Law School Discussion

Applying to Law School => Law School Admissions => Topic started by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 02:30:22 PM

Title: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 02:30:22 PM
Kinda an afterthought, but I'm wishing I had declined to report my ethnicity.  Better to leave 'em guessing, maybe?  ???
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: TradeWonk on February 26, 2005, 04:38:44 PM
Guess what.  It makes absolutely no difference.  These days to get URM with certain backgrounds, generally, it takes more than being a certain ethnicity anyway.  If you are a cuban american for example, you'll be needing a good story to go with it.  Otherwise, if you're just a rich Cuban whose family fled Castro a while back.. no URM for you.

And if you check nothing, they are going to say "look, it's a white person who wants to keep us guessing."  I don't know a lot of URM's who say "just in principle I will not identify myself."

I still think you should do the year at LSE.  London weather is not as bad as everyone makes it out to be, and it's a great place to live for a year, and you meet some amazing people at LSE from all over the world (children of Presidents, African royalty, world-famous professors, etc. etc. etc.).  It's one year during which time you can reevaluate your committment to law AND you will have an impressive MSc.  And if you want to resit your LSAT they offer it over there anyway.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 04:45:48 PM
Guess what.  It makes absolutely no difference.  These days to get URM with certain backgrounds, generally, it takes more than being a certain ethnicity anyway.  If you are a cuban american for example, you'll be needing a good story to go with it.  Otherwise, if you're just a rich Cuban whose family fled Castro a while back.. no URM for you.

And if you check nothing, they are going to say "look, it's a white person who wants to keep us guessing."  I don't know a lot of URM's who say "just in principle I will not identify myself."

I still think you should do the year at LSE.  London weather is not as bad as everyone makes it out to be, and it's a great place to live for a year, and you meet some amazing people at LSE from all over the world (children of Presidents, African royalty, world-famous professors, etc. etc. etc.).  It's one year during which time you can reevaluate your committment to law AND you will have an impressive MSc.  And if you want to resit your LSAT they offer it over there anyway.

Yeah, that's what I figured the adcomms would assume about people who don't list their race.

My committment to studying law is very strong already.  Nothing to re-think.  And while I like England and am sure that I'd have a great academic/intellectual experience at LSE, I'm not a huge fan of London and would just as soon take a year to travel.  Thanks though for imput! :)
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 04:56:14 PM
maybe you should wish you got a higher lsat instead

no maybe about it!
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 07:44:56 PM
on a sidenote:  you really should come over to xoxohth.com
i think you're cute, and we would love your company over there

why thank you

I've been on xoxo

they ate me alive
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: The Name's Dali on February 26, 2005, 08:29:53 PM
I still think you should do the year at LSE. 

Did you get into LSE Jennaye?
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 08:32:24 PM
I still think you should do the year at LSE. 

Did you get into LSE Jennaye?

aye!
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Paperback Writer on February 26, 2005, 09:46:40 PM
RE: "My committment to studying law is very strong already.  Nothing to re-think.  And while I like England and am sure that I'd have a great academic/intellectual experience at LSE, I'm not a huge fan of London and would just as soon take a year to travel.  Thanks though for imput! :)"

Don't like London?  I'm at a loss.  I lived there for a bit, and I loved it.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: TradeWonk on February 26, 2005, 09:55:12 PM
My 'imput' was simply based on some of your earlier threads in which you were all over the place on where to go to school, and if to go next year?  I mean, you did bother applying to LSE - which tells me this committment to law must have waivered at some point in the last few months (granted, no GRE needed makes it easy to apply).

But follow your heart, at the end of the day you'll choose wisely.  (though i agree w/ paperback writer AND you about London.. I couldn't live there the rest of my life as it's third world on some levels... but it really is an awesome place to spend a year.. and LSE really is the shi. on so many levels (academics, facilities, access to Europe for weekends). If you haven't visited I recommend you do.  Usually some cheap $300 weekend specials to London this time of year. LSE will give you a tour, and if you go over vacation you can probably crash at a student residence (most are either nice apartments, or hotel like - pimping either way).

