Law School Discussion

Deciding Where to Go => Choosing the Right Law School => Topic started by: lawgirl2b on December 13, 2006, 09:41:13 AM

Title: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: lawgirl2b on December 13, 2006, 09:41:13 AM
Hi Everyone!

I've applied to both the University of Colorado and the University of Denver.  I have yet to recieve answers from any schools that I applied to, but Colorado and Denver are definitely my top two choices (I want to practice in or around Denver after I graduate). 

Anyways, because my apps are done I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice (pros and cons) etc about Colorado vs. Denver?  I know that I may not ultimately have a decision to make between the two, but I'm hoping to have the option of choosing between the two schools and I would just like to hear what other current or prospective students have to say about the two schools. Thanks!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: cesco on December 13, 2006, 10:53:27 AM
I think CU places far better than DU.

Ok, I really need to be studying for my LAST exam that is tomorrow, but somehow I have gotten sucked back into this board over the last few weeks and can't help checking it. Grrr...

Anyway, I wanted to respond to this because I love DU and I think the opportunities the school provides us w/are pretty great.  I posted on this topic just two weeks ago...here is what I posted then...

------------------------
DU has around double the class size of CU, and therefore graduates twice as many alumni.  Over half (I believe around 65%) of the lawyers in the greater Denver area are DU almni, so recruiting and support for DU students is extremely strong.

The networking opportunities us DU students get by being centrally located in Denver are amazing.  As a 1L I have already gotten to interact with many local lawyers/firms , and they are always making dinners and other networking opportunities available.  I personally have 2 "mentors" at 2 different firms.  Events are at our fingertips - almost all Colorado Bar and ABA events are held in Denver.  Also, many 2L and 3Ls do part time internships or work for Denver firms while finishing up school.  This is an opportunity that Boulder students can't easily take advantage of because of the commute time.

CU is a great school and I have absolutely nothing negative to say about it, but I also dont think it is fair to say that the CU places far better than DU.  Actually, I know this isnt true, because if you compare the career office stats, you will see that Denver slightly "outplaces" CU (money and % employed).  If anything, we have a stronger connection here in the greater Denver area. 

Just wanted to throw in my two cents...
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: lawgirl2b on December 13, 2006, 12:00:13 PM
Thanks for weighing in with the opinions!

(I should have checked previous postings to see if anyone had already answered this question- Sorry Cesco!)

Is anyone on this board from CU just out of curiorsity (since we've heard the DU opinion)?

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: lawgirl2b on December 13, 2006, 12:01:32 PM
Oh and good luck on exams to everyone taking them!!!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nowitzski on December 14, 2006, 10:47:50 AM
CU is better than DU.  They just built a new building, which is a big time upgrade over their last one, and I think they are only going to keep rising up Tier 1.  DU places very well in Denver, and is very plugged into the local scene.  CU is more regional, and also places very well in Denver.  You should probably just go visit, they are close to eachother. 

I would disagree with the idea that "lay people think DU is much better than CU."  CU IS the public university in the state (medical, undergrad, grad) so it is doubtful they would think it was "much worse" than DU.

 

 

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nowitzski on December 14, 2006, 11:49:30 AM
CU is better than DU.  They just built a new building, which is a big time upgrade over their last one, and I think they are only going to keep rising up Tier 1.  DU places very well in Denver, and is very plugged into the local scene.  CU is more regional, and also places very well in Denver.  You should probably just go visit, they are close to eachother. 

I would disagree with the idea that "lay people think DU is much better than CU."  CU IS the public university in the state (medical, undergrad, grad) so it is doubtful they would think it was "much worse" than DU.




Trust me. I live here.  Everyone where I work and live looks at me funny when I say I would rather go to Boulder.  Denver being private and more expensive, plus the fact that CU is a state school causes many to have a very severe bias towards DU.  This is the non-law person only I am talking about.

Also, your comment about the new building at CU and its potential to rise is accurate.


My cousin works in Denver, and frequently runs into CU people, Steve Farber, Norm Brownstein, etc...so I guess for each anecdote, there is an opposite experience.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nfire1 on December 15, 2006, 01:01:24 PM
I applied to both schools, and while I am hoping for CU, I really would love to go to DU as well.  I've visited both buildings, and the building at DU (it was built like 3 years ago) I think is nicer than the new one at CU.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: KingOfSwords on January 25, 2007, 02:53:39 AM
Lawgirl:  As a current DU student, I must advise going to Colorado.  I know virtually nothing about CU-Boulder; I know only the problems with Denver, and they are many.  Among them are administration problems, course availability problems, an absolutely abysmal bar passage rate (and a faculty that seems determined to keep it that way, judging by recent curriculum revisions), and a generally subpar experience as compared to other schools.

Again, I cannot speak to the quality of CU.  But I find it very hard to believe that they could be any worse than DU. 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: toxic tort on January 25, 2007, 06:36:00 AM
Actually, living and working in Denver, people I tell are somewhat surprised to learn CU's law school is "better" according to USNWR. This is probably because there are huge numbers of DU law graduates working and living in Denver (I work with several). That being said, I've worked with a number of law firms in Denver and I've gotten the chance to speak with a couple hiring partners, and from what I heard, your job prospects as far as Denver go are more or less similar from DU or CU.

I attended CU undergrad, and can tell you that as a whole, the state pretty much neglects higher education funding. In order to build the new law building, the university instituted a $400 fee to ALL students, undergrads included. However, I thoroughly enjoyed my time at CU and loved Boulder. YMMV, and I know an equal number of people who hated it.

I wouldn't worry about the commute time. If you plan on going to Denver a lot, you can live somewhere in between Denver and Boulder. I lived in Superior for a year and took a bus to campus. Downtown Denver is really not that far away.

Anyway, if you have any locale questions, or general questions about CU, feel free to PM me.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: mae8 on February 01, 2007, 01:37:17 PM
(1)bar passage rate from du is horrible. i could give scary anecdotes but i wont. suffice it to say some du grads will have very good careers but a decent minority will also have serious trouble even getting off the ground.
(2)the salary figures given by the schools are always idential, 45-80 or so. that is with a very high response rate from cu grads and a sub-50% response rate from du grads. the salary numbers are therefore not the same. from either school you will need TOP grades to get a big denver firm, most will go to small law, clerkships, or local govt positions. i honestly cant see a reason to go to du over cu unless they ended up giving you enough money to more than make up for the difference. being in denver is nice, cheaper, and better for networking but i think the differences between the two schools is often understated.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: leahchen on February 01, 2007, 03:47:20 PM
I work at a law firm in Denver. DU has a much stronger influence and connection with the downtown firms. CU is physically and otherwise removed from Denver. That being said, CU is ranked twice as good and is half the cost of DU. I would say go to DU.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: SMO on February 01, 2007, 04:03:18 PM
I have lived in Colorado my whole life and I can tell you my own personal thoughts on the two schools. It basically boils down like this-DU has always had a really great reputation in Colorado. Everyone I know thinks of DU as an elite college with really really smart kids. On the other hand, CU has always been known as the party school, they always seem to show up in the news for deaths from alchohol poisoning or football rape cases. Basically CU is known as a hippie party school. Although it is true they are currently raned higher than DU, I bet that any Colorado native would be surprised to hear that. Very surprised! SO it is a tough call. I think if you want to stay in Colorado, DU is almost a better choice.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nowitzski on February 01, 2007, 04:06:03 PM
I have lived in Colorado my whole life and I can tell you my own personal thoughts on the two schools. It basically boils down like this-DU has always had a really great reputation in Colorado. Everyone I know thinks of DU as an elite college with really really smart kids. On the other hand, CU has always been known as the party school, they always seem to show up in the news for deaths from alchohol poisoning or football rape cases. Basically CU is known as a hippie party school. Although it is true they are currently raned higher than DU, I bet that any Colorado native would be surprised to hear that. Very surprised! SO it is a tough call. I think if you want to stay in Colorado, DU is almost a better choice.

Your personal thoughts suck.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: toxic tort on February 01, 2007, 05:28:27 PM
I have lived in Colorado my whole life and I can tell you my own personal thoughts on the two schools. It basically boils down like this-DU has always had a really great reputation in Colorado. Everyone I know thinks of DU as an elite college with really really smart kids. On the other hand, CU has always been known as the party school, they always seem to show up in the news for deaths from alchohol poisoning or football rape cases. Basically CU is known as a hippie party school. Although it is true they are currently raned higher than DU, I bet that any Colorado native would be surprised to hear that. Very surprised! SO it is a tough call. I think if you want to stay in Colorado, DU is almost a better choice.

Your personal thoughts suck.

nice dirk, niiiiiice.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Old and in the Way on February 01, 2007, 06:48:46 PM
Colorado...no question.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Juice on February 02, 2007, 10:48:28 AM
Ditto: Colorado, no question. Both schools have new facilities, Colorado even newer. Colorado ranks twice as high, their undergraduate programs are much more renowned, and the location is better. Boulder is a rocking place to study law and I also believe that it is less expensive than DU which is a private school. Lastly, just look at the quality of the student body, admissions stats and also the bar pass rates. DU admits a whole bunch of applicants with sub-150 LSATs, wheras CU is much more selective. DUs administration has some real problems as well, and placement is not that great. I know some current students and they regret there decision to attend there.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Juice on February 02, 2007, 11:02:09 AM
Admitted with sub-149 LSATs:

CU Boulder: 2
Univ of Denver: 72

Need I say more?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nowitzski on February 02, 2007, 11:07:57 AM
I have lived in Colorado my whole life and I can tell you my own personal thoughts on the two schools. It basically boils down like this-DU has always had a really great reputation in Colorado. Everyone I know thinks of DU as an elite college with really really smart kids. On the other hand, CU has always been known as the party school, they always seem to show up in the news for deaths from alchohol poisoning or football rape cases. Basically CU is known as a hippie party school. Although it is true they are currently raned higher than DU, I bet that any Colorado native would be surprised to hear that. Very surprised! SO it is a tough call. I think if you want to stay in Colorado, DU is almost a better choice.

Your personal thoughts suck.

nice dirk, niiiiiice.

One perception on prestige is just a terrible way to gauge this choice.  Okay, I guess for a more articulate answer, I’d say it’s not clear cut, more of a personal preference issue.  

For CU:
1.   It’s way cheaper
2.   It’s a solid Tier1, and with a new building and solid faculty – will stay that way if not improve.  (has also been rising up USNWR last 3 yrs)
3.   Places solidly in CO business, very well with judges and govt (research state supreme court, other judges, DA’s, the Governor…)
4.   It has a WAY better bar passage rate (this point really matters)
5.   Boulder is beautiful, closer to recreation

Against CU:
1.   Pretty awful state funding sources, high dependency on student $$
2.   Business placement should be stronger  - given ranking
3.   “Party School” perception of undergrad – but this is debatable, yes there are alcohol deaths, police issues, etc..but also 4 nobel prizes in the last decade, nationally ranked programs, Enviro programs galore, Byron White Center
4.   Average salary should be better

For DU:
1.   Better Law School building (they’re pretty similar, but DU has a nice feel)
2.   Business connections in Denver – top 25% to top 10% place very well in big Denver firms.
3.   Healthy funding from school, perception of “elite” school.
4.   Denver is a fun city, seat of govt, etc…
5.   Steady rise up the 2nd Tier for a few years now, no reason to believe   they’ll stop getting better.
6.   Perception advantages – maybe this helps with dates or family, but people who know law probably don’t care at all.

