Law School Discussion

LSAT Preparation => Studying for the LSAT => Topic started by: Typhoon Longwang on December 03, 2005, 10:45:36 AM

Title: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Typhoon Longwang on December 03, 2005, 10:45:36 AM
Game 1: Someone has five appliances, but because his wiring sucks he can't use some in combination with others.
Game 2: Crops are planted in a particular order.  Pure ordering with 8 positions.
Game 3: Six technicians repair radios, TVs, and VCRs.
Game 4: Some bands play on two stages.

Game #1:

Some kid can only have certain items plugged in inside his dorm room according to the electric company.  The items were a hairdryer, a razor, a television, a vacuum cleaner, and a microwave.

The hairdryer could not be plugged in at the same time as either the television or the razor.

The vacuum cleaner could not be plugged in with either the television, the razor, or the hairdryer...which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either

However, I remember that there was only one three-combo: the television, the microwave, and the razor.

The questions were mostly, "If X is plugged in then...."

Questions:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Game #2:

PGKTMHLJ which may be farm equipment

The rules were:
P and G before K

L before K before M

H and L before J

T before M


Questions:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Game #3:

I'll try to remember the repair setup, although I can't remember what they were repairing.  Radios, TVs, and VCRs?

People: S U W X Y Z

X and exactly 3 other people repair radios
Y repairs TVs and VCRs
S does not repair anything that Y repairs
S cannot repair anything that W repairs
U repairs exactly two things
Z repairs more things than Y repairs
W repaired TV's or VCR's or both

So I got:
Radios: X, Z, S, U
TVs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs VCRs), maybe W
VCRs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs TVs), maybe W

Questions:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Game #4

Rules on the concert game as I remember them:

North stage: Performances at 6, 8, 10
South stage: Performances at 8, 10, 12

Folk groups: L, G, H
Rock groups: P, Q, T

G has to play sometime before H
Q has to play immediately after a folk group, but not necessarily on the same stage
If a rock group plays at 10 on one stage, a folk group cannot play at 10 on the other stage
P plays at 6 or 12
T and L play on different stages

Questions:
1.
2.
3.
4.
5.


************************************************************************************************

If anyone reconstructs the rules/questions for each games just PM me and I'll modify this post.  I didn't take the test so I'll need your help.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 10:53:04 AM
The first game went something like this:

Some kid can only have certain items plugged in inside his dorm room according to the electric company.  The items were a hairdryer, a razor, a television, a vacuum cleaner, and a microwave.

The hairdryer could not be plugged in at the same time as either the television or the razor.

The vacuum cleaner could not be plugged in with either the television, the razor, or the microwave (I think, I might be screwing these up).

However, I remember that there was only one three-combo: the television, the microwave, and the razor.

The questions were so easy, they were mostly, "If X is plugged in then...."
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Terabithia on December 03, 2005, 10:57:01 AM
That game was soo easy. I was so happy. I hope I didn't mess it up!!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 10:58:53 AM
I KNOW I KNOW---I kept looking at it and saying "Darn, I gotta be missing something, this game is just TOO easy"
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: dinsosaur junior on December 03, 2005, 11:00:27 AM
I agree that one was easy though I thought the last one was hard about the folk and rock bands because of the time overlap (two at 10). My chart initially was messed up but I think I fixed it.

The GLuck one about tone (in RC) was tacit something, right? I stupidly put the indifference one. Damnit.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: matts720 on December 03, 2005, 11:00:49 AM
I may have missed 2 questions on the final game, the concert stage and times the bands go on, but everything else was quite easy.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Ivan on December 03, 2005, 11:01:30 AM
For me one of the LR was the experimental.  I am thinking it was the one where there was an extremely convoluted question about leadership around number 16 followed by a question on the brake features of cars.  Can someone who didn't have a LR experimental section let me know if you remember those two questions????
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Casper on December 03, 2005, 11:02:29 AM
I guess this was done to make up for the extremely hard Oct games section. 
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Terabithia on December 03, 2005, 11:03:26 AM
The rock concert question did get me too!!!   :'(

 And i did put tacit agrrement for that question. It was between that and Enthusiastic support. And it didn't seem that enthusiastic to me.

 I actually found the October games easier. I only got 1 wrong and that was a mistake.
 In this test I had a hard time setting up the diagramme for the fourth question.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 11:03:38 AM
I had TWO games sections -- did you?  If not, then this was the real games section (the one with the hairdryer/dorm room questions)...and in that case, I just kicked some serious a$$ because it was the easiest games section ever.  The second section of games was a lot more difficult (there was one in there about books being read and also reviewed)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:03:56 AM
sorry pal, the brakes LR was definitely a real one. i share your pain though, i had 2 AR and i killed the experimental, and messed up on the easy easy real AR.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:08:15 AM
I agree that the Rock-Folk one was the most difficult, but the placement of G and Q pretty much determined eveything else.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 11:08:53 AM
sorry pal, the brakes LR was definitely a real one. i share your pain though, i had 2 AR and i killed the experimental, and messed up on the easy easy real AR.

Yeah, the brakes one was real.  Did anyone have questions regarding a book club (it was a game).
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: lex19 on December 03, 2005, 11:09:03 AM
*&^% i marked enthusiastic not tactic
The rock concert question did get me too!!!   :'(

 And i did put tacit agrrement for that question. It was between that and Enthusiastic support. And it didn't seem that enthusiastic to me.

 I actually found the October games easier. I only got 1 wrong and that was a mistake.
 In this test I had a hard time setting up the diagramme for the fourth question.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Rooster on December 03, 2005, 11:09:46 AM
that rock concert *&^% was hard IMO
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: thelsater on December 03, 2005, 11:10:28 AM
Hi,

While it's still early, does anyone remember what their answers were for the last game (the rock/folk band one)?

Thanks
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Terabithia on December 03, 2005, 11:11:07 AM
me tooo, I thought it was hard. I had trouble setting it up but I think I was mainly a little panicked cos I knw I was having trouble.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: lex19 on December 03, 2005, 11:11:22 AM
did anyone by chance get three A's in a row i think for the rock/folk game.....if you didn't just don't tell me
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 11:11:32 AM
that rock concert sh*t was hard IMO

I thought that was easy.  I had that in the first section of games.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:11:47 AM
i agree that the rock one wasn't hard, but I think it was the hardest of the bunch
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: thelsater on December 03, 2005, 11:13:33 AM
For the rock/folk band game I had AAABB, and the three questions before that I remember were CCC....anyone?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 11:13:43 AM
i agree that the rock one wasn't hard, but I think it was the hardest of the bunch

Was that the REAL games section or experimental?  If that was real...I just got my best lsat score ever I think.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: dinsosaur junior on December 03, 2005, 11:14:51 AM
OOh, I think I had AAA somewhere there. Yay.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:15:50 AM
yes please, lets analyze that last game bc i set that game up in a really confusing way, and i don't think i did very well.

