Law School Discussion

Deciding Where to Go => Choosing the Right Law School => Topic started by: tucson on March 24, 2008, 06:36:25 PM

Title: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: tucson on March 24, 2008, 06:36:25 PM
Hi everyone,

Please give me your honest opinion of whether or not this would be really obnoxious.

I received $81,000 over 3 years from Loyola in LA, based on the condition I'm in the top 65 percent of the class.

I also received $69,000 over 3 years from the University of San Diego, based on the condition I'm in the top third of my class.

With the differences in tuition, this means that over three years I would pay $20,000 more to attend USD than Loyola.  Loyola is the higher ranked school.

Despite the fact that USD's scholarship offer was generous, $20 K feels like a lot of money.  Would it be rude for me to ask USD to reconsider the offer?  Also, is there any way for me to negotiate the terms of USD's scholarship without sounding lazy?  Loyola's terms are obviously much more lax.

Thanks!
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Astro on March 24, 2008, 06:49:40 PM
If schools are similarly ranked, or if a higher ranked school gives you a competitive scholarship, it is not only your right but your DUTY to yourself to negotiate for an increased scholarship.

There are a number of ways to do this, but to not do it would be a huge mistake.  Look at it this way: schools are competing for YOU.  You're a valuable commodity.  Play your cards right in that context.  Just be honest but civil.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 24, 2008, 08:46:53 PM
The whole admissions process is a game.  They play the game, and you can too.

As other posters have mentioned, however, you should be very polite with them. They don't "owe" you anything.  However, they often will go out of their way and give you more money if you're nice and explain why they should do so.  (It's worked well for me in some instances.)
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: mconnett on March 25, 2008, 06:08:00 AM
I'm also looking to negotiate. Does anyone have any tips for how best to do it? (e.g. who's the best person to call/email, etc?)
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 25, 2008, 07:03:22 AM
I'm also looking to negotiate. Does anyone have any tips for how best to do it? (e.g. who's the best person to call/email, etc?)

I think emailing is the best thing normally to do, because: one can make a detailed rationale for giving one's self (more) money; it's not as awkward for both parties; and it allows them to think about it.

As for to whom you should send it, it depends on the school.

EDIT: In your email, state that you like the school (and possibly state why you do, with specifics, not generic things that other schools have), but that financial considerations are very important to you.  Also state/give copies of other scholarships if you think that this would help.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: mconnett on March 25, 2008, 08:53:25 AM
Thanks! This is just the kind of advice I was looking for
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 25, 2008, 11:53:20 AM
Thanks! This is just the kind of advice I was looking for

No problem!
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Ulfrekr on March 25, 2008, 12:49:29 PM
Ok, here's a specific question. I applied for the Furman academic scholarship at NYU. Last month, I got an email saying that my scholarship application was going to committee, but that I needed to get my financial aid information in before they could give me a decision. Due to extreme parental foot-dragging, I just got my financial information submitted yesterday. Today, I got a "Thanks, but no thanks" email for the scholarship. It sounds like today was the first day they started sending those out.

I don't know if the fact that it took me so long to get my financial info in could have impacted the decision, or whether I was a remotely competitive applicant in the first place. However, this pretty much closes out any chance I had of going to NYU; I just can't justify the expense, given my other options.

Rather than just withdrawing though, I'm thinking about writing them a letter explaining the specifics of my financial situation and my offers at other schools, as well as making it clear that the length of time it took me to submit my financial information was not a reflection of my interest in either the scholarship or NYU itself. Is this a bad idea? I just don't know how to go about asking a school for money when I've just been rejected for a scholarship that I might not have sufficiently expressed in.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Astro on March 25, 2008, 01:06:12 PM
Ok, here's a specific question. I applied for the Furman academic scholarship at NYU. Last month, I got an email saying that my scholarship application was going to committee, but that I needed to get my financial aid information in before they could give me a decision. Due to extreme parental foot-dragging, I just got my financial information submitted yesterday. Today, I got a "Thanks, but no thanks" email for the scholarship. It sounds like today was the first day they started sending those out.