Against DU:
1.   Very expensive, given the fairly low starting salary for those not in the top 25%
2.   Tier 2
3.   Terrible bar passage rates
4.   From purely anecdotal evidence (take this with a grain of salt) the career services placement dept. is not very helpful if you’re below the top 25%ile of the class. (however I have no evidence CU is any better)

Given these choices, if I were considering CU or DU, I would go with CU straight up or DU with a healthy scholarship.  However with both, it’s important to place well in your class, take advantage of summer internships, and make an effort to expand networking skills.  With this last point in mind, I return to my original comment, that it’s a personal preference issue: Generally speaking, the happier you are, the better you will do.  Placement is important with regional schools.  Don’t take CU if you hate Boulder, it might affect your performance.  Ditto with DU.  Also, remind yourself how fortunate you are to be going to either school, which very many prospective law students will be unable to attend.


Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: cesco on February 02, 2007, 12:15:37 PM
I think nowitzski did a pretty fair write up here.

As evidenced by my previous posts on various threads, I am very happy with my decision to attend DU. I have yet to talk to a classmate who says they regret their decision, or who feels unhappy.  Rather, there is huge level of school pride and everyone here loves DU and works to make it a better school.

Bottom line - if you get into both schools - visit them both, talk to students, weigh your financial options, think about what you want to do while you are in school and after graduation.  For me, having the option to work at a firm part time during my 2L and 3L year was huge...I like DU's location and local connections.  I know another student who decided to attend DU because of all of the moot court opportunitites available.  DU participates in every ABA competition - from appellate advocacy, to negotations, to mock trials... and they often place.  This student knew that he wanted to get some practical experience, and this made DU his top choice over a handful of other great schools.  Bottom line - many different reasons to choose your law school.

Nobody in Colorado will say "oh, you choose DU, or oh, you choose CU --- big mistake".  There is a healthy respect for both schools in Colorado.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nfire1 on February 02, 2007, 12:42:28 PM
I will likely be going to one of these schools next year.  I moved to Boulder all for the purpose of getting into CU w/ in-state tuition!  But now I've learned a lot about DU and been to visit a few times and would definitely not feel bad about going there.  I work in a law office in Denver and practically everyone graduated from DU, so I know the job market should treat you well coming from DU.

And I'll repeat what everybody else said about people being surprised CU is ranked higher than DU.  My aunt and uncle didn't even believe me when I told them!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nowitzski on February 02, 2007, 12:46:28 PM
I will likely be going to one of these schools next year.  I moved to Boulder all for the purpose of getting into CU w/ in-state tuition!  But now I've learned a lot about DU and been to visit a few times and would definitely not feel bad about going there.  I work in a law office in Denver and practically everyone graduated from DU, so I know the job market should treat you well coming from DU.

And I'll repeat what everybody else said about people being surprised CU is ranked higher than DU.  My aunt and uncle didn't even believe me when I told them!

I have to repeat, it really should NOT matter what lay people think re: rankings.  All that matters professionally is what people WHO KNOW LAW think.  Your aunt and uncle are probably wonderful people but it's highly doubtful they'll be hiring you for their firm, making salary decisions, or any other decisions related to your career. 

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Blackacre2009 on February 02, 2007, 06:06:42 PM
The choice between DU and CU was a very hard one for me to make last spring.  Ultimately I chose DU, and I will say that after completing my first semester (I'm a current 1L) I'm not entirely 100% happy at DU, but I think the reason is that I'm just not sure that DU is really the right fit for me personally.

I chose DU over CU for a few reasons:
1. Location: I like that DU is in the heart of Denver, close to MANY MANY oppritunities for internships, clerkships, and jobs.  The alumni base that DU has in Denver is very large and I want to stay in Denver and practice when I get out of law school so DU seemed like a great choice to make for my professional goals.
2. Cost of Living: Boulder has cheaper tuition (I qualify for in-state) BUT living in Boulder is VERY expensive and the places you can find to live in Boulder compared to a similar priced place in Denver are definitely WAY worse.  To get a nice apartment like I have right now in Denver up in Boulder I would be paying almost 1400.00/month (1 bed/1bath) which is more than double my current rent in Denver.  All in all my choice was either live 10 minutes away from DU in a great apartment or live with a couple of roommates in boulder to be able to afford a nice place or make a 30+ minute commute into Boulder everyday from one of the suburbs outside of Boulder.  Needless to say, the living situation was very compelling for me in picking DU over CU.
3. Overall Atmosphere: Boulder is very much a "college" town, lots of undergrads all over town and it seems very isolated from the rest of the metro area.  DU on the other hand is in the heart of the city so you're not constantly surrounded by the "college" feel and all of the problems that can come with living in a college town. 

The most important thing is to visit both and weigh all your options (both academically and financially) when it comes to choosing a law school to attend.  I have been thinking about possibly trying to transfer to CU at the end of this year, but it's not because I don't feel like I'm not getting a good education at DU, the only reason I'm considering transfering is because I'm not sure that DU is the right fit for me (for personal reasons) and if I can figure out the living situation CU might actually make more financial sense for me should I be able to actually get in as a transfer.

Feel free to PM me or post other questions you have about DU here :)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on January 28, 2008, 08:52:49 AM
Bump.  I'm applying to both schools, wondering if anyone had some additional info.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: I hate 20 dollar bills, I like 100's!!! on January 28, 2008, 12:23:27 PM
As a CSU graduate, I will agree that boulder is a hippie town. Just has a real weird feel to it. D.U has a strong rep all across Colorado. While it is expensive and bar passage rates may not be the best, it is a solid school. I have visited twice and really walked away impressed...D.U will also be hosting the CLEO program this year..
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: yum, sheep on January 28, 2008, 07:01:47 PM
Matthies,

Any word on the admin problems that have been mentioned previously. It seems there is a strong focus on enviornmental law related programs, if this is not an interest, would you be at a disadvantage at DU?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on January 29, 2008, 09:03:21 AM
Thanks!

Any idea why their bar rate is so low?  I mean...64% is pretty bad for tier two school.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: I hate 20 dollar bills, I like 100's!!! on January 29, 2008, 09:32:47 AM
They explained their bar passage rates when I went on my visit. I don't remember exactly what they said, but said that the last two years bar passage rates have risen and that they are working on that issue. They also said that for a long time, there bar passage rates were much higher than CU's..
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: yum, sheep on January 29, 2008, 01:18:23 PM
So are the bar passages rates calculated on both adminstrations or first time takers or what?

For those of you that are attending either of these schools what is the worst thing/biggest disappointment that you have with the school?

While were at it what is the best thing? (I dont really care about cheerleading thought so feel free to skip this part.)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on January 29, 2008, 09:45:26 PM
So are the bar passages rates calculated on both adminstrations or first time takers or what?

For those of you that are attending either of these schools what is the worst thing/biggest disappointment that you have with the school?

While were at it what is the best thing? (I dont really care about cheerleading thought so feel free to skip this part.)

Bar passage: As far as I know, our latest was at 80% or something for first time takers.  Go to the CO state supreme court for more info on that.  And yes, the administration is doing a lot to raise the bar passage. . .some kind of over the top(see #4 & 5).
1.) 2 professors who teach bar prep classes for 3Ls
2.) A supplementary weekend bar prep program
3.) Encouraging profs to give closed book, timed exams
4.) Grade distribution not posted
5.) Curving most classes

Worse/biggest disappointment = it's expensive & admin comes up with silly ideas (see #4 & 5 above)
Best = there's always something going on.  law firm networking events, lunch time talks, awesome speakers, (just this year we've had sandra day o'connor, mitt romney, co supreme court justices, etc. . .oh & did i mention that barack obama & bill clinton are coming to du tomorrow?)
Matthies,

Any word on the admin problems that have been mentioned previously. It seems there is a strong focus on enviornmental law related programs, if this is not an interest, would you be at a disadvantage at DU?

DU's envorinmental law program is really strong & pretty popular.  There is also a lot of focus on international law & corporate law. . .and I would say that the three areas of law have equal amounts of interests.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: AsianandCanadian (formerly Going South) on January 30, 2008, 01:21:19 AM
After you get accepted to both...ask the HR person at a few of the places that you think you might like to potentially work in three years the advantages/disadvantages of each in their opinion.

Just a late night thought.

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: nfire1 on January 30, 2008, 04:42:26 PM
So I posted in here last year before I knew where I was going.  I am at DU now and for the most part it's been a great experience.  The profs are extremely knowledgeable, the other students are very happy and vibrant and theres SO much to do extracurricular-wise.  I've heard it said that CU is better for straight academia and that DU is better for technical prep, writing, research etc., but I don't know if thats true or not.  I do know that our legal writing assignments have been TOUGH, and that i've learned a ton in that class.  Also I have to repeat that the students here are pretty serious about moot court competitions and spend a lot of time preparing for them.  I didn't participate this year but I think I will next year because the ones who participated seem to have gained a lot of knowledge.  This weekend theres a competition between CU & DU 1Ls, we'll see who wins that one.

I saw Barack Obama speak here this morning and tonight I'll see Bill Clinton speak here.  One day last semester I saw Mitt Romney and Sandra Day O'Connor speak on the same day.

I also know that the bar passage rates have been on the rise again recently if that's a concern, it isn't one for me though.  I'll pass the f-ing bar, gimme a break.

The people on this site will almost always tell you to go with the higher ranked school.  I know that CU is a lot higher ranked but Colorado is a weird place where more than half the lawyers in Denver went to DU (its a much bigger school).

If I have to say one bad thing about it, it's that sometimes there are VERY annoying technical problems, like the printers breaking on the weekends and nobody being around to fix them til Monday, things like that are f-ing aggravating but in the long run I think it works out.

any questions feel free to ask em.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on January 30, 2008, 11:04:44 PM
After you get accepted to both...ask the HR person at a few of the places that you think you might like to potentially work in three years the advantages/disadvantages of each in their opinion.

Just a late night thought.



You know, I've done this, all say go to DU. Just so happens that of the 30 or so lawyers and judges I know well, all are DU but for a few top 14 grads, so some bais there. :) I have yet to actually meet a CU grad working as lawyer. In no way am I saying they are not out there, its just like 4 to 1 DU grads, so just happens that you meet them more often. I thinkl they are both good schools, I think CU has the advanatge of being higher ranked, but DU has the advanatage of being IN Denver, and that has seemed to me, to really even it out. DU grads have more opertunties to get know in Denver becuase its really easy to get a PT clerk or intership job here and work it into your school schdeual. Outside Denver I bet CU has the advanatge. But I mean, who want to work in the Springs?