so rules were...

north - 6, 8, 10

south - 8, 10, 12

if 10 is rock on either side then it immediately follows folk, at either side (so if S-10 is rock then a folk group must be in 8-S or 8-N)

I don't remember which variables where rock and which were folk though

Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: lex19 on December 03, 2005, 11:17:56 AM
thank you, thank you, thank you...i was going to cancel if not...thank you
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 11:18:38 AM
yes please, lets analyze that last game bc i set that game up in a really confusing way, and i don't think i did very well.

so rules were...

north - 6, 8, 10

south - 8, 10, 12

if 10 is rock on either side then it immediately follows folk, at either side (so if S-10 is rock then a folk group must be in 8-S or 8-N)

I don't remember which variables where rock and which were folk though



OK so we are confirming that this is the real games section then?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:19:05 AM
I don't remember the rules like that; I thought one said that if 10 South is rock then 10 North can't be Folk

a folk had to appear before Q (Rock)

P had to be 6 or 12
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:20:59 AM
seriously? i must have gotten that whole game wrong then, i must have misread the rule. i cant believe it. no wonder it was giving me problems. jesus.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:22:18 AM
Which rule did you mistake, because I could be wrong in my remembrance
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:25:21 AM
the 10-rock, something folk rule. I thought it was something like if 10 if rock then folk is immediately before it. but maybe i missed the "not", as in "NOT before it". i can't believe this. i did so well on the rest of the test and potentially screwed up the easiest games section in recent history!! and i usually rock games. sorry...i'm depressed now.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:26:47 AM
dude, settle down, no one on this board knows if she or he is right.  I could be wrong.  Don't get depressed.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 11:30:17 AM
Anyone remember the last 3 answers on the last game...i missbubbled and had to guess, i think i put ADA???

Anyone have a clue
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:37:32 AM
yeah but i'm not disputing an answer, i may have interpreted a rule to mean something different. that can significantly affect your performance on the game.

so someone clarify if possible - anyone know that 10-rock something folk rule?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 11:38:34 AM
Rules on the concert game as I remember them:

North stage: Performances at 6, 8, 10
South stage: Performances at 8, 10, 12

Folk groups: F, G, H
Rock groups: P, Q, T

G has to play sometime before H
Q has to play immediately after a folk group, but not necessarily on the same stage
If a rock group plays at 10 on one stage, a folk group cannot play at 10 on the other stage
P plays at 6 or 12
T and F play on different stages

I'm about 95% sure all of those are right.  Don't ask me what the questions were though.

(edited to fix the first rule)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 11:38:55 AM
i thought the rule was, if there was a rock band at 10, there could not be a folk band at 10

but i really could have read that wrong
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: hummer69 on December 03, 2005, 11:40:18 AM
thats what i thought
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 11:42:07 AM
That's what I said.  They're the same thing.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: nsela on December 03, 2005, 11:48:26 AM
Oh *&^%, G before H or G after H?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jchyon on December 03, 2005, 11:51:28 AM
What were the answers for the last 5 questions?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 11:52:25 AM
Oops, sorry.  G before H.  That's what I get for typing too fast.

Sorry for any heart attacks that may have caused.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 11:53:02 AM
wow. totally messed up that game bc i misread the 10 rule. hopefully i got the other games...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: dinsosaur junior on December 03, 2005, 11:53:20 AM
I thought it was G before H as well.

And i interpreted another rule as if any rock palyed at 10 no folk played at 10. so then you knew if a rock was at 10 they took those spots and P had to be in 1 or 6 (well, i mean first or last.)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: dinsosaur junior on December 03, 2005, 11:54:14 AM
heart attack averted! Phew.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: nsela on December 03, 2005, 11:54:40 AM
Oops, sorry.  G before H.  That's what I get for typing too fast.

Sorry for any heart attacks that may have caused.

lol scared the hell out of me! Guess I needed that, my heart was beating too slow ;)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 11:55:14 AM
And i interpreted another rule as if any rock palyed at 10 no folk played at 10. so then you knew if a rock was at 10 they took those spots and P had to be in 1 or 6.

That's right.  The 10:00 bands could either both be rock or both be folk.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: saf2001 on December 03, 2005, 11:56:52 AM
Did anyone have a game about 7 trips - where T had to be 7 and Jamaica couldn't be 4th?  That was my section 3.  I believe that was experimental.

My 1st games had one about SUVWXYZ and appliances (VCRs radio... somthing like that).  First question was how many people can u determine exactly the appliances they fix
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 11:57:34 AM
You're definitely right about that section being experimental.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 11:58:22 AM
Question about the tv radio vcr game....what was the answer to the question must be true, the anwers were like, one person fixes one appliance, three people fix two appliances...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 11:59:49 AM
the number of how many people you could determine were fixing what was three i think?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: matts720 on December 03, 2005, 12:00:59 PM
About the appliance fixing game, I know for a fact that Z had to fix all three and Y fixed 2..
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:01:21 PM
The question was which one must be false, and it was that exactly one person fixes exactly two appliances, because you knew that at least two people fixed exactly two appliances.

And the number of people you could fully determine was definitely three.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: saf2001 on December 03, 2005, 12:01:53 PM
What was the answer to the one about which band had to be go on before 10?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Monreith2 on December 03, 2005, 12:03:30 PM
How many questions were there for the folk/rock game ?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:04:12 PM
What was the answer to the one about which band had to be go on before 10?

It was G.  Because they have to go before H, so they can't go at 12.  If they go at 10, H has to go at 12, so P has to go at 6, and then Q and T have to go at 8.  But Q has to be after a folk band, so that doesn't work.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: saf2001 on December 03, 2005, 12:15:13 PM
That cruise game was experimental .  And by the way the answer was something that J could only be 2 times max.  If J then G must be before it.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: DisgruntledLegalAsst on December 03, 2005, 12:16:29 PM
augghhh to the folk/rock game.

for the tv/vcr/radio game:

are you sure that the most you could determine was 3?  i had four for some reason...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Jontor on December 03, 2005, 12:17:35 PM
Is the rock concert Exeprimenta/.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: saf2001 on December 03, 2005, 12:18:37 PM
U  and W you could not determine for sure.  How about X or Z though?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 12:19:54 PM
U  and W you could not determine for sure.  How about X or Z though?

z you could, it had to have all of them
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: uscitalian1982 on December 03, 2005, 12:31:33 PM
I didn't have sufficient time to answer the last logic game so I guessed D for all.  Anyone who did it and felt confident get D for any?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: DisgruntledLegalAsst on December 03, 2005, 12:32:36 PM
i thought U and W you could determine how many because U had 2 (that was given, no?) and U and W could not be together...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 12:33:04 PM
Z, Y and S were the ones you could determine for sure, all the rest were variable.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:36:14 PM
I'll try to remember the repair setup, although I can't remember what they were repairing.  Radios, TVs, and VCRs?