Okay, i'm done trying to convince you though.  You're sounding pretty into going straight to law.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 26, 2005, 09:58:00 PM
I visited London for a bit during the summer I was studying at Oxford... so maybe I was influenced by my experience at Oxford.  London just seems huge and unmanageable, a bit like NYC which I'm not too crazy about.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: twarga on February 26, 2005, 10:02:53 PM
I visited London for a bit during the summer I was studying at Oxford... so maybe I was influenced by my experience at Oxford.  London just seems huge and unmanageable, a bit like NYC which I'm not too crazy about.

I agree.  London is a zoo, and the food leaves something to be desired.  Now Germany on the other hand.... Yum!
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Paperback Writer on February 26, 2005, 10:05:42 PM
I visited London for a bit during the summer I was studying at Oxford... so maybe I was influenced by my experience at Oxford.  London just seems huge and unmanageable, a bit like NYC which I'm not too crazy about.

Yeah, Oxford is not London.  Once you've been there a bit, it starts to seem small.  I lived in Maida Vale, which is within walking distance of the Abbey Road recording studio.  The Abbey Road crossing is actually a fairly busy road.  I think the locals like to drive fast so that the tourists, trying to get their pictures snapped as they make the famous crossing, have to run out of the way like rabbits.

I worked in International House, which is right across from The Tower.  It was great to look out my window at work, and see the Union Jack flying over The Tower.

It was hard to live there.  After three months I really missed driving my car, and eating nachos.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: TradeWonk on February 26, 2005, 11:25:34 PM
Paperback - i agree.  Despite being a massive city on a map, London is a small city in my mind.  easy to get around once you get the basic directions down (good bus and tube system).  I have to say, I didn't think I would like London at all (went purely for education) but really fell for it after I while.  I was happy to get back in the states, but now I think i'd like to work there for a few years after law school (if i can ever make it happen).

btw Paperback - When i was at LSE I lived at the Butlers Wharf residence.. near international house (had to talk by the damn tower every day).  have you been their recently?  really nice area now!
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Paperback Writer on February 27, 2005, 05:57:23 AM
Paperback - i agree.  Despite being a massive city on a map, London is a small city in my mind.  easy to get around once you get the basic directions down (good bus and tube system).  I have to say, I didn't think I would like London at all (went purely for education) but really fell for it after I while.  I was happy to get back in the states, but now I think i'd like to work there for a few years after law school (if i can ever make it happen).

btw Paperback - When i was at LSE I lived at the Butlers Wharf residence.. near international house (had to talk by the damn tower every day).  have you been their recently?  really nice area now!

It's been about three years, and I recall that the area was nice when I was there.  I always enjoyed walking past The Tower.  Ever been inside?  What happened inside was pretty gruesome, indeed.  I never did get a satisfactory answer as to why there is a tennis court on the Tower lawn.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: The Name's Dali on February 27, 2005, 08:44:31 AM
I still think you should do the year at LSE. 

Did you get into LSE Jennaye?

aye!


Congratuations!  I've heard that LSE is very difficult to get into.  Some person on xoxoth said they were rejected in spite of being a former Fullbright Scholar.  What do you think was most influencial in gaining acceptance there?
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: mxpocc on February 27, 2005, 09:04:01 AM
Guess what.  It makes absolutely no difference.  These days to get URM with certain backgrounds, generally, it takes more than being a certain ethnicity anyway.  If you are a cuban american for example, you'll be needing a good story to go with it.  Otherwise, if you're just a rich Cuban whose family fled Castro a while back.. no URM for you.

And if you check nothing, they are going to say "look, it's a white person who wants to keep us guessing."  I don't know a lot of URM's who say "just in principle I will not identify myself."

I still think you should do the year at LSE.  London weather is not as bad as everyone makes it out to be, and it's a great place to live for a year, and you meet some amazing people at LSE from all over the world (children of Presidents, African royalty, world-famous professors, etc. etc. etc.).  It's one year during which time you can reevaluate your committment to law AND you will have an impressive MSc.  And if you want to resit your LSAT they offer it over there anyway.