The only down side I have with DU is cost, Its not cheap, other than that I have no complaints. Love my classmates, the pprofs, the numbers of classes offered, the lawyers I have met in Denver, the city, my house, the weather (near blzzard going on outside my window right now, which will all be melted by tommrow I bet)


PS also soryy about keep delated out of this thread. I like to d-dub each night to I don't wake to full in box (becuase being OCD I will read verey post!) But I'll try to keep this one saved.

Aslo good to see nfire1 and somanyquestions, how is it going for you guys?

Good, good thanks! :)  Kinda star struck from seeing Barack Obama & Bill Clinton all in one day.  How are you?

Oh, here's another negative. . .DU trying to profit by charging people to park in the law school parking deck while turning current law students with parking passes away. ???

To add to what has already been said about DU/CU. . .both DU/CU are about equal in terms of reputation in Colorado, both have new buildings, both are regional schools (even though CU is ranked higher), etc.  Bottom line, VISIT.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on January 31, 2008, 08:12:50 AM
How are people dealing with paying down the debt?  Are there sufficient job options post-graduation in the Denver area to make it worthwhile? 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 01, 2008, 07:33:06 AM
I live in NY; how hard is it to get Colorado residency for CU in-state tuition?

You know...if I actually get in.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: ladivina on February 01, 2008, 09:49:21 AM
I live in Denver and am applying to both schools as well.  It is true that both have good regional reputations. CU is higher ranked, and the you can't beat the in-state tuition with a stick unless DU can make up the difference with scholarships.  As much as people in Denver think that DU is a great school, CU is better academically both in Undergrad and Law School.  DU does a really good job of selling itself, but the fact that it is a private school does not make it exculsive, just ridiculously expensive.  Most people that I know who have gone to CU are doing very well in the Denver legal market...DU grads as well, if they pass the bar. 
Also, I love Boulder. If you live in the outskirts of Boulder (ie. Broomfield, Louisville, Lafayette, etc.) housing is very reasonable and, frankly, nothing in Colorado is going to cost you as much as it would to live in DC, NYC, Boston, Cali, etc. Let me know if you have any other questions.  I'm hoping to have the same decision.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 01, 2008, 10:14:21 AM
Well, I'm personally hoping to either A) get into UC or B) get about $15K/yr from Denver. 

Denver/Colorado is a very appealing option because the cost of living is far lower than the regions you mention, and having lived in NYC for the last 7 years and on the virge of marriage, much of the appeal of NYC is pretty much lost on me.  Frankly, I miss the outdoors, so the location of Denver really appeals to me. 

I'm hoping it works out.  My fiancee is a teacher with experience teaching in the Brooklyn Public Schools, so she can get a job pretty much anywhere, which is a nice bit of flexibility. 

We'll see.  I really hope something works out.  If I got into UC, then I'd be hard pressed not to go.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 01, 2008, 08:27:13 PM
I live in NY; how hard is it to get Colorado residency for CU in-state tuition?

You know...if I actually get in.

1 year. . .after a year, CU grants you in state status.

Bottom line from what everyone's saying: CU/DU have similar job prospects, reputation, etc so do the research, visit, & go with your gut feeling.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 01, 2008, 08:31:44 PM
After you get accepted to both...ask the HR person at a few of the places that you think you might like to potentially work in three years the advantages/disadvantages of each in their opinion.

Just a late night thought.



You know, I've done this, all say go to DU. Just so happens that of the 30 or so lawyers and judges I know well, all are DU but for a few top 14 grads, so some bais there. :) I have yet to actually meet a CU grad working as lawyer. In no way am I saying they are not out there, its just like 4 to 1 DU grads, so just happens that you meet them more often. I thinkl they are both good schools, I think CU has the advanatge of being higher ranked, but DU has the advanatage of being IN Denver, and that has seemed to me, to really even it out. DU grads have more opertunties to get know in Denver becuase its really easy to get a PT clerk or intership job here and work it into your school schdeual. Outside Denver I bet CU has the advanatge. But I mean, who want to work in the Springs?

The only down side I have with DU is cost, Its not cheap, other than that I have no complaints. Love my classmates, the pprofs, the numbers of classes offered, the lawyers I have met in Denver, the city, my house, the weather (near blzzard going on outside my window right now, which will all be melted by tommrow I bet)


PS also soryy about keep delated out of this thread. I like to d-dub each night to I don't wake to full in box (becuase being OCD I will read verey post!) But I'll try to keep this one saved.

Aslo good to see nfire1 and somanyquestions, how is it going for you guys?

Good, good thanks! :)  Kinda star struck from seeing Barack Obama & Bill Clinton all in one day.  How are you?

Oh, here's another negative. . .DU trying to profit by charging people to park in the law school parking deck while turning current law students with parking passes away. ???

To add to what has already been said about DU/CU. . .both DU/CU are about equal in terms of reputation in Colorado, both have new buildings, both are regional schools (even though CU is ranked higher), etc.  Bottom line, VISIT.

Doing good here as well. STILL waiting on one grade, bujt *&^% happens. Yea I stayed awaty from school yesterday becuase I knew parking ouwld suck!! You went to both?

Let me guess. . .jurisprudence?  Who did you take it with?  I wonder if we were in the same class. . .I'm still waiting for mine.

Yea, I went to both.  I was in line for 2 hours for Obama & walked right in for Clinton (guess the snow detered people).  They were turning people away from the garage.  People were not happy.  Luckily, I entered through Evans side of the garage so I didn't have a problem.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 01, 2008, 08:32:53 PM
My only advice on where to live is, if you go to CU, I would recommend living as close to Denver as you can stand. Hands down the BEST way to find a legal job is networking with working lawyers and judges. 90% of the regular networking activities (Bar Association meetings, CLEs, volunteer events and Inns of the Court) are all going to take place in Denver, Boulder to Denver is an hour in good traffic 1.5 hours in bad traffic, forever in the snow. Just something to consider. DU students have a monopoly on networking events simple because few CU students are willing to make that drive after class in the evenings.
Oh, and weather here is NUTS its was 45 degrees this afternoon. Right now we are having a THUNDER and LIGHTING storm with snow. WTF???


I concur with everything Matthies just said regarding living in Denver & the weather.  That was LOUD!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 01, 2008, 08:42:58 PM
After you get accepted to both...ask the HR person at a few of the places that you think you might like to potentially work in three years the advantages/disadvantages of each in their opinion.

Just a late night thought.



You know, I've done this, all say go to DU. Just so happens that of the 30 or so lawyers and judges I know well, all are DU but for a few top 14 grads, so some bais there. :) I have yet to actually meet a CU grad working as lawyer. In no way am I saying they are not out there, its just like 4 to 1 DU grads, so just happens that you meet them more often. I thinkl they are both good schools, I think CU has the advanatge of being higher ranked, but DU has the advanatage of being IN Denver, and that has seemed to me, to really even it out. DU grads have more opertunties to get know in Denver becuase its really easy to get a PT clerk or intership job here and work it into your school schdeual. Outside Denver I bet CU has the advanatge. But I mean, who want to work in the Springs?

The only down side I have with DU is cost, Its not cheap, other than that I have no complaints. Love my classmates, the pprofs, the numbers of classes offered, the lawyers I have met in Denver, the city, my house, the weather (near blzzard going on outside my window right now, which will all be melted by tommrow I bet)


PS also soryy about keep delated out of this thread. I like to d-dub each night to I don't wake to full in box (becuase being OCD I will read verey post!) But I'll try to keep this one saved.

Aslo good to see nfire1 and somanyquestions, how is it going for you guys?

Good, good thanks! :)  Kinda star struck from seeing Barack Obama & Bill Clinton all in one day.  How are you?

Oh, here's another negative. . .DU trying to profit by charging people to park in the law school parking deck while turning current law students with parking passes away. ???

To add to what has already been said about DU/CU. . .both DU/CU are about equal in terms of reputation in Colorado, both have new buildings, both are regional schools (even though CU is ranked higher), etc.  Bottom line, VISIT.

Doing good here as well. STILL waiting on one grade, bujt poo happens. Yea I stayed awaty from school yesterday becuase I knew parking ouwld suck!! You went to both?

Let me guess. . .jurisprudence?

Scales, you?

ME TOO!!  She is taking WAY too long to grade our journals!  Think she'll give us our grade before she gets back from the tar heel state?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: cesco on February 03, 2008, 09:52:15 AM
Hi all,

I am another current student (2L) at DU and thought I'd share my two cents.  So far I have really enjoyed my experience at the school, and feel like I am getting a solid education.  I have had many opportunities, and feel that law school is really what you make of it. 

A few things I have had the opportunity to do while in law school:  Work as an RA, work as a TA, intern for a Judge, study abroad, join a journal, participate in moot court competitions (and travel with a team), participate in a clinic.  I did OCI through the school, and was lucky enough to have some great options.  I accepted a SA position with a national firm's Denver branch office, and look forward working there this summer.

I choose DU because I wanted to stay in Denver.  The city is fantastic - who can complain about great weather, beautiful mountains, hiking/skiing, etc?  The legal community is very supportive of the school.  Something like 60% of lawyers in the greater Denver area are DU grads, so we get a lot of support.  We have the 10th Circuit right here in Denver, and of course have the State Supreme Court and Denver County Cts.  The Judges do an excellent job at helping educate students.  Several of them teach evening classes at the school, and just about all of them are open to accepting interns.

DU has a large class, thus they offer a wide variety of courses each semester.  I think this is an advantage, and something we have that is unique to our school.  You can check out some of the offerings at:  http://www.law.du.edu/registrar/classindex.htm.  Notice you'll see the typical bar prep classes, but you will also see a range of randoms, such as Space Law, Asylum Law, and Global Climate CHange law.  I tend to stick with the basics, but many of my classmates really like the fact that they can take such unique courses.

Anyway, that's my two cents for now.  I am happy to answer any other questions (through PM or posts), and will try to check back here every few days.  Good Luck with your application cycle!

EDIT:  I just realized that I didnt really make a DU/CU comparison, I just spoke about my experience at DU.  I do not have too much to say on the comparison, simply because I do not know any current CU students! 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 03, 2008, 11:45:48 PM
I am another poster who is desperately hoping to have to choose between these two schools this cycle. I have a 3.43/162 so my chances are not great at CU. I have a rather interesting background so that should hopefully help. I see on Law School Numbers that I am right at the accept/waitlist area, so hopefully I will get the nod.