People: S U W X Y Z

X and exactly 3 other people repair radios
Y repairs TVs and VCRs
S does not repair anything that Y repairs
U repairs exactly two things
Z repairs more things than Y repairs
[there must have been one more rule I'm forgetting]

So I got:
Radios: X, Z, S, U
TVs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs VCRs), maybe W
VCRs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs TVs), maybe W
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 12:37:07 PM
thought it was x and exactly 2 others.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: DisgruntledLegalAsst on December 03, 2005, 12:40:40 PM
okay did the question say for how many persons exactly how MANY items they fixed could be determined or for how many persons exactly WHAT items they fixed could be determined?

if the latter, then 3, b/c you you don't know which 2 U could fix
if the former, 4 b/c you KNOW U has to fix two things
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: elsrtop11 on December 03, 2005, 12:42:13 PM
I think this is where I messed up two Wolvie.  It was "and 3 others," but I read it for the longest time as meaning "a total of 3 people."  I knew something was wrong and it took me at least three minutes or so to find where I was making my mistake.  By then I had already answered 3 or so questions, so I had to backtrack.  

Also Gwenkern, was there not a V?  I can't remember exactly...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:44:00 PM
There wasn't a V because V is for VCR.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: elsrtop11 on December 03, 2005, 12:46:24 PM
Gotcha... can you remember how many questions there were to this game?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: wrogers on December 03, 2005, 12:48:02 PM
Sorry... I'm sure this has been established, but i just really want to figure out which was the experimental section... people are saying to was sec 3...
I had 2 logic games questions sections (1 and 3), but my section 3 had that hairdryer, micorwave, televisions questione etc. and i've heard that people with only one logic games sections had that questions as well.  Any help would be greatly apprectiated.  Thanks!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:48:33 PM
Sorry, I'm not sure -- but I think there were six.

BTW, I've totally forgotten what the second game was.  First was the hairdryer, microwave, etc., third was the appliance repair, fourth was folk and rock bands.  Anyone remember?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: liberator on December 03, 2005, 12:51:41 PM
Anyone put all A's for the last game?



It appears that 3 right answers out of the 5 were A, yes?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: anglblondie1 on December 03, 2005, 12:52:09 PM
So, i got over confidant when the first game (dorm room) was so easy. Games are my best secion, but when I got to the second one, I freaked out, something about eight crops, mnaybe??? I cant even remember, I dont know why panic overcame me and tryed to go on to the last two and go back to number two, but my panic just increased. So then I told myself to snap out of it, this is ridiculous, and suddenly everything fell into place, no more panic, oh except on the rock one...that one sucked....
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mmart6545 on December 03, 2005, 12:52:27 PM
I'll try to remember the repair setup, although I can't remember what they were repairing.  Radios, TVs, and VCRs?

People: S U W X Y Z

X and exactly 3 other people repair radios
Y repairs TVs and VCRs
S does not repair anything that Y repairs
U repairs exactly two things
Z repairs more things than Y repairs
[there must have been one more rule I'm forgetting]

So I got:
Radios: X, Z, S, U
TVs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs VCRs), maybe W
VCRs: Y, Z, maybe X, maybe U (but not if U repairs TVs), maybe W

This is not accurate...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 12:53:10 PM
Anyone put all A's for the last game?



It appears that 3 right answers out of the 5 were A, yes?

i think the last 4 answers i had were aada, but, i misbubbled and didnt realize it untill the end, so i'm not sure if that is right
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: DisgruntledLegalAsst on December 03, 2005, 12:53:21 PM
gwen: second game was the easiet for me the HARVEST one...there were eight of them i think the key was that m/j had to be the final harvest (the eighth one).
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 12:53:54 PM
This is not accurate...

That's not very helpful.  Want to correct what I messed up?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: muharulz on December 03, 2005, 12:56:38 PM
to my knowledge there are not three A's to start off... i originally had this, but there was a serious problem with it.


the diagram i had was wrong... if you had this as a diagram it was wrong...

_ _ _ - North

_ _ _ - South


it goes this way

_ _ _ - North

  _ _ _ - South


because the times dont match. it went 6,8,10 north and 8,10,12 for the south. i had A down as an answer until i figured out my problem... switching them did not work because of the folk and rock at 10 problem... i switched it to E after figuring it out.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Mike1948 on December 03, 2005, 12:57:24 PM
gwen: second game was the easiet for me the HARVEST one...there were eight of them i think the key was that m/j had to be the final harvest (the eighth one).

yeah can somebody go over that one? don't know if i got it all right or all wrong  ???
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: consigliere on December 03, 2005, 12:59:39 PM
will everyone just stfu abouthow easy the games were !!!

just STFU!!!!  >:(
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 01:00:11 PM
gwen: second game was the easiet for me the HARVEST one...there were eight of them i think the key was that m/j had to be the final harvest (the eighth one).

Right.  That's seriously all I remember from that one.  I had something like this:

1: not M, not K, not J
2: not M, not K, not J
3: not M, not K
4: not M
5: not M
6:
7:
8: M or J

I started to freak out because there was so little I could fill in, but it actually worked out because the questions mostly gave you additional info.  But I don't really remember what they were.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: bama on December 03, 2005, 01:01:15 PM
I don't even remember the harvest game... CAn someone remind me?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: DisgruntledLegalAsst on December 03, 2005, 01:01:45 PM
Okay, for the folk/rock one I am sure the first which of these works (list question) was B.  anyone else remember?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Monreith2 on December 03, 2005, 01:02:38 PM
Can we all agree that the AR section with the game with the appliances was the real section.
Did anybody with one AR section have that game ?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: muharulz on December 03, 2005, 01:02:38 PM
if you noticed my post above, i put that i had A and changed it to E after switching some bands around.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 01:04:36 PM
Can we all agree that the AR section with the game with the appliances was the real section.
Did anybody with one AR section have that game ?

Yes.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: wrogers on December 03, 2005, 01:09:37 PM
Can anyone provide a brief list of the 4 marked games questions... its all a blur right now and i'm trying to remember what each was about
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Luxor on December 03, 2005, 01:11:05 PM
Does anyone else feel inspired to create a rock band by the awesome name of "Peasant?"

:-)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 01:12:44 PM
Game 1: Someone has five appliances, but because his wiring sucks he can't use some in combination with others.
Game 2: Crops are planted in a particular order.  Pure ordering with 8 positions.
Game 3: Six technicians repair radios, TVs, and VCRs.
Game 4: Some bands play on two stages.

How's that?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mikey0987 on December 03, 2005, 01:15:31 PM
This is not accurate...

That's not very helpful.  Want to correct what I messed up?

i thought that the rule was x and exactly 2 others. i think remember seeing the word 2. this would allow for 4 positions to be determined
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 01:16:41 PM
i thought that the rule was x and exactly 2 others. i think remember seeing the word 2. this would allow for 4 positions to be determined

I'm sure it was X and exactly 3 others.  Anyone else want to weigh in?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Wolvie on December 03, 2005, 01:19:59 PM
This is not accurate...

