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Messages - antwan

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Job Search / Re: Intership Question
« on: December 05, 2008, 07:56:41 AM »
FWIW, County Counsel is a very politically connected job, I guess that's obvious, but you will definetly make great contacts there, lots of judges were former county counsels.

Job Search / Re: state trial court clerkships
« on: November 07, 2008, 06:08:32 AM »
I'm clerking for an app judge now. Its very laid back, very research and writing intensive. Absolutely no contact with attorneys or litigants. In trial court, you will be much much busier, less research and writing than an app clerk would do but more hustle and bustle and busy work and you will make more contacts with attorneys. Also, you will be able to observe court proceedings and get a better feel for the actual practice of law. Job prospects are definetly better coming off an app clerkship though since firms are somewhat obsessed with app clerks, at least in my area.

Job Search / timing of offer
« on: October 27, 2008, 01:21:02 PM »
Currently Int. App. Ct. I interviewed with a few large firms over past month haven't heard anything. Format was "call-back" style. I have a few questions, first, any truth to the notion that if an offer doesn't come right away, like withing a week or two, that you're a reject? Anyone ever heard of an offer coming weeks or even months after? Also, I know this is rediculous, but, do firm offers always come by phone? Any particular time of day?

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Arrest Record..Am I screwed
« on: May 17, 2008, 03:04:59 PM »
I had very similiar record as a juvenile, so I know exacltly what your going through. First, law schools will not care. I know because I had a worse juvenile record than you and got into several law schools. MOST bar examiners will not care at all, I was just admitted in NJ and NY. However, Florida Bar will care a lot. More than the fed gov or any other state. Florida looks for any reason whatsoever to deny people, or at the very least, delay your getting your license for a long time, like years. So, you are definetly not screwed, esp as far as getting into law school goes, and you are not screwed with the bar, except the florida bar, with them your absolutely screwed. And whatever you do, dont lie about any of it.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Rutgers vs. St John's U?
« on: May 11, 2008, 10:30:48 AM »
If you live in jersey, RU hands down if for nothing else than the in-state tuition, If you want to practice in NJ, RU is definetly the way to go as well, huge RU alumni base in NJ.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Pace vs. NYLS vs. Rutgers-Camden
« on: April 29, 2008, 01:43:26 PM »
Old guy, I'm not sure why you would assume that I can't find a job, I have a great job lined up, Instead of attacking me personally you should try responding to the arguments I have outlined. And as you said, your friends graduated in 06, not now, the job market has gotten incredibly worse than 06. And I never said Pace was a dump, just that there is little demand for run-of-the mill law school grads RIGHT NOW and into the forseeable future. With that in mind, why would the OP go to a much lower ranked school on purpose? Especially when RU will be cheaper AND offer better job prospects than Pace in NYC or NJ.

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Pace vs. NYLS vs. Rutgers-Camden
« on: April 29, 2008, 10:28:15 AM »
just wanted to let you know that i have visited both NYLS and pace and from my own personal experience, i enjoyed pace alot more. I found the students to be more upbeat and energenic and i found the environment to be more welcoming. Again this is my own opinion but i did enjoy pace. I dont believe that there is little demand for lawyers beyond T2 and laugh at this notion because that would conflict with the fact that 88.1% of the graduates from pace in 2006 got positions nine months after grad. I am deciding to a tier 1 two tier 2's and a tier 3 all with scholarships, some more then others and i can tell you that ranking and tier do sway my opinion a little but it all comes down to which shcool fits me better. I suggest you do the same and not let the "if you go to tier 3 or 4 your doomed" argument sway your decision!