I have two major issues with my choice:

DU grads and CU grads seem to be about equal in Denver firms. I think, considering that Colorado is half the size, that this bodes well for Colorado. Also, CU grads are occasionally listed at the top firms without reference to them being Order of the Coif or graduating Summa Cum Laude, while DU grads are almost never listed without those credentials being part of the attorneys profile. It makes me think that you have to be in the very top of the class to get a good job from DU, while at CU you don't need to be ranked as high in your class. This to me doesn't seem to help the "more prestige" argument that DU people are making.

The second thing is that I LOVE DENVER. I lived there for two years and completely adore the place now. My wife and I are planning on making Denver our permanent residence (as applying to only those two schools would imply). I would much rather live in Denver for my three years of law school than Boulder, but I haven't actually visited CU yet so I don't know for sure. Also, I think I am likely to get a scholarship at DU, and if I did that would mitigate the tuition difference. Although I hear that they stick everyone with scholarships in the same section so only about a third of them actually maintain the 3.1 minimum GPA and lose their scholarships. I believe that I will be in the top 25% of my class, but so does about 80% of every class, so I want to be realistic.

So I don't know which way I'll go, assuming I get to make the choice. Also, I don't understand why DU people think they attend a more prestigious school? Wouldn't entering stats be a good representation of which school is more prestigious. If DU really has the location, networking and many other advantages, what would be pulling applicants to CU? How is CU getting the much better entering class stats if DU is more prestigious? It seems fishy to me. I think DU people might just SELF PROCLAIM that DU is more prestigious. Anyway, I am not very concerned with prestige, it just seemed like a strange comment to say that DU is more prestigious.

P.S. Has Denver had snow on the ground throughout the winter? I am getting sick of snow and there was rarely snow on the ground when I lived there (2001-2003).
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 03, 2008, 11:51:15 PM
I would love to hear some DU students give me some anecdotal evidence that people outside of the top 25% (assuming they dip that low) can make good money upon graduation. I want to be able to pay off that exorbitant tuition someday! Also, CU has a football team, DU doesn't, which is something to think about also. And Chipotle started across the street from DU, which is a great sign for DU.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 04, 2008, 09:34:36 AM
I think info on how hard it is to keep the scholarships would be very helpful.  I'm hoping for one from Denver (3.1GPA, 167LSAT) because I'm also thinking I'll be headed for the WL pile at CU.

That being said, the positivity that people seem to have toward DU is certainly reassuring. 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 04, 2008, 10:44:07 PM
Concur with everything Matthies says. (what else is new?)  Except the snow. . .it seems to be sticking really well lately. :P

If cost is your #1 concern, go to CU unless DU gives you a full ride + stipend and/or some other great deal.  As a student, you are eligible for in state tuition after 1 year at CU.

Everything else is about equal.

Students at both schools seem pretty happy.  I worked with 2 CU alums & 1 current student at my summer internship and they had a lot of good things to say about the school.  I too see more DU students than CU students at networking events but I think we just outnumber them.  A lot of times, I see the same CU people over and over. . .maybe they are the ones that can afford gas?  :P  Anyway, nobody says "oh, I'm better than you or I have better job prospects because I go to CU or DU", etc.  There is a mutual respect for the schools and we have a friendly rivary (especially during intra-school mock trial competitions).

I'll throw a negative out there about DU.  Wondering if your professor who is visiting at the Univ of N Carolina law forgot about your class.  Disclaimer: I'm bitter about not having my grade.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Nietzsche on February 05, 2008, 07:39:15 AM
THe DU Ugrad prestige comes from the fact that it is becoming incredibly difficult to get into it as a first-year UGRAD. Because CU is a public university it takes relatively low test scores and GPA's.  I do some advising at a prestigious private high school and we had kids with 3.3 and good SATs not getting in. 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 05, 2008, 12:37:53 PM
Thanks for your responses. I think my comment appeared confrontational. I was more about the DU students thinking they are prestigious. I think we all hope too! :)

So I saw that someone asked the question that if your myweb all of a sudden has registration stuff and other info does that mean you were accepted. Because myweb just started saying that and it also lists stipend stuff on the bottom of one of the pages. I would be pretty stoked if I got a stipend also, although I don't know how much my numbers warrant it. My index on LSN is 3.4, but I didn't see anything above a 20,000 dollars scholarship on there. Can someone else check their myweb and see if theirs says all that stuff too? It would be appreciated.

So I read all 27 pages of that other DU thread. I am getting pretty excited to get an acceptance from somewhere. My wife wants us to go to DU though. She loved it there. I did also on my visit. I don't remember if I mentioned this on my last post, but the professors were quite impressive. Also, Denver is much more appealing than Boulder. Also, I like the idea of a fabulous amount of alumni.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 05, 2008, 12:42:26 PM
So in myweb under the "Student and Financial Aid" tab it lists:

Admissions
Enter a new application ~ Complete an application ~ Review application status
 Registration
Check your registration status; Add or drop classes; Select variable credits, grading modes, or levels; Display your class schedule.
 Student Records
View your holds; Display your grades and transcripts; Review charges and payments.
 Financial Aid
Apply for financial aid ~ Review application status ~ Review loans
 Student Account
 Housing
Apply for Housing ~ View/Change Housing Preferences
 Study Abroad
Inquire and Apply for DU Study Abroad Programs
 Writing and Research Center
Schedule an appointment ~ View/Cancel your appointments


So it has all those options. I clicked on "Registration" and these were some of the options:

   Accept/Waive Health Insurance and Fee
    COF Stipend Authorization
    COF Stipend History
    Withdraw from DU

The Withdraw one is interesting. Do they just put that on every myweb site? I am interested in the Stipend business also. I am guessing that COF means something different, but I want someone else to check theirs and update me.

Thanks again.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 05, 2008, 02:28:53 PM
So in myweb under the "Student and Financial Aid" tab it lists:

Admissions
Enter a new application ~ Complete an application ~ Review application status
 Registration
Check your registration status; Add or drop classes; Select variable credits, grading modes, or levels; Display your class schedule.
 Student Records
View your holds; Display your grades and transcripts; Review charges and payments.
 Financial Aid
Apply for financial aid ~ Review application status ~ Review loans
 Student Account
 Housing
Apply for Housing ~ View/Change Housing Preferences
 Study Abroad
Inquire and Apply for DU Study Abroad Programs
 Writing and Research Center
Schedule an appointment ~ View/Cancel your appointments


So it has all those options. I clicked on "Registration" and these were some of the options:

   Accept/Waive Health Insurance and Fee
    COF Stipend Authorization
    COF Stipend History
    Withdraw from DU

The Withdraw one is interesting. Do they just put that on every myweb site? I am interested in the Stipend business also. I am guessing that COF means something different, but I want someone else to check theirs and update me.

Thanks again.

The only way to know for sure is to call the admissions office.  It could just mean that your status changed and they are reviewing your application.  Good luck!  :)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 05, 2008, 02:48:28 PM
So in myweb under the "Student and Financial Aid" tab it lists:

Admissions
Enter a new application ~ Complete an application ~ Review application status
 Registration
Check your registration status; Add or drop classes; Select variable credits, grading modes, or levels; Display your class schedule.
 Student Records
View your holds; Display your grades and transcripts; Review charges and payments.
 Financial Aid
Apply for financial aid ~ Review application status ~ Review loans
 Student Account
 Housing
Apply for Housing ~ View/Change Housing Preferences
 Study Abroad
Inquire and Apply for DU Study Abroad Programs
 Writing and Research Center
Schedule an appointment ~ View/Cancel your appointments


So it has all those options. I clicked on "Registration" and these were some of the options:

   Accept/Waive Health Insurance and Fee
    COF Stipend Authorization
    COF Stipend History
    Withdraw from DU

The Withdraw one is interesting. Do they just put that on every myweb site? I am interested in the Stipend business also. I am guessing that COF means something different, but I want someone else to check theirs and update me.

Thanks again.

The only way to know for sure is to call the admissions office.  It could just mean that your status changed and they are reviewing your application.  Good luck!  :)

I would do that but I think that would seem annoying. There has to be someone else around that isn't admitted yet that can check theirs too to see if it says that. I think they tell you in the email not to call and ask about your application status.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: cesco on February 05, 2008, 05:03:38 PM
Killtheheadlights,

I can't speak to your question about your admissions status, but I did want to comment on your scholarship concerns at DU.  For my class, the minimum requirement to keep a general scholarship is a 3.0 (some of the endowed scholarships do not have a GPA requirements).  Our curve is a 3.0, so this is essentially the 50% mark.  Meaning top half of the class.  If you dont make that mark after 1L, they put you on scholarship probation and give you an extra semester to try to pull above the mark.  I know of someone that went on probation, but I dont know anyone that has actually lost their scholarship.  So, I dont know how that works.  Also, I am confident that all of the scholarship kids were spread among the sections.  I would definitely ask the admissions office about this concern, but unless something has changed it shouldnt be an issue.

As for the prestige comments... this is Colorado.  No one here cares about prestige. We care about good powder days in the winter, and hiking days in the summer.  We leave the prestige to the east coasters. ;)


The second thing is that I LOVE DENVER. I lived there for two years and completely adore the place now. My wife and I are planning on making Denver our permanent residence (as applying to only those two schools would imply). I would much rather live in Denver for my three years of law school than Boulder, but I haven't actually visited CU yet so I don't know for sure. Also, I think I am likely to get a scholarship at DU, and if I did that would mitigate the tuition difference. Although I hear that they stick everyone with scholarships in the same section so only about a third of them actually maintain the 3.1 minimum GPA and lose their scholarships. I believe that I will be in the top 25% of my class, but so does about 80% of every class, so I want to be realistic.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 05, 2008, 06:01:29 PM
bear in mind that i applied to be a third year visiting student, but my "application status" says "complete, ready for review"

i dont have any of the other stuff you see, as far as i can tell....
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Quetzal on February 05, 2008, 06:35:43 PM
OK... I went ahead & checked myweb.  I got

Admissions
Enter a new application ~ Complete an application ~ Review application status

Financial Aid
Apply for financial aid ~ Review application status ~ Review loans

I applied on 12/14, and was barely complete on 1/11.. so we'll see.

Make sure to post if you are indeed accepted!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: backpacking on February 05, 2008, 06:51:36 PM
I got into Denver last week (application was completed Jan 2) and am really interested in the school... but i'm in Toronto and don't know a lot about the school. I'm looking to be involved in International Law, specifically pertaining to Human Rights. The website doesn't offer a lot of information - can anyone speak to the international law program and opportunities for students while in school and upon graduation in that field?

Thanks!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 05, 2008, 09:30:16 PM
If someone can tell me how to post a picture I will post a picture of MyWeb so you guys can see. It looks like I am accepted, but I don't want to get my hopes up for no reason.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 05, 2008, 09:37:38 PM
Call the admissions & ask.  If you are so worried about annoying them, don't give them your name. . .general inquiry.  They aren't going to ding you because you called in regards to your status.

