Law School Discussion

Specific Groups => Minority and Non-Traditional Law Students => Topic started by: Avicenna on January 11, 2008, 10:52:56 AM

Title: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Avicenna on January 11, 2008, 10:52:56 AM
Any Arabs here on LSD? If so, what's good and where do you plan to attend?
Best of luck,
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Avicenna on January 19, 2008, 09:43:30 PM
Are there any?
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Fadel Ali on January 20, 2008, 07:48:41 AM
Salaams,

I just registered
I don't know where to apply yet. I'm taking June LSAT. The score will decide where to apply

Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Avicenna on January 20, 2008, 11:45:23 AM
wa aleikum salaam,

If you need any help or advice along the way, feel free to ask.
I'm going through the application process right now as you can see.

It seems we have the same name. Awesome.
Take care man,
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Fadel Ali on January 20, 2008, 11:43:34 PM
Thanks for your willing to help.
I copied my post in other forum. It would be great to get your inputs about my case.

Salaams



I am international student from Arabic country, Saudi Arabia. My dad is Saudi while my mom is Iraqi and my uncles are still in Iraq. I also belong to a minority group in my country.

My undergrad GPA is 3 sharp; my school, KFUPM, is the only school in the country where the language of instruction is English and uses 4.0 point scale since it was established around 50 years ago by American Oil Company. Right now, it is considered the hardest and toughest school in the country. So, UGPA of 3 is considered really good score and it is relatively easy for me to get a decent job there.

I am currently pursing my MBA in the US but not in one of top schools, but also not in easy one. My current GPA is 3.18 and I believe I can raise it to around 3.25. Further, I have two years of working experience as computer developer, i.e., programmer, before I started my MBA. I have not taken the LSAT yet. I took a practice one with no preperation and scored 145. I am planning to take the test in June and I believe I can score around 162.

What are my chances to get admission to a good law school? Is there a chance to get into a T20 school? What LSAT score would give me a better chance to get into T20 school?

Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Avicenna on January 21, 2008, 12:25:20 AM
Fadel,

My opinion, outlook, and advice for your case is as follows:

If you scored a 145 on the LSAT exam without practice, you will have to do some serious studying in these next few months. It is from my experience that the average improvement for someone who takes the test again WITH practice is roughly 8-10 points. The LSAT is an exam that you can DEFINITELY improve on, but you will have to be both dedicated and motivated to see fruitful results. For some people, the test comes naturally and studying will only help them improve a few points. So study hard!

If you manage to get a score in the 160-163 range with a 3.0 you could qualify for a few T-25 schools. I understand the grading system of the Middle East, and I know it will not be looked at as highly as most of the American undergraduate applications that they will receive. So it is important, again, that your LSAT score is decent. As far as your MBA, that will certainly help.
Make sure to have great soft factors (personal statement, resume(hopefully its adequate), and great recommendation letters from your American employers/professors, not Saudi National). I mean this with respect because the educational system is different here and its hard for admin officials to compare international with national school systems.

Secondly, make sure you check your race on applications as "other" and put Arab/Saudi-Iraqi or some sort of similar variety. Tailor your personal statement around your heritage and what it can bring the the American Legal system as well as your home country(something like this).

Based on your predictions: 162 LSAT 3.0 UGPA,
I'd say you got a solid chance at Ohio State, George Mason, American University, and a few other T-30's.

The low GPA hurts you a lot, so I'd say your "above reach" schools or the schools that are above your numbers but possible(because many schools will consider you a URM--under represented minority).
In  this order from best to least chance:

U. Illinois> Boston College> Notre Dame> Iowa > Fordham

T20? Maybe...U Minn
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Fadel Ali on January 21, 2008, 07:46:37 PM
Thank you for your useful response. You brought to my attention to several important points. However, I just started working on LSAT and I believe I have time to improve my score till June. 

Thanks again and hope you a successful life
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Rhymnoceros on February 11, 2008, 09:39:48 AM
Any Arabs here on LSD? If so, what's good and where do you plan to attend?
Best of luck,


Salaam,
I'm half Palestinian and was born in Lebanon (the other half is Italian and Lebanese if you're wondering). I'm applying this cycle but I haven't decided where I'm going yet. There have to be more than three of us this cycle... where is everybody?

By the way, I've been wondering what other Arabs / Middle Easterners checked for ethnicity on their applications. It's been an ongoing question for me.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: jnb983 on February 11, 2008, 09:49:11 AM
Salaam,
I'm half Palestinian and was born in Lebanon (the other half is Italian and Lebanese if you're wondering). I'm applying this cycle but I haven't decided where I'm going yet. There have to be more than three of us this cycle... where is everybody?

By the way, I've been wondering what other Arabs / Middle Easterners checked for ethnicity on their applications. It's been an ongoing question for me.

I checked either 'Decline to answer' or 'Other' on my apps and explained in my personal statement.  I'm mixed and my statement was on the topic of identity. Most of the applications provided room in the race/ethnicity section to elaborate, and I wrote 'Please see personal statement'.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: J.A.A.N. on February 11, 2008, 10:07:42 AM
Not Arab, but Muslim. Just wanted to say Salaam and best wishes to you all.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Rhymnoceros on February 11, 2008, 10:12:00 AM
Salaam,
I'm half Palestinian and was born in Lebanon (the other half is Italian and Lebanese if you're wondering). I'm applying this cycle but I haven't decided where I'm going yet. There have to be more than three of us this cycle... where is everybody?