That's not very helpful.  Want to correct what I messed up?

i thought that the rule was x and exactly 2 others. i think remember seeing the word 2. this would allow for 4 positions to be determined
\

mikey - i thought that too but nobody's disputing it...think we must have messed that rule up. sucks...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: bama on December 03, 2005, 01:23:46 PM
This is not accurate...

That's not very helpful.  Want to correct what I messed up?

i thought that the rule was x and exactly 2 others. i think remember seeing the word 2. this would allow for 4 positions to be determined
\

mikey - i thought that too but nobody's disputing it...think we must have messed that rule up. sucks...
It was 3 others.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Luxor on December 03, 2005, 01:24:22 PM
U CANNOT be placed...

third or fifth?  I went with third, though both seemed correct

If U is third, then Y needs to precede it, cutting off the SX/TX...is that right?  I can't remember the details very well---sorry
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Mike1948 on December 03, 2005, 01:31:02 PM
This is not accurate...

That's not very helpful.  Want to correct what I messed up?

i thought that the rule was x and exactly 2 others. i think remember seeing the word 2. this would allow for 4 positions to be determined
\

mikey - i thought that too but nobody's disputing it...think we must have messed that rule up. sucks...
It was 3 others.

3 others
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Gunnar on December 03, 2005, 01:33:16 PM
How many C's did you guys get for the last game (Folk/ROCK)? I didn't get a chance to fully complete it, so I guessed all C's, but I'm pretty sure I got every other game there perfect.  I'm hoping I got at least two guesses right!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Luxor on December 03, 2005, 01:33:43 PM
U CANNOT be placed...

third or fifth?  I went with third, though both seemed correct

If U is third, then Y needs to precede it, cutting off the SX/TX...is that right?  I can't remember the details very well---sorry

Whoops, this was experimental
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: otakueric on December 03, 2005, 01:36:07 PM
I think i had 3 could be completely determined.  adn the key to diagramming was

X _ _ _
_ _ _ X
681012

and for the harvest.
only j or m could be last.

i had 2 logic games, i got perfect on the experimental...damn it.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 01:42:55 PM
I remember one of the harvest questions that gave me a hard time ended up being:

M comes before J
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: matts720 on December 03, 2005, 01:48:32 PM
That first game seemed like it was TOO easy. I had the same on M before J.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Rooster on December 03, 2005, 01:54:31 PM
I think i had 3 could be completely determined.  adn the key to diagramming was

X _ _ _
_ _ _ X
681012

and for the harvest.
only j or m could be last.

i had 2 logic games, i got perfect on the experimental...damn it.

I knew that too, but i screwed up the setup. hopefully i salvaged some questions
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: austen_girl on December 03, 2005, 02:01:59 PM
As far as the harvest game goes, my memory's a bit shoddy. But I remember I had a tree diagram something like this:


 ____ & _____         ___L___ & _______  (Badly shown. but diag btwn. L and K?)

            |                             |
            |           /                 |
     
   _(K?)__      __T__    __J___    (Badly shown. But diag btwn. T and M)

            |       
            |      /
    __M__


So M had to be 7 or 8. K, or whatever it was, couldn't be earlier than fourth. And everything else was pretty fluid. I just counted down for the answers.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: imago on December 03, 2005, 02:07:16 PM
sounds like we had the same experimental games, luxor.  much easier than the real games, imo.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: kushkl on December 03, 2005, 02:13:28 PM
Does anyone remember how many questions there were on the harvest game, and if any were D?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Pizdun on December 03, 2005, 02:22:03 PM
the last on had to be M or J

this was the main thing to recognize for all the answers.

Everytime M was moved J went to the 8th positions, everytime J moved M was in last position. and M could go before J and vice versa.

For the appliances. Only 3 places were determined because for one of them you know that it includes 2 appliances but u do not know which ones.

for the "which must be true" it's "exactly 2 have 2 appliances"
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: sunsfan on December 03, 2005, 02:31:14 PM
I wrote down the last answers I bubbled for AR:

16 - C
17 - C
Folk/Rock game
18 - A
19 - A
20 - A
21 - D
22 - B

I think the Folk/Rock game started at #18.  Can anyone recall the questions for the Folk/Rock game (in order)?  Let me know if you have different answers...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: thelsater on December 03, 2005, 02:38:12 PM
I wrote down the last answers I bubbled for AR:

16 - C
17 - C
Folk/Rock game
18 - A
19 - A
20 - A
21 - D
22 - B

This is very reassuring because I was very flustered on games and I thought I totally screwed it up.  My last 8 answers were CCCAAABB, so that is very close to what you posted, except for one answer of course.  Does anyone else remember the last game?
I think the Folk/Rock game started at #18.  Can anyone recall the questions for the Folk/Rock game (in order)?  Let me know if you have different answers...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: fattycakes on December 03, 2005, 02:43:25 PM
I wrote down the last answers I bubbled for AR:

16 - C
17 - C
Folk/Rock game
18 - A
19 - A
20 - A
21 - D
22 - B

I think the Folk/Rock game started at #18.  Can anyone recall the questions for the Folk/Rock game (in order)?  Let me know if you have different answers...

One question I remember was which group had to go before 10 - this was the second question for the game, or #19. Does anyone remember the answer to this? I got a little confused and I think I put that it was G because G had to come before H. Ahh I'm really scared about that one but it was letter A so your putting A is reassuring to me.  :)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: littlebrowngirl on December 03, 2005, 02:46:29 PM
FOLK GAME:

first question: list question, i chose A??

then i remember another question that said (i think it was 21):
which must be true if a rock group goes at 10.
i chose B - a folk group has to go at 8. i dont even think this is the right answer??

then there was a question about Q performing at 12, i dont remember what else

then there was the question about who had to be 10 or earlier -- which was G (i think it may have been 19)

#22 was B but i dont remember the question.

this game sucked. i usually ace games and this game ATE up my time. :( i dont know why it took me so long, i have noo idea. im thinking of cancelling, even.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: littlebrowngirl on December 03, 2005, 02:49:01 PM
and for the question about of the following three: hair dryer, television, radio..what does franky have to do in order to make sure he doesnt' use any more than one of those...

what was the answer to that?

a. he uses the hair dryer
b. he uses the television
c. ??
d. he doesn't use the microwave
e. he doesn't use the vaccuum
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 03, 2005, 02:49:41 PM
Game 1: Someone has five appliances, but because his wiring sucks he can't use some in combination with others.
Game 2: Crops are planted in a particular order.  Pure ordering with 8 positions.
Game 3: Six technicians repair radios, TVs, and VCRs.
Game 4: Some bands play on two stages.

How's that?