International law:  I would say international law is one of the top three programs as far as student interest at DU.  In no particular order: Environmental, International, Corporate.  We have a nationally ranked international journal, lots of international classes, russian/spanish for lawyers program, etc.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: ShakedownStreet on February 06, 2008, 11:39:48 AM
Call the admissions & ask.  If you are so worried about annoying them, don't give them your name. . .general inquiry.  They aren't going to ding you because you called in regards to your status.

International law:  I would say international law is one of the top three programs as far as student interest at DU.  In no particular order: Environmental, International, Corporate.  We have a nationally ranked international journal, lots of international classes, russian/spanish for lawyers program, etc.

agreed.  I don't think that admissions will look down on anyone who is just trying to figure out the status of an application, especially when you have a legitimate reason to inquire.  In fact, I was told that my persistence with following up (letters, phone calls, and emails) was an important factor in my acceptance. 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 06, 2008, 12:07:55 PM
I think this was the case for me too.  I called about every 2 weeks or so starting Feb/Mar in my application cycle to check on my status.  By calling, I think I showed a genuine interest in the school and that I would attend if accepted (which is very important to the school).  Just remember, be nice.  Good luck! 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: annarborite on February 06, 2008, 12:23:08 PM
I applied to CU and not DU.  CU will be one of my top picks if they accept me and offer me some scholarship $$.  Anyone have any idea why CU is taking so long with decisions?  They admitted a slew of peeps in December, but no one is January or since. 

I am content with waiting, just curious.  Maybe I'll see some of you in Boulder next fall!  Do many law students live outside of boulder in some of the previously mentioned suburbs? 
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 06, 2008, 03:09:00 PM
I applied to CU and not DU.  CU will be one of my top picks if they accept me and offer me some scholarship $$.  Anyone have any idea why CU is taking so long with decisions?  They admitted a slew of peeps in December, but no one is January or since. 

I am content with waiting, just curious.  Maybe I'll see some of you in Boulder next fall!  Do many law students live outside of boulder in some of the previously mentioned suburbs? 
  :D

Maybe they are up in the mountains taking advantage of the powder days.  ;)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 06, 2008, 05:48:28 PM
So I called today. They said that I wasn't, as of yet, accepted. So it seems that part of the webpage doesn't mean much. But the admissions officer was really nice (Karen?) and said that she would look at my app. She said she would get back to me in a couple of days.

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 08, 2008, 09:19:35 PM
I really wanted a decision today :( Maybe tomorrow? Do the ever give decisions on Saturdays?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 09, 2008, 04:50:09 AM
I really wanted a decision today :( Maybe tomorrow? Do the ever give decisions on Saturdays?


lol dont we all.  although i now am in the same boat as you are with the access to various places in the system that werent there yesterday.

and  no, i've never known a decision to be given on a saturday, but any day the mail is delivered....
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 09, 2008, 06:25:39 PM
Now the part of MyWeb that says "Complete/Ready for Review" is gone! What does this mean law school Gods (besides the seemingly obvious)?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 09, 2008, 06:33:59 PM
Now the part of MyWeb that says "Complete/Ready for Review" is gone! What does this mean law school Gods (besides the seemingly obvious)?


what?  it happened today?   hmmmm.......



eta:  mine is still there -- try applying for housing -- if it lets you into the application, i'd say youre in....
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 09, 2008, 08:16:20 PM
Now the part of MyWeb that says "Complete/Ready for Review" is gone! What does this mean law school Gods (besides the seemingly obvious)?


what?  it happened today?   hmmmm.......



eta:  mine is still there -- try applying for housing -- if it lets you into the application, i'd say youre in....


I can get into the housing application! Are you sure that means I am accepted? I have a 3.43/162, so I thought I would be, but people get denied with high stats for schools everywhere. It is good to know I will be going somewhere. Also, I have toured the school and I was quite impressed. How do you know that the housing is a good sign, it seems it would be, but do you know?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 09, 2008, 08:34:12 PM
Now the part of MyWeb that says "Complete/Ready for Review" is gone! What does this mean law school Gods (besides the seemingly obvious)?


what?  it happened today?   hmmmm.......



eta:  mine is still there -- try applying for housing -- if it lets you into the application, i'd say youre in....


I can get into the housing application! Are you sure that means I am accepted? I have a 3.43/162, so I thought I would be, but people get denied with high stats for schools everywhere. It is good to know I will be going somewhere. Also, I have toured the school and I was quite impressed. How do you know that the housing is a good sign, it seems it would be, but do you know?


heres what mine says when i try:  The Housing Application process is only for students who are currently enrolled at the University of Denver or who have been admitted to the University of Denver.


congrats
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 09, 2008, 09:07:20 PM
GREAT DAY! Now for University of Colorado. If I get accepted to both it will be hard to choose. I am not leaning toward either one yet.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 10, 2008, 03:25:13 PM
Very interesting.

I, too, can now access my housing application (it only has "2007-2008, Spring Only" available, FYI).  I even updated my emergency contact.

I went complete on 1/14, so our timelines appear to be similar.  Hmm.  Keep us posted when/if you get a written response, please.  Oh, and GL with scholarship dough, if I get enough, we might be classmates.

...We can compare our favorite Beck songs.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 10, 2008, 09:06:41 PM
Very interesting.

I, too, can now access my housing application (it only has "2007-2008, Spring Only" available, FYI).  I even updated my emergency contact.

I went complete on 1/14, so our timelines appear to be similar.  Hmm.  Keep us posted when/if you get a written response, please.  Oh, and GL with scholarship dough, if I get enough, we might be classmates.

...We can compare our favorite Beck songs.

It is good to see some Beck recognition! I think it is one of the greatest lines ever!

So I just checked my Housing thing and it only lets me apply for Spring Semester also.  I wonder if that just means that nobody can apply for fall yet?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: woeisme on February 10, 2008, 10:42:27 PM
Hi Everyone!

I've applied to both the University of Colorado and the University of Denver.  I have yet to recieve answers from any schools that I applied to, but Colorado and Denver are definitely my top two choices (I want to practice in or around Denver after I graduate). 

Anyways, because my apps are done I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice (pros and cons) etc about Colorado vs. Denver?  I know that I may not ultimately have a decision to make between the two, but I'm hoping to have the option of choosing between the two schools and I would just like to hear what other current or prospective students have to say about the two schools. Thanks!

Wait to see where you get in.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 11, 2008, 10:23:50 PM
Hi Everyone!

I've applied to both the University of Colorado and the University of Denver.  I have yet to recieve answers from any schools that I applied to, but Colorado and Denver are definitely my top two choices (I want to practice in or around Denver after I graduate). 

Anyways, because my apps are done I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice (pros and cons) etc about Colorado vs. Denver?  I know that I may not ultimately have a decision to make between the two, but I'm hoping to have the option of choosing between the two schools and I would just like to hear what other current or prospective students have to say about the two schools. Thanks!

Wait to see where you get in.

I think it boils down to a few issues:

1. Rank/Alumni
2. Location
3. Preference
4. Co$t

For the first. CU is ranked considerably higher. They are also much more selective. They also have a smaller class size (those are probably all related). But, DU has a very large alumni base. I have heard as high as 60% of attorneys in Denver are DU grads. That is probably due to the fact that their classes are twice as large, but iat is still the situation regardless of the reason. I have looked on MANY law firm sites in Denver and it seems to me that there are just as many CU and DU attorneys at each firm. The only notable thing I see in my anecdotal research is that almost without fail DU attorneys at top firms are in the top 10% of the class, while that is not always the case with CU grads. So it seems, again anecdotally, that you can place lower in your class at CU and still have similar job prospects. But, I think for job placement they are almost equal. Each gets a nod for a different reason: DU for the # of alumni; CU for the ability to place in top firms without having to be ranked as high in the class.

The second thing is location. CU, to me, offers almost zero advantages in regards to location. I have heard many people claim that if you like the outdoors CU is a much better option, but that seems naive. CU is in the foothills, but DU is about 15-25 minutes from them. Also, Denver probably has some of the best recreation trails in the country. So it isn't difficult to do outdoor activities. Other than that, CU doesn't offer much. Boulder is a college town, is relatively close to Denver but definitely not considered a metro town, and is not very close to Denver networking activities if you consider a law students tight schedule and travel budget issues. Just like recreation for Denver, CU isn't prohibitively far from Denver, but it is an inconvenience to travel to Denver. And Denver is much more of a ride from CU than the mountains are from DU. Denver is a fantastic city, Boulder is rather removed from it. I can't substantiate this, but I have heard that surprisingly Boulder is expensive, sometimes more expensive than Denver for an apartment search.

Third is preference. This, obviously, is entirely up to you. If you want to teach Boulder might be a better option. If you want to practice and live in Denver, I think DU might get the nod (slightly). I think ranking does hold weight, but I think it is for a specific group that this applies to. I think Denver is an extremely strong school IN THE REGION, and because of that fact it places well in Denver. I think that if you want to take the degree elsewhere, which you implied you didn't, you would be better off going to CU.

The fourth and very important factor is cost. DU is more expensive. CU also gives the ability to have in state tuition for your second and third year if you don't get it automatically. This is the equivalent of a 12,000 dollar a year scholarship at Denver for you second and third year. That makes it hard to want to pay DU's tuition prices. While people are much more likely to get a scholarship at DU, I would say CU comes with a built in scholarship second and third year. People would "probably" be more competitive at DU and more likely to place within the top of their class, but I also think 90% of people who attend DU think this and it becomes more competitive as a result. I don't know which is more expensive from a cost of living standpoint, but I think they are probably close to the same. (The new lightrail at Denver is a great addition, and quite economical).


Those are my quick thoughts. Those are the things I am struggling with if I get accepted to both. I have no idea which school I would attend. I am really hoping I will have to make the choice. Both are fine options, in my opinion.

You seem like you love conspiracy theories. I always smirk when I see people who don't post their stats. Especially because that is the whole point of LSN. Why not just wait until your cycle is over before posting stats. Acceptances without stats don't mean much. I hope adcomms have more to do during the day than to check applicants with profiles on LSN.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 12, 2008, 07:43:11 AM
The only notable thing I see in my anecdotal research is that almost without fail DU attorneys at top firms are in the top 10% of the class, while that is not always the case with CU grads.



have you asked the placement office what happens to the other 90% of the class?

DU states according to LSAC:

# employed in law firms, 149, 45.3%
# employed in business and industry, 50, 15.2%
# employed in government, 57, 17.3%
# employed in public interest, 15, 4.6%
# employed as judicial clerks, 27, 8.2%
# employed in academia, 7, 2.1%

that kind of begs the question as to where the grads go in-state -- that seems a relatively low percentage going into corporate law, with all the companies headquartered in colorado. 