By the way, I've been wondering what other Arabs / Middle Easterners checked for ethnicity on their applications. It's been an ongoing question for me.

I checked either 'Decline to answer' or 'Other' on my apps and explained in my personal statement.  I'm mixed (part Arab, part European) and my statement was on the topic of identity. Most of the applications provided room in the race/ethnicity section to elaborate, and I wrote 'Please see personal statement'.

Just for purposes of disclosure, I realized I didn't say what I selected. For undergrad apps I checked white because many of the schools I applied to said that Middle Eastern students should select white. I disagreed with this, but i thought it was explicitly stated so anything else would have been a lie. For law school I declined to answer for every app. I was considering selecting other and elaborating, but i have a beef with racial descriptions in general. My personal statement dealt largely with my identity anyway.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: danmcd on February 15, 2008, 03:24:23 PM
Hi guys,

Half Syrian-Sudani/Irish-American here, spent about 8 years in the Arab world in various places and the other 15 years around Africa/Asia/Europe. I plan on selling myself as a URM applicant...I'm really not all that comfortable with the ethnicity boxes either - I wouldn't mind talking about it in a personal statement or an interview, but the cold categorization of the limited tick-choices throws me off. Plus I'm never 100% confident that selling my Arab side is a good idea on an American application form...

Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Rhymnoceros on February 16, 2008, 08:26:18 AM
I plan on selling myself as a URM applicant...I'm really not all that comfortable with the ethnicity boxes either - I wouldn't mind talking about it in a personal statement or an interview, but the cold categorization of the limited tick-choices throws me off. Plus I'm never 100% confident that selling my Arab side is a good idea on an American application form...


That's true, but i think law schools will either look positively on Arab applicant, or impartially, but not negatively. And I figure if you're marked down a a minority in the FBI's books (which I'm sure you are) then why can't you claim your minority status in a beneficial situation? I don't think arab is usually considered URM, but you have a good case for it, or for being an international applicant potentially. I didn't check URM, but I had my reasons. Mainly I hate the check box system so much I didn't want to benefit from it, so this way I can keep criticizing it without anyone calling me a hypocrite. I don't hate AA itself, but the system whereby somene checks a box that allegedly summarizes the entirety of their struggles, achievments, etc, with no explanation seems pretty ridiculous to me. (But I'm not criticizing you, you're doing it the cool way with a PS as well.) Good luck to you!
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: MUCH WILL BE ASKED on May 08, 2008, 09:23:28 AM

 I am Palestinian/Cuban, and I will be checking hispanic, but I will discuss in my PS and in an addendum that I do think I am Diverse and definetely a minority of some sort. I also sometimes wonder if being Arab would affect us in the application process in a post-911 world. But I will discuss it in my apps. And as far as ethnicity I will check off the Hispanic box.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: MetsFan259 on May 20, 2008, 10:36:27 AM
I'm Lebanese....a senior in undergrad - don't know where I want to go.

Just so everyone knows - that means Phoenician not Arab.
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: tintintin on July 07, 2008, 04:50:23 AM
Hello everyone,

Not sure when someone last posted, but I thought I would add to the discussion. I am Palestinian, and currently in Palestine taking classes at Birzeit Uni. I graduated from an American university, but went to high school here. I'm not sure if I should select URM, however I have had financial instability my entire life and consider myself to be a minority. I will definitely select other as my "race", and clarify that I am a Palestinian Arab woman.
I also considered not discussing my Arab heritage and the trials and tribulations i've face as an Arab post-911, but realized that my identity will not change when I'm in law school, and that embracing it and making it public is really one of the most important aspects of character I have to defend myself. So, in short, I think we should all discuss our history and backgrounds and how we got to the idea of going to law school. What can we gain and give to the law profession as Arabs, and minorities in America, is a large factor of my personal statement.
Just some input, am eager to hear more comments...
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: Rainmaker614 on September 04, 2008, 02:17:48 PM
Hey everyone! Half Lebanese/part native american and mexican here.....just wanted to say hello.

And MetsFan- You are differently ARAB. Seriously it's an insult to say your Lebanese and not Arab? What is that all about. Saying your from Ancient Phonecia is like an Iraqi saying their Mesopotamian? Kind of sad if someone is Arab and ashamed of it....

As for everyone writing about being a URM and arab.... this is not the case at all. I did a lot of research on the subject and being arab is considered caucasian under all accounts. Not only are you not a minority, but you are also nowhere near underrepresented. This is unfortunate, especially since post 9-11 most arabs go through more hardships based on race than most other people could handle. Regardless, you are in no position to benefit off that status. Your best chance is to use any hardships you encountered in a personal statement (told to me by an admissions advisor at Notre Dame and U of M).
Title: Re: Arab Prospective Law Students
Post by: gylkeria on April 29, 2013, 11:01:40 PM
Hi,

I am an Arab-American junior political science major, I am looking at different law schools currently. I was wondering if any of you had advice on law schools that have an Arab population or an Arab community in the area.

Thanks!