For me, game two was about doing 8 chores, I think...laundry, grocery shopping, motorcycle repair -- but maybe that was in my experimental section?  it was a pure ordering question.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: thelsater on December 03, 2005, 02:52:58 PM
FOLK GAME:

first question: list question, i chose A??

then i remember another question that said (i think it was 21):
which must be true if a rock group goes at 10.
i chose B - a folk group has to go at 8. i dont even think this is the right answer??

then there was a question about Q performing at 12, i dont remember what else

then there was the question about who had to be 10 or earlier -- which was G (i think it may have been 19)

#22 was B but i dont remember the question.

this game sucked. i usually ace games and this game ATE up my time. :( i dont know why it took me so long, i have noo idea. im thinking of cancelling, even.

Hey I'm in the same boat as you...i got very flustered on games today and games are generally an easy section for me.  I started that last game with 15 minutes and it just didn't click.  I don't understand how people are saying the games section was so ridiculously easy.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: nsela on December 03, 2005, 02:58:28 PM
and for the question about of the following three: hair dryer, television, radio..what does franky have to do in order to make sure he doesnt' use any more than one of those...

what was the answer to that?

a. he uses the hair dryer
b. he uses the television
c. ??
d. he doesn't use the microwave
e. he doesn't use the vaccuum

I think (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong) the answer was A
Using either the hair dryer or the vaccuum caused you not to be able to use anything but the microwave (and the original item).  Since vaccuum isn't a listed option, and hair dryer is, that's the answer.

Also 2 questions before that I think the question was, how many combinations could leave you with the maximum being used- I put One.  I think the only combination which let you use 3 items was Microwave, Television, Razor.  I think... and I hope. :)

BTW was it Razor or Radio?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Tulane1L on December 03, 2005, 03:02:08 PM
and for the question about of the following three: hair dryer, television, radio..what does franky have to do in order to make sure he doesnt' use any more than one of those...

what was the answer to that?

a. he uses the hair dryer
b. he uses the television
c. ??
d. he doesn't use the microwave
e. he doesn't use the vaccuum

I think (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong) the answer was A
Using either the hair dryer or the vaccuum caused you not to be able to use anything but the microwave (and the original item).  Since vaccuum isn't a listed option, and hair dryer is, that's the answer.

Also 2 questions before that I think the question was, how many combinations could leave you with the maximum being used- I put One.  I think the only combination which let you use 3 items was Microwave, Television, Razor.  I think... and I hope. :)

BTW was it Razor or Radio?

I got the same for all 3
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Gunnar on December 03, 2005, 03:19:21 PM
There were NO C's in the last GAME AT ALL?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? DAMMIT! That's 5 wrong automatically! Peice of shi*!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 03:25:33 PM
FOLK GAME:

first question: list question, i chose A??

then i remember another question that said (i think it was 21):
which must be true if a rock group goes at 10.
i chose B - a folk group has to go at 8. i dont even think this is the right answer??

then there was a question about Q performing at 12, i dont remember what else

then there was the question about who had to be 10 or earlier -- which was G (i think it may have been 19)

#22 was B but i dont remember the question.

this game sucked. i usually ace games and this game ATE up my time. :( i dont know why it took me so long, i have noo idea. im thinking of cancelling, even.

I know the one about a folk group having to go at 8 is right. One of the rock groups had to go at 6 or 12, and if one rock group went at 10, the other group at 10 had to be rock. And one of the rock groups other than the one at 6 and 12 had to go after a folk group.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 03:40:58 PM
and for the question about of the following three: hair dryer, television, radio..what does franky have to do in order to make sure he doesnt' use any more than one of those...

what was the answer to that?

a. he uses the hair dryer
b. he uses the television
c. ??
d. he doesn't use the microwave
e. he doesn't use the vaccuum

I think (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong) the answer was A
Using either the hair dryer or the vaccuum caused you not to be able to use anything but the microwave (and the original item).  Since vaccuum isn't a listed option, and hair dryer is, that's the answer.

Also 2 questions before that I think the question was, how many combinations could leave you with the maximum being used- I put One.  I think the only combination which let you use 3 items was Microwave, Television, Razor.  I think... and I hope. :)

BTW was it Razor or Radio?

I think all of those are right. I believe it was Razor.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Steve14 on December 03, 2005, 03:55:12 PM
Kind of a dumb question, but I didnt finish the second game (skipped it and went back, long story). Anyway, I put "D" for the last 3 answers in that game. Anyone remember if there were D's for any of those?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: muharulz on December 03, 2005, 05:35:59 PM
the first one in the rock is not A, but E.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: iyl on December 03, 2005, 06:00:58 PM
So, i got over confidant when the first game (dorm room) was so easy. Games are my best secion, but when I got to the second one, I freaked out, something about eight crops, mnaybe??? I cant even remember, I dont know why panic overcame me and tryed to go on to the last two and go back to number two, but my panic just increased. So then I told myself to snap out of it, this is ridiculous, and suddenly everything fell into place, no more panic, oh except on the rock one...that one sucked....

yeah, I did the worst on the crop one too, even though it was just good 'ol linear sequencing...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: goshh on December 03, 2005, 06:50:58 PM
Hey all, regarding question 2 of the games (sequencing one with jklh...), I think I too experienced some sort of mental block.
Does anyone remember the exact question, does anyone in general remember the setup, ie, does anyone remember what the rules were?
Also, one of the questions seemed impossible to answer based on my setup. I'm trying to figure out whether I read that particular question wrong or the rules. The question I'm thinking about had to do with putting J in the 3rd slot (maybe 3rd from last spot) (I think it was the 3rd question of that game).
If anyone could shed some light I'd really appreciate it. I need to decide whether to cancel my score. Thanks.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Luxor on December 03, 2005, 06:55:51 PM
Does anyone remember how many Ds were in the rock/folk question?  That game completely tripped me up, despite having a nice amount of time to work on it.  I don't even know if I got a single question right, whereas the other games went flawlessly (except for maybe one question).  It feels good to see that so many others struggled with this one--it just seemed impossible to make the usual number of inferences with the set of information given to us
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: SH on December 03, 2005, 06:56:17 PM
it was something like

K came before M

something and L came before J

T came before M

L and H came before K


basically the last one could have been either J or M

i hate these kind of games
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 03, 2005, 06:57:25 PM
H and L came before J.  Your other rules look right.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Rooster on December 03, 2005, 06:58:46 PM
it was something like

K came before M

something and L came before J

T came before M

G and H came before K


basically the last one could have been either J or M

i hate these kind of games


yea i hate pure sequencing...id rather have a friggen grouping game
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: SH on December 03, 2005, 07:00:44 PM
H and L came before J.  Your other rules look right.
thanks you are right!


and yea Rooster...I would have much rather had grouping also...
this stuff makes my brain work too hard...

i wish i had 45 minutes...

although i did finish every section with 5 minutes remaining (except for the last LR section arghhh)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: SH on December 03, 2005, 07:06:54 PM
I think the only thing was that T came before M, which SUCKS because I think I always assumed that J and M could be last and second last

YUCK

Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Rooster on December 03, 2005, 07:08:25 PM
I think the only thing was that T came before M, which SUCKS because I think I always assumed that J and M could be last and second last

YUCK



Yea T came some time before M.  I really have no clue how I did on games...its like a choked.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: SH on December 03, 2005, 07:09:25 PM
1st game was EASY! the last three were tricky...the first game kind of gave false hope I think...

Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 03, 2005, 07:18:51 PM
I think the only thing was that T came before M, which SUCKS because I think I always assumed that J and M could be last and second last

YUCK



If T came before M, M and J could still be last and second last.  It could be P G K H L T M J with no problems.  I'm not sure J and M HAD to be last though.  Or do you mean you thought it could be that MJ are 7 & 8 or 6 & 7 ?

T had no restrictions, except that it had to come before M. It could have been first.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: SH on December 03, 2005, 07:21:09 PM
I think the only thing was that T came before M, which SUCKS because I think I always assumed that J and M could be last and second last

YUCK



If T came before M, M and J could still be last and second last.  It could be P G K H L T M J with no problems.  I'm not sure J and M HAD to be last though.  Or do you mean you thought it could be that MJ are 7 & 8 or 6 & 7 ?

T had no restrictions, except that it had to come before M. It could have been first.
it could have been first but it also could have been 2nd last...if M was last...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: MarineSP on December 03, 2005, 07:27:05 PM
that JTM game was easy and i finished it in less than 5 mins. i'm really good at ordering games.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Luxor on December 03, 2005, 09:17:58 PM
sounds like we had the same experimental games, luxor.  much easier than the real games, imo.

Agreed, though that wouldn't be the case if not for that cursed rock/folk band game
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: chrisfield on December 04, 2005, 11:21:52 AM
My test order was:

LR, LG, LR, RC, LR

I had zero "B" answers for games.

Anyone else share this experience?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 04, 2005, 12:21:31 PM
Did anyone get any Cs for the last folk/rock game?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 04, 2005, 12:53:30 PM
Also,

hoe many questions were in each game. I know the last one was 5 questions, but what about the other 3.  I think the first two games totalled 12 points.

Anyone confirm?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: chrisfield on December 04, 2005, 12:54:13 PM
Also,

hoe many questions were in each game. I know the last one was 5 questions, but what about the other 3.  I think the first two games totalled 12 points.

Anyone confirm?

RW

5 questions on first game.

RW, did you have any B's?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 04, 2005, 01:07:48 PM
Thanks.

I can't remember any B's but, I can't remember any A's, C's, D's or E's.

Basically, I rarely remember the letters, but I can usually recognize the correct answer's wording, and the set-up for the game.

Sorry

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: chrisfield on December 04, 2005, 01:09:11 PM
Thanks.

I can't remember any B's but, I can't remember any A's, C's, D's or E's.

Basically, I rarely remember the letters, but I can usually recognize the correct answer's wording, and the set-up for the game.

Sorry

RW

No worries.  I did fine on the games, I just thought it odd that I had no B's. 
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: nsela on December 04, 2005, 01:21:27 PM
Also,

hoe many questions were in each game. I know the last one was 5 questions, but what about the other 3.  I think the first two games totalled 12 points.

Anyone confirm?

RW

Yup 6-6-5-5. Total 22.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 04, 2005, 01:38:20 PM
In the appliance repair game, there was a rule about W and so far, no one has remembered it.

Anyone?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: helpmeregister on December 04, 2005, 03:08:26 PM
i think it might actually have been 5-6-6-5....but i could be wrong...i'm sure about the last two being 6-5 though
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: nsela on December 04, 2005, 03:19:19 PM
i think it might actually have been 5-6-6-5....but i could be wrong...i'm sure about the last two being 6-5 though

ummm... hmmm.. well then.

Mine was definitely 6-6-5-5
I didn't get to the repairs game (ugh) which was questions 13-17 because the Rock/Folk game looked easier (lol), the last game was the Rock/Folk game which was 18-22.  Thus the first two games were 6-6 (Appliances, Harvest)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: memillertime on December 04, 2005, 04:20:27 PM

Game #2:

PGKTMHLJ which may be farm equipment

The rules were:
P and G before K

K before M

H and L before J

T before M

If I remember correctly, one of the rules said that L had to be before K too. Somebody tell me if I have just dreamt this rule up.  I had  P,G,L,K,and T all having to come before M, and as a result the first spot M could go was 6th.  Is this wrong?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: gwenkern on December 04, 2005, 04:49:18 PM
The rule was L before K before M, and your inference about M having to be 6th or later was what I had too.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: memillertime on December 04, 2005, 06:13:38 PM
Good deal. I was worried, every post on here has K>M  but nobody has put  L>K>M yet.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Nicu on December 04, 2005, 07:29:44 PM
In the appliance repair game, there was a rule about W and so far, no one has remembered it.

Anyone?

RW

W repaired TV's or VCR's or both
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: sea dream on December 05, 2005, 01:41:44 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 05, 2005, 02:59:02 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?

No, you're right. The microwave was the only thing that didn't have any restrictions, and the only combo of three things you could have was microwave, tv and razor.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: sea dream on December 05, 2005, 03:05:36 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?

No, you're right. The microwave was the only thing that didn't have any restrictions, and the only combo of three things you could have was microwave, tv and razor.

thanks! am i glad that the LSAT is over now.....
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 05, 2005, 05:02:03 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?

No, you're right. The microwave was the only thing that didn't have any restrictions, and the only combo of three things you could have was microwave, tv and razor.

Oh nice.  I put down only one combination of 3 was possible.  So I got at least 1 correct on the test.  121, here I come.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: chrisfield on December 05, 2005, 05:33:24 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?

No, you're right. The microwave was the only thing that didn't have any restrictions, and the only combo of three things you could have was microwave, tv and razor.

Oh nice.  I put down only one combination of 3 was possible.  So I got at least 1 correct on the test.  121, here I come.

You actually need more like 15-20 questions correct before you get above 120.  Sorry :)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Number Two on December 05, 2005, 08:20:49 AM
I haven't read through this entire post but can somebody tell me how they diagrammed the FOLK/ROCK game?  I did it like this:

N 6 8 10
S   8 10 12

Does this make sense or does this work?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: unionyes on December 05, 2005, 08:52:19 AM
on the ordering game-- M or J were the potential last ones, right? 
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 05, 2005, 09:01:02 AM
on the ordering game-- M or J were the potential last ones, right? 

I think that technically T could have come second to last, but I don't think that came up the way they asked the questions.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 05, 2005, 09:03:56 AM
In the appliance repair game, there was a rule about W and so far, no one has remembered it.

Anyone?

RW

W repaired TV's or VCR's or both

Really?