CU, LSAC stats:

# employed in law firms, 78, 49.1%
# employed in business and industry, 18, 11.3%
# employed in government, 32, 20.1%
# employed in public interest, 2, 1.3%
# employed as judicial clerks, 27, 17.0%
# employed in academia, 1, 0.6%
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: CoupDeGlace on February 12, 2008, 09:46:58 AM
The only notable thing I see in my anecdotal research is that almost without fail DU attorneys at top firms are in the top 10% of the class, while that is not always the case with CU grads.



have you asked the placement office what happens to the other 90% of the class?

DU states according to LSAC:

# employed in law firms, 149, 45.3%
# employed in business and industry, 50, 15.2%
# employed in government, 57, 17.3%
# employed in public interest, 15, 4.6%
# employed as judicial clerks, 27, 8.2%
# employed in academia, 7, 2.1%

that kind of begs the question as to where the grads go in-state -- that seems a relatively low percentage going into corporate law, with all the companies headquartered in colorado. 

CU, LSAC stats:

# employed in law firms, 78, 49.1%
# employed in business and industry, 18, 11.3%
# employed in government, 32, 20.1%
# employed in public interest, 2, 1.3%
# employed as judicial clerks, 27, 17.0%
# employed in academia, 1, 0.6%

Perhaps, but those numbers for both DU and CU graduates that go into corporate law is more or less on par with what I see at other schools. At the top schools, percentage that go into business and industry are usually in the single digits (0.7% at NYU, 3.9% at Cornell, 5.1% at Georgetown, etc) Going into corporate doesn't apparently pay as high as securing a job with a top firm in private practice, and it doesn't offer the perks that can come with going into government or the military.

I, for one, would like to do corporate law. Those numbers really are quite high for both schools for those going into corporate law, so I don't view that as a problem.

I've only been accepted at DU thus far and am waiting back on CU. I'd love to have to choose between the two, it'd be a nice problem to have! The thing about CU is, if you're not getting any scholarship from Denver, at least if you go to CU after one year you get state residency and pay in-state tuition, so in the end going to CU would be cheaper. I personally think being in Denver is the better location, and Denver is apparently more affordable than Boulder in terms of cost of living, but for those that do have to consider between the two, it's definitely a tough decision.

I don't think, if you wanted to practice in Colorado, you could go wrong with either, really. As for at Denver needing to be toward the top of your class to get a job at the top firms... this is pretty much the story at any school of similar ranking. CU also has a much smaller class than Denver, which is also one reason why getting in there is a lot harder, plus it's ranked 41 spots higher. I wish I knew more first-hand about the legal job market in Colorado and how each was received, but coming from Florida I have to rely on what I hear from others.

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 13, 2008, 10:10:51 AM
I was just admitted to Denver. Yay.

One thing: in the email, there is no mention of scholarship or merit awards.  I was kind of counting on something from them, as my numbers are very comparable to others who have received financial support.  Does this info come later? In a seperate letter?

Thanks.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Put em up! on February 13, 2008, 05:02:28 PM
I was just admitted to Denver. Yay.

One thing: in the email, there is no mention of scholarship or merit awards.  I was kind of counting on something from them, as my numbers are very comparable to others who have received financial support.  Does this info come later? In a seperate letter?

Thanks.
It came in a seperate email a few days later for me.  Also, it is not with the snail mail letter they send you, it is an additional letter.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 13, 2008, 07:16:27 PM
I got in today also! It looks like there is significance to the MyWeb business and the housing application. I might actually have to make the decision between Colorado and Denver! That would be great!

Yeah, I am hoping for some money also.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Kiwi on February 14, 2008, 12:56:24 PM
Hey everyone. I've been following this post for awhile now. 

I've been accepted to DU with a pretty awesome scholarship, so this tread has pretty much sealed the deal for me.  I haven't heard back from Colorado yet, but I doubt they could come close to matching the scholarship to DU.

I just made my travel arrangements to go to the Admitted Students Day.  Anyone else on here going?  I think it's March 28th.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 15, 2008, 03:00:34 PM
I will be attending Admitted Student Day. It is the 28th of March.

Also, I called yesterday and the adcomm I talked to said that they only give full scholarships to people who are interested in public interest. She said that she think the highest offer they are giving people right now is 20,000 a year. What have you guys gotten there?

Also, I heard that CU signed the top running back prospect in the nation. Is that swaying anyone :) ?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 15, 2008, 04:40:48 PM
<------- from nebraska



i'll pay the higher tuition thanks  ;)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 16, 2008, 10:56:44 PM
<------- from nebraska



i'll pay the higher tuition thanks  ;)

Ha, I talked to a Nebraskan yesterday. I think CU would be a sweet school.

I got mail yesterday with a 15,000 scholarship a year. I am jealous of the 20,000 a year scholarship. Assuming I get accepted to Colorado I have no idea which one I would choose right now.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 17, 2008, 06:02:06 AM
<------- from nebraska



i'll pay the higher tuition thanks  ;)

Ha, I talked to a Nebraskan yesterday. I think CU would be a sweet school.

I got mail yesterday with a 15,000 scholarship a year. I am jealous of the 20,000 a year scholarship. Assuming I get accepted to Colorado I have no idea which one I would choose right now.


you dont seem nasty enough to be a CU fan  ;)


congrats on the scholly, too bad they dont give any visiting students any love
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 09:10:08 AM
So it seems like Dever would be around 47,000 dollars total in tuition for me right now. Colorado, assuming I didn't get a scholarship (which is probably likely), would be 66,000 dollars.

So, do you guys think the higher ranking is worth 20,000 dollars of additional debt? I am undecided.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: rekopter on February 17, 2008, 02:48:19 PM
So it seems like Dever would be around 47,000 dollars total in tuition for me right now. Colorado, assuming I didn't get a scholarship (which is probably likely), would be ...thinking...30+18+18=66,000 dollars.

So, do you guys think the higher ranking is worth 20,000 dollars of additional debt? I am undecided.

Keep in mind that not all scholarship offers are locks for three years. Neither is in-state tuition.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 03:59:13 PM
So it seems like Dever would be around 47,000 dollars total in tuition for me right now. Colorado, assuming I didn't get a scholarship (which is probably likely), would be ...thinking...30+18+18=66,000 dollars.

So, do you guys think the higher ranking is worth 20,000 dollars of additional debt? I am undecided.

Keep in mind that not all scholarship offers are locks for three years. Neither is in-state tuition.

I am aware. Denver's is contingent upon a 3.0 cumulative. In-state tuition at Colorado does seem like a lock for the second and third year.

But thanks for answering the question!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 04:01:40 PM
So it seems like Dever would be around 47,000 dollars total in tuition for me right now. Colorado, assuming I didn't get a scholarship (which is probably likely), would be 66,000 dollars.

So, do you guys think the higher ranking is worth 20,000 dollars of additional debt? I am undecided.

And I am specifically speaking about CU v. DU. Clearly Harvard compared to DU would be worthwhile. But DU and CU seem quite comparable in the area, which is where I plan on practicing.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 04:52:03 PM
For the ranking between those I don't think it is worth it to pay more for one or the other.

As mentioned, the real debate is maintaining 3.0 vs the instate.  Lose the 3.0 and the price jumps accordingly.  Don't get instate and you are paying (possibly) alot more. 

But from what I understand it is nearly impossible to lose the instate. How could you?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: summerisnear on February 17, 2008, 05:05:38 PM
Just to add one more opinion, I'm a CO native, went to CU for undergrad, loved it.  I applied to CU and DU and got rejected at both, but I wanted CU much more.  In state tuition is impossible for me to pass up.  I am still seriously considering trying to transfer to CU for 2L depending on where I end up for 1L.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: summerisnear on February 17, 2008, 05:12:40 PM
One more thing about housing in Boulder.  It doesn't have to be as expensive as it's typically rumored to be.  I lived in Boulder for about 2 years after graduating, and the last house I lived in was 4 blocks from Pearl St. and I paid $300/month.  If you have the time and patience you can find rates right on par with prices in Denver.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 17, 2008, 05:13:32 PM
Just to add one more opinion, I'm a CO native, went to CU for undergrad, loved it.  I applied to CU and DU and got rejected at both, but I wanted CU much more.  In state tuition is impossible for me to pass up.  I am still seriously considering trying to transfer to CU for 2L depending on where I end up for 1L.


consider arkansas, either little rock (where i am) or fayetteville.  in-state tuition scholly for ALL out of state acceptees.

i did 2 years here and will do the visiting student thing at denver for 3L.  that is, if they ever confirm it.   :P
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 07:01:08 PM
Just to add one more opinion, I'm a CO native, went to CU for undergrad, loved it.  I applied to CU and DU and got rejected at both, but I wanted CU much more.  In state tuition is impossible for me to pass up.  I am still seriously considering trying to transfer to CU for 2L depending on where I end up for 1L.


consider arkansas, either little rock (where i am) or fayetteville.  in-state tuition scholly for ALL out of state acceptees.

i did 2 years here and will do the visiting student thing at denver for 3L.  that is, if they ever confirm it.   :P

Arkansas...no thank you. I have zero interest in living in Arkansas. Also, there is probably a reason why they give in-state for all out of staters, they are probably worried about bringing their ranking up. I am already worried about Dener's ranking, never mind Arkansas'.

Also, I have a wife and two kids so 300 dollar a month rent isn't realistic for me. I was looking around for Boulder apartments today and they seem pretty similar to Denver's prices. My wife and I are probably going to live in Highlands Ranch and I will take the lightrail.

It seems nobody wants to answer my question. Denver with a 15,000 a year scholarship or CU w/ out money, just in state second and third year. What do you all think, does CU's higher ranking make it worth it?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: CoupDeGlace on February 17, 2008, 07:13:24 PM
Well, were you admitted to CU? Because in the end all of this could be for nothing. The decision could ultimately be made for you.

Coming from out of state... I'd probably go to CU over DU. I have yet to be offered a scholarship from DU, and I don't expect to be offered one (if by some chance I am, that'd change my whole view on things) As it is it's hard enough to seriously going to Denver over one of my own state universities, both of which are at least 20 spots higher in the rankings.

Once you live in Colorado for a year, you're able to pay in-state tuition for the second and third years at CU. The DU scholarship has a 3.0 requirement, as you said. Now, I think that'd be great motivation to work hard and not allow yourself to slip (not you in particular, but anyone) But there's definitely more security in the CU in-state tuition for second and third years.

Beyond that... CU's class is much smaller than DU's... I'm assuming that being ranked 36 over 77 entails that the school does enjoy some deal of greater prestige. That's not to say DU is a bad school, it may mean DU is a great school but CU is just better.

DU looks awesome. So does CU. You have to worry about a wife and kids, so you may have to choose the cheapest option (which would be DU, if you can keep the scholarship) plus wherever you would deem a better place for your family to live for the next three years. I don't know much about Denver or Boulder (besides the fact that I wouldn't mind living in either city) but I'd assume that, being a huge city, Denver would have greater options for your family.