Well... first of all, dont believe the law school stats, maybe 88.1% are employed after 9 months, but that certainly doens't mean that they all have decent law jobs. Second, if you're ignorant as to the terrible current state of the legal market, then you really should do more research before committing 3 years and 100k to go to law school. I guess you didn't hear that firms are DOWNSIZING right now and even cutting equity partners. in 2007, firms hired significantly less associates than in years past, plus, more and more lawyers come into the field every year. And finally, if you think that there is a demand for t3 and t4  law grads (that aren't at the top of their class) right now, especially in the NYC area, you have really bought into the law school propaganda, and you deserve to be ripped off.

It's warm and fuzzy to say "tier doesnt matter" and "go to where the students are the nicest" but in reality that's terrible advice, and unfortunately the level of school that you go to will absolutely determine what jobs are available to you. But hey... you guys are 0L's so you know everything.
Good Luck!

Choosing the Right Law School / Re: Pace vs. NYLS vs. Rutgers-Camden
« on: April 29, 2008, 07:20:00 AM »
I just graduated in Jan. from RU-Camden. I also recieved in-state tuition. The fact that you are considering going to NYLS or Pace over RU is laughable (I mean that as nicely as possible).

First, the state of the job market right now is really scary. There is little demand for lawyers from T2 and beyond (unless your in the top 5% or so, which there is obviously a 95% against). I realize that RU is a T2, but for some reason a lot of older lawyers think the name is prestigous. Every single person I know from RU has a decent job or clerkship lined up. Most people outside of westchester have never even heard of pace. NYLS will leave you well over 120k in debt, and that's if you commute from home. I've heard horror stories about NYLS's job v. debt prospects. Plus, your competing with not only the better NYC city schools, but all T1 grads who want to work in NY. That said, you should definetly go to the highest regarded school you can, and the fact that its cheaper makes it a no-brainer.

Unfortunately, visiting RU will not make you want to go there. The new building is nice and state of the art (opening this fall I think) but Camden is as bad as you have heard. The immediate area around the law school is perfectly safe though. And all the jobs arent just in philly. I'm working right now in north jersey at a small firm and starting an appellate clerkship even further north in september.

Bottom line is, going to FCSL is a HUGE gamble, you can be the smartest person ever to go there, bust your ass more than anyone, and still get straight C's. Unfortunately, grading is extremely subjective when you have a prof grading 80 essays that all look alike, plus the admin requires profs to use a strict C curve. Even if you finish in the top 20% (which there is an 80% chance against, obviously), there is still a very real possibility that you wont be able to find decent legal work when you graduate. Plus, you have to understand that EVERYONE in law school is smart and hardworking, there will certainly be people smarter and more hardworking than you. Again, not that it really matter, because grades are extremely subjective and somewhat random.

To the OP: I can definetly identify with your decision, I grew up in NJ, went to RU UG, and got waitlisted (later rejected after classes had alreay started) at RU-Newark. My LSAT killed me (154). FCSL offered me a 1/2 tuition scholarship, I took the $ and went down there for my 1st year. I was able to do well and transferred to RU-Camden, just graduated in Jan and have an App clerkship lined up.

FCSL isnt a bad place at all, its really more like a bar prep than a typical law school though. However, the job prospects in Florida will not be great for you, even if you are toward top of class. Jacksonville is totally dominated by U of F alumni, plus a lot of Miami and FSU grads. Additionally, you simply will have no realistic chance of getting employment back in NJ after you graduate from there. The market is really bad here right now and I know a lot of smart people from decent schools who are out of work.

If you can get into Seton Hall, you should go no matter what it costs. SH has an excellent rep and alumni base in NNJ. If you do go to FCSL, be advised about the job problems I discussed above. I would definetly recommend transferring after your first year back to RU (you will still get instate tuition) or SH. Be warned however that FCSL grades on a strict C curve, meaning half the class MUST get a C and about 1/3 must get a D or F. Also, 1/4 of the first year class gets kicked out every year. Therefore, getting good grades and transferring out should not be taken for granted especially because most people there will be trying to do the same thing. Because of the curve and limited job opps, FCSL was extremely competitive while I was there, much more so than RU. Feel free to ask any othere q's. good luck.

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