you have a burning desire to become more impoverished, you can continue to live a pleasant life while laughing at all us prestige-obsessed, overstressed strivers.

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