Anyway, as I said, this could all be a moot point. It's all pending on your acceptance to CU. I hope I, too, have to make such a decision.  ;D Best of luck!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 07:46:25 PM
Well, were you admitted to CU? Because in the end all of this could be for nothing. The decision could ultimately be made for you.

Coming from out of state... I'd probably go to CU over DU. I have yet to be offered a scholarship from DU, and I don't expect to be offered one (if by some chance I am, that'd change my whole view on things) As it is it's hard enough to seriously going to Denver over one of my own state universities, both of which are at least 20 spots higher in the rankings.

Once you live in Colorado for a year, you're able to pay in-state tuition for the second and third years at CU. The DU scholarship has a 3.0 requirement, as you said. Now, I think that'd be great motivation to work hard and not allow yourself to slip (not you in particular, but anyone) But there's definitely more security in the CU in-state tuition for second and third years.

Beyond that... CU's class is much smaller than DU's... I'm assuming that being ranked 36 over 77 entails that the school does enjoy some deal of greater prestige. That's not to say DU is a bad school, it may mean DU is a great school but CU is just better.

DU looks awesome. So does CU. You have to worry about a wife and kids, so you may have to choose the cheapest option (which would be DU, if you can keep the scholarship) plus wherever you would deem a better place for your family to live for the next three years. I don't know much about Denver or Boulder (besides the fact that I wouldn't mind living in either city) but I'd assume that, being a huge city, Denver would have greater options for your family.

Anyway, as I said, this could all be a moot point. It's all pending on your acceptance to CU. I hope I, too, have to make such a decision.  ;D Best of luck!

Agreed. I think that for people who want to practice in Denver there is a whole different issue in regards to your talk about schools in your home state. If you wanted to practice in Denver I think going to one of the higher ranked schools in your home state would be a poor choice. So DU does get the nod because of its regional appeal, and it DOES have it, over T2 schools in other states.

Like I mentioned previously, I think the only advantage to CU, in regards to prestige, is that you can seemingly rank lower in your class and still get a great job. But, common sense would say that you can rank higher in your class at DU than CU.

I just don't see much of a reason to hold one school much higher than the other, especially if CU is 20,000 more expensive.

And yes, this assumes that I would be getting accepted. And yes, it is possible (maybe likely 3.42/162), that I won't get accepted. But clearly I am trying to plan like I am accepted to both and if I am not I will go to Denver. So I don't really see the need to point that out. About 90% of this site is probably speculation about acceptances and decisions anyway. I hope you get into both though, just for the record :)
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 07:49:43 PM
Oh, and I just was reading an article about the new building and I found out where the old law school building was before the Ricketson was built at DU. It was at Quebec and Montview Blvd. That would be a horrible location. It would seriously make my choice much easier. I am very glad they moved it to its current location on the DU main campus. I toured the building almost two years ago and it was gorgeous, as was the rest of the campus.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: CoupDeGlace on February 17, 2008, 09:19:19 PM
No, I definitely understand this is speculation. But I'm just saying that, while we all drive ourselves mad with endless speculations, at the end of the day it's still just speculation until it becomes a reality. And I hope that for you it becomes a reality very soon.  :)

Keep one thing in mind: All that matters is what school *you* prefer. It doesn't matter what the rankings are. You could get into CU and DU and go to CU and just not feel right there. It's as simple as that. If you want to practice in Denver, there's been much said as to the presence of DU graduates in the legal market there. Particularly if you do well, you shouldn't have any problem getting a great job in Denver. If you do well at CU you'd get a great job in Denver as well, I'm sure. It just really all comes down to what is the better value *for you.* For me, CU would be the better value, at least as it stands with me not having received a scholarship. You already have a scholarship offer from DU.

It's like if I choose to stay in Florida, and presuming I get into UF (crosses fingers) I'll have gotten into the 3 largest Florida schools. In order, they rank UF (47), FSU (53), UM (70). UM would only make sense for me if they gave me a huge scholarship. Which they didn't, which is seriously ruling them out. The tuition for Florida residents at UF and FSU is dirt-cheap ($10,000 a year) So, for me the public institution would be the better choice on cost alone.

So, really, the only one who can make this decision is you. I know asking us what you think you should choose is a natural thing, I always ask family and friends for insight too. But at the end of the day, you'll be paying the tuition and it's your degree, so you have to go where you feel is best for you.

If you chose DU with your scholarship over CU with no scholarship (and DU would still be cheaper), I don't think you would be making a foolish decision.

Sure, some people would still say choose CU. But some people would also say DU.

There's only 2 schools in all of Colorado (in comparison, there are 10 in Florida), so at least you only have to pick one over the other!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 17, 2008, 09:51:08 PM
Yeah, I am just getting opinion. I think that often we can feel one or another, but then someone can say something we didn't think of that makes sense. I am probably leaning toward DU, but I was just gathering opinion.

Also, and probably more importantly, I am someone who goes on "feelings" quite often. So whatever school I feel prompted to go to I will attend. But that doesn't mean someone's words can sway my "feeling."

If you know what I mean.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 18, 2008, 09:24:07 AM
Just to add one more opinion, I'm a CO native, went to CU for undergrad, loved it.  I applied to CU and DU and got rejected at both, but I wanted CU much more.  In state tuition is impossible for me to pass up.  I am still seriously considering trying to transfer to CU for 2L depending on where I end up for 1L.


consider arkansas, either little rock (where i am) or fayetteville.  in-state tuition scholly for ALL out of state acceptees.

i did 2 years here and will do the visiting student thing at denver for 3L.  that is, if they ever confirm it.   :P

I know a 3L visiting student at DU from Arkansas. . .wonder if you know her.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Thistle on February 18, 2008, 09:31:58 AM
Just to add one more opinion, I'm a CO native, went to CU for undergrad, loved it.  I applied to CU and DU and got rejected at both, but I wanted CU much more.  In state tuition is impossible for me to pass up.  I am still seriously considering trying to transfer to CU for 2L depending on where I end up for 1L.


consider arkansas, either little rock (where i am) or fayetteville.  in-state tuition scholly for ALL out of state acceptees.

i did 2 years here and will do the visiting student thing at denver for 3L.  that is, if they ever confirm it.   :P

I know a 3L visiting student at DU from Arkansas. . .wonder if you know her.

nope, i dont know any transfers of visitors from here.  there are a couple of us here trying to do the transfer/visiting thing in denver, so it might be the other guy, he's a 2L as well
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: JDChaser on February 18, 2008, 09:35:04 AM
I've been reading/lurking here for a bit, and decided to actually register and post.  Not that I really have anything new to add, other than to say you should definitely go with what you feel is best.  I am a Colorado resident, Castle Rock to be specific, and I will be going through this whole deal for the next cycle.  For me and where I live, DU with $$$$ would be the ideal choice.  Living where I do, I can drive partway and then take the lightrail the rest of the way which is what I currently do for my undergrad at CU Denver.  I've been in Colorado since '05, started school here in '06 and getting in state tuition starting in '07 was not a problem, just make sure to change the registration on your vehicles and get a Colorado drivers license right away, which ideally would be BEFORE the semester starts, trust me on this.  This probably did not come out in translation, but I am a non-trad student; much older, married, child, etc.  Moving for me is NOT an option so, unlike many, I have 2 choices and that is it.  For me it just comes down to finances.  If I were to get accepted to both, wherever is more cost effective is where I'll go.  I'll commute to Boulder each day if it will save me $30K over 3 years, so all things being equal, I'd go to DU.  As far as working in the region after law school, I don't care what anyone says, they are both relatively equal.  DU has bigger classes, so as the years go by, they incrementally have that many more people in the work force.  This in NO way hinders the opportunities for CU law grads, so don't buy into that.  I can't speak to the situation outside of the region, and since I'll be staying in Colorado, this hasn't been a concern to me.  Good luck with your venture, and I'm sure you'll do well no matter what your ultimate choice may be.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: somanyquestions on February 18, 2008, 09:35:56 AM
Oh, and I just was reading an article about the new building and I found out where the old law school building was before the Ricketson was built at DU. It was at Quebec and Montview Blvd. That would be a horrible location. It would seriously make my choice much easier. I am very glad they moved it to its current location on the DU main campus. I toured the building almost two years ago and it was gorgeous, as was the rest of the campus.

I'm glad they moved the building too. . .I love our building.  I heard the advantage of the old building was the location (across the street from the court house from what I understand).  The rest of the campus won't really matter to you unless you spend a big chunk of time in the undergrad library or get a dual degree.

Congrats on the $$$$$$$$ at DU & I good luck to you with CU.  Both are good schools and you can't go wrong either way.  Despite the differences in rankings both are regional schools that are highly regarded in the area.  At the end of the day the rankings barely matter. . .at least if you want to stay in Colorado.  So once you have that decision to make. . .VISIT VISIT VISIT.  People can give you advice but the ultimate decision is yours.  I know people who went both ways and are happy with their decision.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 18, 2008, 03:57:01 PM
I think I am leaning towards DU. I don't think the ranking is enough of an issue in Colorado to make a difference. I do think I am going to contact DU and ask them to increase the scholarship by 5,000 to make the difference between them and Colorado more.

How are we going to know who is who on Admitted Student Day? We should all wear pink pants with our screen names on the back pocket, just so we know. What do you think?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 19, 2008, 09:22:31 AM
(http://www.law.du.edu/Library/colhistory/images/1002a.jpg)

What a gorgeous foyer. I love that building!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 19, 2008, 11:51:26 AM
Here are some nice pics of DU's law school:

http://www.roamingphotos.com/us/co/denver/udenver/
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: Cabra on February 19, 2008, 12:58:15 PM
Just to offer some variety of opinion...I'm going to go against the trend and just say it: If you get into CU, you should go there over DU--in spite of the $$$.
1. You have a family and Boulder is a great place for families--excellent public schools, lots of kid-friendly activities, great public transport and nice, affordable homes for rent in North and South Boulder (10 minutes by *free* bus to campus). Denver has a few of those things, maybe.
2. In-state tuition after the first year regardless of how you do in law school. Nobody really knows how they'll do in law school. Even if you start out well, a family emergency or illness could cause your grades to drop and you'd lose your scholarship. Then you're low in the class and paying full price--all the benefits of DU evaporate. See this anecdote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8aJO9iTH-w
3. CU may have a less overwhelming alumni presence than DU, but CU's reach extends beyond Denver. The school is well-regarded and the bar pass results speak for themselves. The new building is gorgeous and will only boost CU's selectivity and reputation over the years. I'm a CO native and I've never heard this "DU is more prestigious" bit before--maybe because I'm not from Denver?

DU is a good choice if you can stay at the top of your class. CU is good even if you can't (and it's great if you can). To me, that makes CU the safer bet.

In any case, I hope you get to make the choice between the two!