I don't know if the fact that it took me so long to get my financial info in could have impacted the decision, or whether I was a remotely competitive applicant in the first place. However, this pretty much closes out any chance I had of going to NYU; I just can't justify the expense, given my other options.

Rather than just withdrawing though, I'm thinking about writing them a letter explaining the specifics of my financial situation and my offers at other schools, as well as making it clear that the length of time it took me to submit my financial information was not a reflection of my interest in either the scholarship or NYU itself. Is this a bad idea? I just don't know how to go about asking a school for money when I've just been rejected for a scholarship that I might not have sufficiently expressed in.


If you're safe everywhere else, I don't see how this can hurt.  If they say no or are offended by the fact that you asked, too bad.  You've already got options with which you're satisfied.  And if they change their minds, great!  Now you've got another option.

Do it, but do it quickly.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 25, 2008, 01:55:29 PM
Ok, here's a specific question. I applied for the Furman academic scholarship at NYU. Last month, I got an email saying that my scholarship application was going to committee, but that I needed to get my financial aid information in before they could give me a decision. Due to extreme parental foot-dragging, I just got my financial information submitted yesterday. Today, I got a "Thanks, but no thanks" email for the scholarship. It sounds like today was the first day they started sending those out.

I don't know if the fact that it took me so long to get my financial info in could have impacted the decision, or whether I was a remotely competitive applicant in the first place. However, this pretty much closes out any chance I had of going to NYU; I just can't justify the expense, given my other options.

Rather than just withdrawing though, I'm thinking about writing them a letter explaining the specifics of my financial situation and my offers at other schools, as well as making it clear that the length of time it took me to submit my financial information was not a reflection of my interest in either the scholarship or NYU itself. Is this a bad idea? I just don't know how to go about asking a school for money when I've just been rejected for a scholarship that I might not have sufficiently expressed in.


If you're safe everywhere else, I don't see how this can hurt.  If they say no or are offended by the fact that you asked, too bad.  You've already got options with which you're satisfied.  And if they change their minds, great!  Now you've got another option.

Do it, but do it quickly.


Exactly.  He has a legitimate reason for it.  If they don't understand, then that's a shame. It's their loss, not his.

Good luck!
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Just_Chexin on March 25, 2008, 03:04:51 PM
Are schools usually more or less open to negotiating? I got into the University of Miami and I REALLY want to go there, but the cost is astronomical.  I feel that I would be in-line for their merit based scholarship, but I only got accepted two weeks ago. Unfortunately, after emailing them and asking about scholarship opportunities I was told that they were out of funds.  That sucks - there isn't even any room for negotiating, so now I'm not sure what to do.  I'm wondering if students have better luck at other institutions or if all institutions "run out of funds" by now?
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 25, 2008, 03:11:46 PM
Are schools usually more or less open to negotiating? I got into the University of Miami and I REALLY want to go there, but the cost is astronomical.  I feel that I would be in-line for their merit based scholarship, but I only got accepted two weeks ago. Unfortunately, after emailing them and asking about scholarship opportunities I was told that they were out of funds.  That sucks - there isn't even any room for negotiating, so now I'm not sure what to do.  I'm wondering if students have better luck at other institutions or if all institutions "run out of funds" by now?

It depends on each school.  Some schools are more willing to give out more money.  Others are not.

It is getting late in the cycle, and many schools probably are running out of funds. However, acceptance deadlines are approaching quickly, so more money may be opened up.  (However many schools bank on many people declining their offers, so it may not really be "opened up" for another person.)
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Just_Chexin on March 25, 2008, 04:35:27 PM
Quote
It depends on each school.  Some schools are more willing to give out more money.  Others are not.

It is getting late in the cycle, and many schools probably are running out of funds. However, acceptance deadlines are approaching quickly, so more money may be opened up.  (However many schools bank on many people declining their offers, so it may not really be "opened up" for another person.)

That's what I was afraid of. Originally I was hoping that students who were offered generous amounts of scholarship money but decided to decline the school's offer would put that money back into the "pool". But, I have suspected, as you said, that the school probably banks the money and doesn't pass it along to other qualified students who WOULD accept the money - which seems kinda cheap to me. Bleh.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 25, 2008, 07:17:11 PM
Quote
It depends on each school.  Some schools are more willing to give out more money.  Others are not.