While I can't remember all the rules myself, I REALLY don't remember the W rule reading like that.

Anybody else?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: unionyes on December 05, 2005, 09:07:03 AM
agreed-- i don't think there was a rule about W
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: justGem on December 05, 2005, 09:07:49 AM
I guess this was done to make up for the extremely hard Oct games section. 

I only missed one question on the Oct.  On this one, I may have missed the whole last game because of set-up, also not 100% about the 3rd game, I kept thinking that I was missing something.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 05, 2005, 09:26:59 AM
agreed-- i don't think there was a rule about W

No, there was a rule for W. I just don't think it was stated as above.

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: inrvrs on December 05, 2005, 09:56:10 AM
I too had an experimental games section.  In one of them (although I can't remember which one) there was a very easy game about ordering crayons (Green has to be next to Indigo or Purple...).  Do we think this was part of the one that counted, or experimental???
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: iyl on December 05, 2005, 10:07:38 AM
I too had an experimental games section.  In one of them (although I can't remember which one) there was a very easy game about ordering crayons (Green has to be next to Indigo or Purple...).  Do we think this was part of the one that counted, or experimental???

The crayon game was experimental. I had experimental games also, but my 4 games were completely different (refer to my previous post under this topic)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 06, 2005, 04:58:33 AM
omg i just started reading all the threads cuz i got home from a long trip out to take the test and meet relatives.. first page of LG is putting me into a semi-panic.. the hairdryer game, i'm pretty sure i recall the rule as hairdier cant be plugged in with tv or razor and vacuum cant with hairdryer tv or razor, which means hairdryer cant be plugged in with the vacuum either.. but i think the first post in this thread claims that the hairdryer can be? if i screwed up that rule i'd be pretty screwed for what was a really easy game. Who wants to put my fears to rest or throw me into fullblown panic?

No, you're right. The microwave was the only thing that didn't have any restrictions, and the only combo of three things you could have was microwave, tv and razor.

Oh nice.  I put down only one combination of 3 was possible.  So I got at least 1 correct on the test.  121, here I come.

You actually need more like 15-20 questions correct before you get above 120.  Sorry :)

Darn, the dream is dying before my eyes!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: dandp on December 06, 2005, 11:47:42 AM
I've been following this thread and I think the discussion for the most part fits in with what I saw:

Folk/Rock game, definitely a time-consuming game, best setup by:

  6 8 10 12
N         X
S:X

However, I just received a breakdown from Princeton Review which has the G before H rule as a "block" meaning that GH go one after the other (allowing for H to go on either stage though).

That was NOT how I read and setup the rule, I read it as strictly G comes AT SOME TIME before H.

Can anyone else confirm the block? or just the simple range?

---
Also, I was a victim of misbubbling as well. F me.  Anyone looking to take the test, or re-take: MAKE SURE YOU DOUBLE CHECK YOUR BUBBLING.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: unknown13 on December 06, 2005, 12:20:59 PM
Game #4

Rules on the concert game as I remember them:

North stage: Performances at 6, 8, 10
South stage: Performances at 8, 10, 12

Folk groups: L, G, H
Rock groups: P, Q, T

G has to play sometime before H
Q has to play immediately after a folk group, but not necessarily on the same stage
If a rock group plays at 10 on one stage, a folk group cannot play at 10 on the other stage
P plays at 6 or 12
T and L play on different stages

I thought the rule read "P plays at 6 or 10" not "P plays at 6 or 12".  Anyone else remember this?  Or did I just mis-read the rules.... :-\
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: GGallin on December 06, 2005, 01:05:13 PM
100% positive it was P plays at 6 or 12. Perhaps you just misrembered it?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 06, 2005, 01:41:14 PM
Anyone recalling the W rule for the appliance fixing game?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: rwalker130 on December 06, 2005, 02:02:30 PM
Also, any C's in the last game?

RW
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 07, 2005, 04:40:35 AM
Seriously, how does everyone remember all these details?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jay83 on December 07, 2005, 11:34:39 AM
does anyone remember picking an answer in the latter part of the sequencing game (with j,k,m etc.) saying that J must come before M?>
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Unsure on December 07, 2005, 11:39:43 AM
does anyone remember picking an answer in the latter part of the sequencing game (with j,k,m etc.) saying that J must come before M?>

No. I remember the opposite, an aswer saying that J could actually come after M.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jay83 on December 07, 2005, 11:49:30 AM
F
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: Steve14 on December 07, 2005, 11:50:13 AM
I asked this already before, but I didn't get a response. does anyone remember if they had D's for the last 3 or so on the harvest problem? It was the Could be/Must be true questions...any D's? hehe, thanks.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jay83 on December 07, 2005, 01:37:48 PM
don't mean to be a pest here, but regarding that one harvest questions again where m had to come before j...does anyone remember if there was a trap answer that said "j must come before m"? (gosh i hope not...)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: splenda on December 12, 2005, 07:34:13 PM
I think this is where I messed up two Wolvie.  It was "and 3 others," but I read it for the longest time as meaning "a total of 3 people."  I knew something was wrong and it took me at least three minutes or so to find where I was making my mistake.  By then I had already answered 3 or so questions, so I had to backtrack. 

Also Gwenkern, was there not a V?  I can't remember exactly...

RE: repair game...

this is EXACTLY where i messed up as well.  i know the test was more than a week ago, but does anyone happen to know how many questions that kind of error would have cost me?  did it cost me the whole game?  does anyone remember what the questions for that game were? :-\
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: bubble-filler on December 12, 2005, 08:47:45 PM
this is EXACTLY where i messed up as well.  i know the test was more than a week ago, but does anyone happen to know how many questions that kind of error would have cost me?  did it cost me the whole game?  does anyone remember what the questions for that game were? :-\

Seems like a bunch of people messed up this rule, including myself. Someone else speculated that messing up this rule only costs us two questions. Do you remember having trouble answering any of the questions because of this? I did not figure out during the game that I messed up the rule, and was able to answer all of the questions except for one (I think it was the second or third question in the game - there was no answer choice that fit). I'm really hoping I was able to answer the other questions because I was still able to get the game right in most respects and not because there happened to be answer choices that coincided with the diagram resulting from messing up the rule.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: splenda on December 12, 2005, 08:57:30 PM
"I'm really hoping I was able to answer the other questions because I was still able to get the game right in most respects and not because there happened to be answer choices that coincided with the diagram resulting from messing up the rule."

that is what i am hoping too.  i know that in the past lsat answer choices would be designed with people like ourselves in mind, people that misread a rule.  i guess that's what scares me.  i hope, hope, hope that this didn't screw us up too much.

if i recall correctly, i was also able to answer all questions except for 1 of them, despite my misinterpretation of the rule.  i'm crossing my fingers for us!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 08:24:29 AM
I made the SAME EXACT mistake of taking that rule to mean exactly 3 total. I could kick myself. I remember, I think, two wuestions where I was able to eliminate all except for two answers, and it didn't make sense to me (for the obvious reason) which one it would be.