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 19, 2008, 01:30:42 PM
Just to offer some variety of opinion...I'm going to go against the trend and just say it: If you get into CU, you should go there over DU--in spite of the $$$.
1. You have a family and Boulder is a great place for families--excellent public schools, lots of kid-friendly activities, great public transport and nice, affordable homes for rent in North and South Boulder (10 minutes by *free* bus to campus). Denver has a few of those things, maybe.
2. In-state tuition after the first year regardless of how you do in law school. Nobody really knows how they'll do in law school. Even if you start out well, a family emergency or illness could cause your grades to drop and you'd lose your scholarship. Then you're low in the class and paying full price--all the benefits of DU evaporate. See this anecdote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8aJO9iTH-w
3. CU may have a less overwhelming alumni presence than DU, but CU's reach extends beyond Denver. The school is well-regarded and the bar pass results speak for themselves. The new building is gorgeous and will only boost CU's selectivity and reputation over the years. I'm a CO native and I've never heard this "DU is more prestigious" bit before--maybe because I'm not from Denver?

DU is a good choice if you can stay at the top of your class. CU is good even if you can't (and it's great if you can). To me, that makes CU the safer bet.

In any case, I hope you get to make the choice between the two!



I agree with a lot of what you said. I don't agree with almost any aspect of #1 though. I think Denver has all of those things and more.

I agree with #2, and that is tempting.

I agree with many premises of #3 but would have to say that I only care about job opportunities in Denver, because that is where I want to practice. But everything else I agree with, especially the prestige part.

But I think your first line "I am just going to say it" makes it sound like it is a forgone conclusion, which I do not think it is at all. I don't think the choice between Denver and Colorado is a simple choice, especially when you throw 15,000 a year in the equation, including 1L. That complicates things a great deal. Also, with the scholarship you have to maintain a 3.0 GPA. That is where the median is, so you have to be in the top 50% of your class. I think the VAST MAJORITY of people they give scholarships to are in the top 50% of the class. Yes, emergencies could complicate this, but I don't think the chance that something might happen is worth throwing away 20,000 dollars of avoided debt.

But I think you did say some things that were clearly a good thing to consider.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: botbot on February 21, 2008, 04:22:42 PM
Being happy with your school and your classmates can and will make law school a much better experience overall. Law school will suck at times, it will be stressful at times, it will depress you at times, it will make you want to quite sometimes, liking your school and your classmates is what makes all that crap bearable when it comes.

Invest at least some of the energy you put into choosing school on something more than numbers, visit the school, talk to students, talk to your potential classmates, see what kind of "vibe" you get.  I don't care what schools you are looking at, if you don't feel comfortable there, your going to regret going there later. Its days like this when I'm really glad I'm at DU, my classmates make up for me hating life on Thursdays. As soon as I got here my angst went away as I saw my friends, that makes it all worth it.

I accidentally stumbled into this thread, but pay attention to this post 0Ls.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 21, 2008, 06:28:58 PM
Something I thought I would mention here that I was reminded of today. Go to the school where you  think you will be happiest, I say, personally that's probably the most important aspect to choosing a school. Once your there, the rank won't matter, Yale or Cooley, if you hate your life/loath getting up every day for school the rank is not going to keep you happy during what can be a miserable experience at times.

Today I am in a particularly crappy mood, I have to be at my computer by 6AM on Thursdays for my biz. I did not want to go to school tonight, the class I'm in goes slower than the second coming, and I'm not in the mood for it or the next one. Plus because of other commitments I'll be here till 9:45PM tonight. I was basically in a poo mood when I got here.

Well with in two minuets three people came up to me and said hi. Before I got to the doors I saw two friends with big smiles on their faces who want to chat with me. On my way to class three people said hi to me by name, a professor I had 1L class with came up and shook my hand asked me how I was doing ect. People's whose names I don't know waved and smiled. And I'm a commuter student, I don't hang out at school much, but people still treat you like an old friend here.

The point is as much as I hate Thursday nights at school, my classmates, friends, colleagues, and professors make it worth it even when I don't want to be here. Here at least people are nice and friendly, and they can make a bad day a better one. I'm sure its like that at other schools as well, I'm also sure its not like that at some schools.

Being happy with your school and your classmates can and will make law school a much better experience overall. Law school will suck at times, it will be stressful at times, it will depress you at times, it will make you want to quite sometimes, liking your school and your classmates is what makes all that crap bearable when it comes.

Invest at least some of the energy you put into choosing school on something more than numbers, visit the school, talk to students, talk to your potential classmates, see what kind of "vibe" you get.  I don't care what schools you are looking at, if you don't feel comfortable there, your going to regret going there later. Its days like this when I'm really glad I'm at DU, my classmates make up for me hating life on Thursdays. As soon as I got here my angst went away as I saw my friends, that makes it all worth it.


I appreciate the post Matthies. Interestingly enough I logged on to post on this page how confused I was about where to attend. One of my professors today asked if he could write a letter of recommendation for me. I told him that I had four people write one, so there weren't any more spots, and I had already gone complete. But I did give him the admissions number to call at Colorado. We'll see how that turns out.

So it was refreshing to hear some good things about Denver, because I have already been admitted there. But my question about your post is this: how much does the school matter? While I do acknowledge that the surroundings and weather of an area do affect my happiness, I don't think much else does. Let me give a disclaimer, obviously if I was in an abusive relationship or something I would be unhappy, but I don't have, or anticipate to have, anything like that happening. I think the biggest contributing factor to my happiness is how I am living my life. I think, hopefully, I will live my life the same regardless of which school I go to. I also think that people are largely the same everywhere. I assume I would be greeted at Colorado also. When I visited DU a couple of years ago I was blown away by how friendly everyone was, but I don't anticipate Colorado to be much different. So how much does a school really matter?

I am not trying to cast doubt on your posts, I am honestly asking for an answer. I don't see it, but I would love to!

If I get accepted to CU it will be an EXTREMELY hard choice. Especially after I saw that the difference between instate tuition and out of state is 14,000 dollars. That is almost how much I am getting from Denver. And after that instate break the tuition is only 16,000. That is extremely tempting. I have no idea what I will do, assuming I actually get in  :-\
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 21, 2008, 06:29:49 PM
botbot, where do you go?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: ms10 on February 22, 2008, 12:20:29 PM
Matthies, I have a question for you. I was offered a scholarship by DU that requires I keep at least a 3.0 GPA. Can you tell me where that would fall in your class? I'm just worried about how hard it will be to keep the scholarship. And also, do you have any advice on asking for more money? I am very lucky to have gotten the money I did, but I still need more. Any advice on how to ask?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: cesco on February 22, 2008, 03:27:17 PM
Matthies, I have a question for you. I was offered a scholarship by DU that requires I keep at least a 3.0 GPA. Can you tell me where that would fall in your class? I'm just worried about how hard it will be to keep the scholarship. And also, do you have any advice on asking for more money? I am very lucky to have gotten the money I did, but I still need more. Any advice on how to ask?

I commented on scholarship requirements on page 6 of this thread.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 22, 2008, 03:32:03 PM
I called the other day and they told me that the time to call up and ask for more scholarship money is when the first seat deposits are due. They said they don't have any more money right now.

For what it's worth.


Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: ms10 on February 24, 2008, 05:31:30 PM
OK thanks a lot for the info. I wish I could get more money. I am really nervous about the debt. I plan on moving back home to a SUPER small town to work and I do not expect to make a huge salary at all.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: bangadingdong on February 25, 2008, 07:21:13 AM
FWIW, they told me the same thing.

If only I had submitted my application like...5 days earlier.  How frustrating.

Question: do you think they'll offer more scholarships to those who haven't withdrawn, or will we have to ask for it?  I already called and inquired, but I wonder if I'd have to call back on April 2nd.  It's not a big deal, but it will (at the very least) cost me some $ in seat deposits.

Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 25, 2008, 09:44:03 AM
I think you will have to call. It will probably cost a seat deposit.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: backpacking on February 25, 2008, 08:56:25 PM
I got the e-mail from Denver w/ the estimates on financial aid and it's all loans - no grants/scholarships/etc. I really dont know a lot about paying off huge loans, but what kind of trouble to DU students have after graduating as far as paying off this debt? Im planning on studying international law, as opposed to the more financially rewarding corporate law.

I'm actually a New York resident so the choice is coming down to Buffalo which is a miserable place, but cheap vs. Denver which is an area that i would love to live in... but would graduate with painful debt. But surely i can't be the only one going to Denver without scholarships - how does everyone else do it?

Thanks!
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 25, 2008, 10:03:04 PM
I got the e-mail from Denver w/ the estimates on financial aid and it's all loans - no grants/scholarships/etc. I really dont know a lot about paying off huge loans, but what kind of trouble to DU students have after graduating as far as paying off this debt? Im planning on studying international law, as opposed to the more financially rewarding corporate law.

I'm actually a New York resident so the choice is coming down to Buffalo which is a miserable place, but cheap vs. Denver which is an area that i would love to live in... but would graduate with painful debt. But surely i can't be the only one going to Denver without scholarships - how does everyone else do it?

Thanks!

I think the majority of people have a hard time when they graduate. But let's face it, if you make around 70,000 dollars a year and you have a 1,700 monthly payment for your loans you are still bringing in a decent amount of money after the fact. You won't be able to buy the nice house that you imagine attorney's living in, but you will be able to buy a house. You will have to do it like the rest of the population does, you buy a small, less-than-desirable house when you graduate and then you upsize 15 years later. Not that you only think about houses, but you get the idea. I think the vast majority are able to live just fine.

But it is something to think about. I get nervous about it too. I am getting 15K a year but when I look at the debt I will still take out it is quite sobering. I have a wife and two kids also so the cost of living is incredibly high when it is all through loans. Also, I think I read that 25 of students at DU get scholarships, so the vast majority of the students are paying full tuition.
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: backpacking on February 26, 2008, 06:17:27 PM
Thanks for all the info. Denver is my top choice but it's $100,000 more than Buffalo. Because they are equally ranked, the practical side of me thinks I should choose Buffalo... but having spent my childhood in Rochester I find W. NY such a cold/snowy/boring place the thought depresses me.

The cost of Denver definitely scares me and i'm looking for some assurance that it's manageable, and that Denver has a solid network for landing well-paying jobs after graduating - even if i'm not in the top percentile. Thoughts from DU students?
Title: Re: U. Colorado or U. Denver? Help!!
Post by: kill the headlights on February 26, 2008, 06:25:50 PM
Thanks for all the info. Denver is my top choice but it's $100,000 more than Buffalo. Because they are equally ranked, the practical side of me thinks I should choose Buffalo... but having spent my childhood in Rochester I find W. NY such a cold/snowy/boring place the thought depresses me.

The cost of Denver definitely scares me and i'm looking for some assurance that it's manageable, and that Denver has a solid network for landing well-paying jobs after graduating - even if i'm not in the top percentile. Thoughts from DU students?

I believe Matties is a 3L at DU.