I almost didn't indicate that I'm Mexican-American, for the principle that I wanted to get in on my own "merit".
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 27, 2005, 04:18:20 PM
[quote author=Dustin Hoffman, Jr.
Congratuations!  I've heard that LSE is very difficult to get into.  Some person on xoxoth said they were rejected in spite of being a former Fullbright Scholar.  What do you think was most influencial in gaining acceptance there?
Quote

Thank you! I'm not sure what the deciding factor was; their application didn't allow us to send much information.  I had great LORs and honors from my university, though, which I hear they like.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Lgirl on February 27, 2005, 04:48:52 PM
To answer the original question, I understand it's betterto say one's ethnicity than not to. I know a student who's now left Boalt  but who was on the adcom, and who said that they preferred to have race and income fully filled in, even if it appeared the applicant is white and financially/socially privileged. According to her, at least this way the person was coming out with who they were and weren't hiding, which is seen as more suspect in her opinion.
I thought it was interesting at the time.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: inla on February 27, 2005, 07:28:01 PM
To answer the original question, I understand it's betterto say one's ethnicity than not to. I know a student who's now left Boalt but who was on the adcom, and who said that they preferred to have race and income fully filled in, even if it appeared the applicant is white and financially/socially privileged. According to her, at least this way the person was coming out with who they were and weren't hiding, which is seen as more suspect in her opinion.
I thought it was interesting at the time.


Hi londongirl returns....just curious you mentioned in an another post you took the lsat four times...isn't the max that you can take the lsat 3 times? thanks...
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: whiteytighty on February 27, 2005, 07:42:22 PM
To answer the original question, I understand it's betterto say one's ethnicity than not to. I know a student who's now left Boalt  but who was on the adcom, and who said that they preferred to have race and income fully filled in, even if it appeared the applicant is white and financially/socially privileged. According to her, at least this way the person was coming out with who they were and weren't hiding, which is seen as more suspect in her opinion.
I thought it was interesting at the time.


It's even more interesting that Boalt is asking applicants about their race so many years after Prop. 209 passed.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: TradeWonk on February 27, 2005, 08:22:38 PM
I've heard you can apply formally for an exemption to the three time limit (that's three times within 5 years or something right?).  I know of someone who got such an exemption.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Lgirl on February 28, 2005, 04:57:11 AM
I got such an exemption!
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 28, 2005, 09:14:45 AM
LSE for economics? or that political science s.hit

the person on XOXO was applying for economics.  everything else there is sh*t.  people who go to LSE not for economics are t.t.t.

For Law and Society
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jennaye on February 28, 2005, 09:22:29 AM
hahahahahahaha.... did they require an lsat? hahahah.  ok i got that out of my system

congrats though

funny! (not)

I think they accept everyone who applies, and then since so few people can afford the f*cking cost of living in London they end up with just the right number of ppl enrolling....
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Jumboshrimps on February 28, 2005, 09:50:28 AM
To answer the original question, I understand it's betterto say one's ethnicity than not to. I know a student who's now left Boalt  but who was on the adcom, and who said that they preferred to have race and income fully filled in, even if it appeared the applicant is white and financially/socially privileged. According to her, at least this way the person was coming out with who they were and weren't hiding, which is seen as more suspect in her opinion.
I thought it was interesting at the time.

I simply don't believe this. If anything, it shows character NOT to report these irrelevant things on an app. They should not be on the app. in the first place, and to fill them in is to conform to a damaging status quo.

If you are white, please leave the race boxes blank. If you are a URM, you'd be a complete idiot to do so.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: rwhitman on February 28, 2005, 10:01:43 AM
UMich doesnt accept everyone that applies... maybe Michigan residents, but I know plenty of good students who were rejected at one or both of those schools (out of state)

in-state at mich undergrad is still tough, i know lots of people who were rejected there.  There's been a lot of news coverage in the last 10 years over in-staters at mich having a lot of trouble getting into their own public school.

can't speak for UVA undergrad.  which hs did you attend, some ritzy private?
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report r
Post by: Lgirl on February 28, 2005, 10:48:03 AM
I agree that they shouldn't be on the app. I also see it as irrelevant, but be that as it may, the question is on the app, and that was the answer the person I know gave me.
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: Jumboshrimps on February 28, 2005, 12:19:17 PM
One could make the case that not checking the box could be helpful. Supose, for example that I was a white person who grew up in Mexico. If I wrote my PS about my youth in Mexico, the adcom might assume I am Hispanic. 
Title: Re: for white applicants is it better to mark "caucasian" or decline to report race?
Post by: Braden on February 28, 2005, 12:28:06 PM
I never mark race (as I do not believe in the idea of race as anything other than a meaningless social classification).However, my name looks like a typical URM name (I do not think it helps me any in the admissions process).