Speculating that those two were the only effected by that mistake is really not a great idea in my mind. The only way to know is to see the questions, which are apparently banned on this board.

Can't someone just reword them?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: sea dream on December 13, 2005, 08:27:02 AM
I made the SAME EXACT mistake of taking that rule to mean exactly 3 total. I could kick myself. I remember, I think, two wuestions where I was able to eliminate all except for two answers, and it didn't make sense to me (for the obvious reason) which one it would be.

Speculating that those two were the only effected by that mistake is really not a great idea in my mind. The only way to know is to see the questions, which are apparently banned on this board.

Can't someone just reword them?

it's not that they're banned.. i think it's more that people have trouble recalling specific LG questions. there are pretty detailed reconstructions of LR questions and RC but LG is just harder to remember word for word.. honestly id on't even understand how people can recall the rules.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 08:29:24 AM
It boggles my mind, but it seems they reconstructed almost all the LR questions. I found a good reconstruction of the Rock/Folk band game quesions too. I can't find anythign helpful on the repair game though.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: sea dream on December 13, 2005, 08:39:48 AM
ok- i'm not trying to crush anyone's hopes.. but i actually made the same mistake of misreading a rule on several of the practice tests i did, and usually found out about the time when some of the questions just didn't make sense.. and when i went back and found my mistake, i also found that i got a lot more questions wrong then the ones i got stuck on. anything from the simple List question to other questions i got wrong because of misreading the rule, because it messed with the setup.

of course, it could definitely be that the mistake didn't affect that many of the questions, and i really hope this is the case- because i think it would suck to have your score affected by a mistake like that. and for all i know, i made such a mistake and i won't know until the scores come out.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 08:55:04 AM
Well, for certain you could throw the hypothetical question which begins the game out the window, because you immediatley looked for one in which exactly three people were working, vcr was it? So that one is gone. If you used the hypothetical to answer any other questions, well, those are probably wrong too. I would say there has to be three wrong due to that mistake. Yay. Ugh, of all the mistakes to make, none is tougher to shrug off than one which involved simply reading a rule as it was stated. I'll never let myself live that one down; ESPECIALLY if I score low 160's. Arg
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: bubble-filler on December 13, 2005, 09:47:36 AM
I just realized that I also interpreted the rule that X fixes radios to mean that X ONLY fixes radios. So any question that involves the possibility of X fixing TV's and/or VCR's is a ding for me.

I'm still wondering what sort of train wreck was happening in my brain that made me screw up the rules in this game so badly. Sheesh.

I'm an atheist, but still praying for a miracle on this one...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jay83 on December 13, 2005, 10:19:42 AM
are you guys absolutely sure that the rule said X AND 3 OTHERS?...and if so, how and when did u realize u muffed up?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 10:26:37 AM
I saw that rule listed on another post-mortem thread. Unless they're wrong, that was the rule. I think it probably was, because there were two questions which made no sense to me, and if that rule was what it said, they probably would have.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: jay83 on December 13, 2005, 10:35:05 AM
ok bear with me here...if the game was set up using the X and 2 OTHERS mistake, it would have looked something like this:

X   U   W   S   Y   Z
    _  T/V      TV  RTV
R   -  or       
       both

this setup says that U, W OR S could take the final (3rd) Radio...I remember distinctly, however, coming up with a setup that took care of the R's completely...does that ring a bell?
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: splenda on December 13, 2005, 07:53:47 PM
mjsbth and bubble-filler,

this is really depressing.  i wouldn't have minded missing the questions if the game were conceptually "above me," so to speak...

i wasted a lot of time (stupid, i know!) trying to figure out why certain answer choices weren't working, so i ended up not even making it to the last game. 

man, why couldn't this have been the experimental secion! the experimental games section was so much easier...

i felt so good about my performance on the rest of the exam.  unfortunately, now i have an automatic -8 (b/c of scrwing up this rule and not getting to the last five questions).  it hurts when you know you could have done better!  i don't really know what compelled me not to cancel...
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: bubble-filler on December 13, 2005, 08:17:38 PM
mjsbth and bubble-filler,

this is really depressing.  i wouldn't have minded missing the questions if the game were conceptually "above me," so to speak...

i wasted a lot of time (stupid, i know!) trying to figure out why certain answer choices weren't working, so i ended up not even making it to the last game. 

man, why couldn't this have been the experimental secion! the experimental games section was so much easier...

i felt so good about my performance on the rest of the exam.  unfortunately, now i have an automatic -8 (b/c of scrwing up this rule and not getting to the last five questions).  it hurts when you know you could have done better!  i don't really know what compelled me not to cancel...

splenda,
yeah, it is frustrating. i also wasted time trying to figure out what was wrong with my setup, which led me to guessing on a few in the final game. don't get too bummed yet. it's possible that you got less than three wrong on that game, and did you bubble in guesses for the final game? if so, some of your guesses may have been right.

anyway, these things always seem to happen on the real thing, eh? try not to worry about it too much, i think we'll be alright. :)
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 08:28:13 PM
Ooooph, that hurts Splenda. Hopefully you did much better than usual on the other three sections!! And I hope you were able to bubble in some of the blanks. Best of luck.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: mjsbth on December 13, 2005, 09:13:40 PM
If I had tested how I test 9 out of 10 times, I would've not gotten more than 2 wrong on LG and probably 8 wrong total. That's gonna be the difference for me between Columbia and Georgetown for me, unless some other abnormal catastrophic breakdown occurred that I'm not yet aware of. I'm sooooooo pissed, but hey, dems bes the breaks. I'm sure we'll all be fine in the scheme of things. Till we know, Cheers. I hope you guys all post when you get your scores; I'll be routing for you guys. There's a lot of elitist arrogant snobs on this board, but a lot of good people like yourselves as well. I'm pulling for ya.
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: splenda on December 13, 2005, 10:39:05 PM
mjsbth and bubble-filler,

unfortunately, the proctor called time before i was able to even bubble in blind guesses for the last 5.  i guess i'll just mentally start preparing myself for a retake, that way i won't be in shock if my score doesn't turn out decently.  all in all, though, thanks so much for the kind words.  regardless of what happens, it feels good to know that others understand.  best of luck to you guys on your scores and/or applications!
Title: Re: POST-MORTEM December '05 - Logic Games
Post by: 140am on December 14, 2005, 07:03:48 AM
I seriously can't remember how I set up any of these games, or if I misinterpreted one rule or another, or what answers I selected, or even what the questions were.  Even when someone types up a question that was on the LSAT, and provides what the 5 choices were, I **STILL** can't recall what I selected.  It's not that I blacked it out, or have no memory of the exam, it's just that, well, I mean, how the h*ll can everyone remember this stuff so much?  I wasn't trying to memorize the exam, I was concentrating on taking it.

But more power to you if you can.