It is getting late in the cycle, and many schools probably are running out of funds. However, acceptance deadlines are approaching quickly, so more money may be opened up.  (However many schools bank on many people declining their offers, so it may not really be "opened up" for another person.)

That's what I was afraid of. Originally I was hoping that students who were offered generous amounts of scholarship money but decided to decline the school's offer would put that money back into the "pool". But, I have suspected, as you said, that the school probably banks the money and doesn't pass it along to other qualified students who WOULD accept the money - which seems kinda cheap to me. Bleh.

It is what it is.  Keep in mind that this is pure conjecture.  I could be right, or I could be wrong. 
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: barrygoodlife on March 25, 2008, 08:32:43 PM
On the subject of obnoxious how about this-- ???

Two law schools in same market offered similar scholarships.  I'm leaning toward one school (also considering one in another part of the US) but figured that calling for more money couldn't hurt. Law School A said, we'll consider raising your award, but only if you withdraw your application from School B and send us a copy of that withdrawal letter as proof.(Didn't ask me to withdraw from the out of area school, just the local one)

Obnoxious? Hard sell? Are they somehow afraid of that second school?
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: Astro on March 26, 2008, 08:51:26 AM
Quote
It depends on each school.  Some schools are more willing to give out more money.  Others are not.

It is getting late in the cycle, and many schools probably are running out of funds. However, acceptance deadlines are approaching quickly, so more money may be opened up.  (However many schools bank on many people declining their offers, so it may not really be "opened up" for another person.)

That's what I was afraid of. Originally I was hoping that students who were offered generous amounts of scholarship money but decided to decline the school's offer would put that money back into the "pool". But, I have suspected, as you said, that the school probably banks the money and doesn't pass it along to other qualified students who WOULD accept the money - which seems kinda cheap to me. Bleh.

It is what it is.  Keep in mind that this is pure conjecture.  I could be right, or I could be wrong. 

It really depends on the school.  Some schools specifically told me to ask again once their deposit deadlines passed because they would have more scholarship money available at that time.  Others, I'm sure, pulled the stunt you just described.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: UnbiasedObserver on March 26, 2008, 08:58:18 AM
On the subject of obnoxious how about this-- ???

Two law schools in same market offered similar scholarships.  I'm leaning toward one school (also considering one in another part of the US) but figured that calling for more money couldn't hurt. Law School A said, we'll consider raising your award, but only if you withdraw your application from School B and send us a copy of that withdrawal letter as proof.(Didn't ask me to withdraw from the out of area school, just the local one)

Obnoxious? Hard sell? Are they somehow afraid of that second school?

If I were you, I wouldn't withdraw from the other school unless they guaranteed you that they would raise their offer.
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: StevePirates on March 26, 2008, 09:51:38 AM
On the subject of obnoxious how about this-- ???

Two law schools in same market offered similar scholarships.  I'm leaning toward one school (also considering one in another part of the US) but figured that calling for more money couldn't hurt. Law School A said, we'll consider raising your award, but only if you withdraw your application from School B and send us a copy of that withdrawal letter as proof.(Didn't ask me to withdraw from the out of area school, just the local one)

Obnoxious? Hard sell? Are they somehow afraid of that second school?

No way, bad idea.  If you withdraw, and that is your intended market then they have you over a barrel.  What schools if you don't mind sharing?  Or which market?
Title: Re: Is this obnoxious? Scholarship Q.
Post by: cantwaitforuva on March 26, 2008, 06:05:12 PM
On the subject of obnoxious how about this-- ???

Two law schools in same market offered similar scholarships.  I'm leaning toward one school (also considering one in another part of the US) but figured that calling for more money couldn't hurt. Law School A said, we'll consider raising your award, but only if you withdraw your application from School B and send us a copy of that withdrawal letter as proof.(Didn't ask me to withdraw from the out of area school, just the local one)

Obnoxious? Hard sell? Are they somehow afraid of that second school?

If you decide that you're more than "leaning toward" that school, then get the offer in writing (even if it's just an email) including the amount of the increase (or at least a range).